FORZA 2 impressions thread

Leadfoot5 · Post by **Leadfoot5** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 1:54 am

Is anyone else having a tough time finding a good difficulty setting for off-line career play? Specifically, the AI strength setting. If I leave it on medium, I win each race by about 3 to 5 seconds... However, if I put it on hard, the AI invariably spins me out. I like the fact that the races are closer on hard, but the cheapness factor has me back on medium, just going through the paces to win the events and unlock the cars... The only negative I have for the game so far...

TCrouch · Post by **TCrouch** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 2:30 am

I set it on Champion when I booted it up and haven't taken it off. If they're spinning you out, you're braking much earlier than necessary, or weaving in your line through a corner. They're very, very good but won't cheapshot you. Save some replays and you'll see that you wiggle more than you realize and that's causing the spinout, or you're trying to put your car where there isn't any room

JRod · Post by **JRod** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 11:15 am

I have now gotten to level 25 in the career mode section. I have driven 813.61 mi (online and offline).

And the problem isn't the cars or the driving model, it's the lack of tracks and variety in the tracks. They have the same amount of real tracks but have added more circuits. Forza 1, I think only had 1 or 2 circuits for a course like Silverstone. Forza 1 had other point-to-point tracks and a few fake circuits. Forza 2 has less than Forza 1. Now, there's been some news that some Forza 1 tracks may be available for download. Knowing MS they are going to cost the user. You will probably get 1 location for 600 points or something stupid like that.

Just for gits and shiggles, TOCA 3 had 30-plus racing locations.

The offline game just doesn't match the standard for a next gen title and really shouldn't get a free pass.

You would think that this game would have 50 plus locations and 75 circuits and variants. It would have helped out the offline mode considerably. If you had picked the European "spoke" then you would race mainly Euro looking tracks. Tracks with a flavor of Monaco, maybe fantasy courses of the Scottish Highlands, Swiss Alps, French Riveria to small English countryside towns and the list goes on. If you picked the American "spoke" you race in everything for Main Street USA tracks to your local Saturday Night Night race. Anything more than the tracks they we have now.

To be fair it doens't have to be entire cities, I think games like PGR, Test Drive and Need for Speed do this extremely well. But forza needs more tracks to really show off the car. I would love to take a Corvette around a fake Indy infield. Or drive the Porche in the Swiss alps.

What bothers me is either the developers of Forza thought they didn't have to add any more tracks and we would be satisfied with the game, or they are using this as a way to make more money through microtransactions. So your $60 game is now $85 to buy the same amount of tracks you bought for an old-gen game that was retailed for $50.

And they are getting away with it. Reviews of this game are glowing. There's no doubt the racing model and amount of cars are impressive. The paint section can be a game by itself. (Although I wouldn't say creating dumb UEFA CUP logos a game The online mode is well done. But it seems the amount of cars you have in a game is directly related to how well your review score is. Who cares if you have 10,000 cars but only have 7 tracks? (The fictional tracks with the snake names are brutally boring IMHO).

I'm bored with the offline portion of the game. Online is another story. To sum up Forza 2 has less tracks than Forza one for more money.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 11:50 am

Didn't you already post that in this thread? It's like Deja Vu.

JRod wrote: After spending a good bit of time with the game. I think the racing model is very good but the features are poor.

To me it's like Pro, Evo except that they did a better job of hiding that they don't have that many courses or variation of modes.

First of the fantasy tracks are not fun for me. The only one I like is the "Autumn" track.

By comparision TOCA had 31 racing locations and 49 tracks. 20 racing locations and 47 tracks.

It just feels that I'm racing the same track over and over again. Online helps a bit because the AI is overly bland.

Sadly I think the equation for a racing title is more cars equal great reviews. And it doens't matter if the career mode and tracks are sub par. There really should be like 50 racing locations and 100 tracks for a next gen racing.

This would have helped the career mode in this game. If you pick Europe as the base, then you should be racing in France, Switzerland, UK, and other places. Same for the other two locations. Even fake locations in a somewhat real world atmosphere would make this game great. Right now, for me atleast it's only good. Not enough tracks to enjoy all the cars.

JRod · Post by **JRod** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 11:56 am

dbdynsty25 wrote:Didn't you already post that in this thread? It's like Deja Vu.

JRod wrote: After spending a good bit of time with the game. I think the racing model is very good but the features are poor.

To me it's like Pro, Evo except that they did a better job of hiding that they don't have that many courses or variation of modes.

First of the fantasy tracks are not fun for me. The only one I like is the "Autumn" track.

By comparision TOCA had 31 racing locations and 49 tracks. 20 racing locations and 47 tracks.

It just feels that I'm racing the same track over and over again. Online helps a bit because the AI is overly bland.

Sadly I think the equation for a racing title is more cars equal great reviews. And it doens't matter if the career mode and tracks are sub par. There really should be like 50 racing locations and 100 tracks for a next gen racing.

This would have helped the career mode in this game. If you pick Europe as the base, then you should be racing in France, Switzerland, UK, and other places. Same for the other two locations. Even fake locations in a somewhat real world atmosphere would make this game great. Right now, for me atleast it's only good. Not enough tracks to enjoy all the cars.

I didn't post this yet, f*** off, I'm posting this again.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 11:58 am

Thought so.

jondiehl · Post by **jondiehl** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 9:53 am

JRod wrote:To sum up Forza 2 has less tracks than Forza one for more money.

It comes down to one thing: DLC (and ultimately, more $$$)

All of those old tracks will make their way to Forza 2, but they pushed it out with the tracks they had finished and are going to give us some of the old ones (and new ones) via DLC.

jondiehl · Post by **jondiehl** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 12:54 pm

TCrouch wrote:I set it on Champion when I booted it up and haven't taken it off.

Those settings take into account the AI difficulty, as well as the rest of the assists and options... sort of a default overall difficulty level (that you can then customize however you want).

What he's referring to is specifically the AI difficulty (Easy, Medium, Hard). I too have left the AI difficulty on Hard, from the start of my career, but most of the races I've done so far I usually have a vehicle that outmatches the AI, so even though they are on Hard, I lap them anyway. Even the endurance race for D class, I didn't have any mixing it up with the AI. Hopefully they'll start to get more competitive deeper in the career mode (although I'm already at level 30 I think).

Online however, the AI are total hacks. My neighbor and I jumped in a room together the other night to run R4 GT3 Porsche Cup cars. To fill the field, we added 6 AI drivers on "Champion" setting. Let me tell you, that was a completely different experience compared to racing the AI in career mode. They hacked the hell out of us and would take their line no matter if you were in front of them or not. In 5 lap races, I had the best hot lap time in the room of 2 humans, 6 AI drivers, but my buddy and I were struggling to even make 5th place because the AI would not let you by without checking you, and if you did manage to pull off a clean pass, they would cornhole you the very next corner.

Perhaps they programmed the AI for online races a little differently to better reflect the online experience?

I dunno, but AI on Hard for regular career mode seems to be beatable and they drive pretty clean from what I can tell so far.

JRod · Post by **JRod** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 1:54 pm

Jon,
I think you are reading too much into it. I bit they simply programmed the AI to run a line and were lazy not to have the AI recognize other cars on the track.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 2:00 pm

JRod wrote:Jon,
I think you are reading too much into it. I bit they simply programmed the AI to run a line and were lazy not to have the AI recognize other cars on the track.

No, that's Gran Tourismo.

Jon is actually right. The AI online is MUUUCH worse than the AI off. Not sure why there is a different, but there is.

JackB1 · Post by **JackB1** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 2:30 pm

Leadfoot5 wrote:Is anyone else having a tough time finding a good difficulty setting for off-line career play? Specifically, the AI strength setting. If I leave it on medium, I win each race by about 3 to 5 seconds... However, if I put it on hard, the AI invariably spins me out. I like the fact that the races are closer on hard, but the cheapness factor has me back on medium, just going through the paces to win the events and unlock the cars... The only negative I have for the game so far...

I have the same exact problem. On medium, I win easily, but on hard, it's real tough. I guess we just have to leave it on hard and work harder?

btmmayor · Post by **btmmayor** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 9:28 pm

JackB1 wrote: I have the same exact problem. On medium, I win easily, but on hard, it's real tough. I guess we just have to leave it on hard and work harder?

This is actually a huge problem for me. In the offline portion of this game I am finding no racing and its killing my enjoyment of the game. If the AI is on medium I kill them. If its on hard I lose until I upgrade my car and then I kill them.

I think I'm starting to remember why I dumped the original Forza about a week after I bought it.

Slumberland · Post by **Slumberland** » Fri Jun 08, 2007 9:20 am

Yeah, offline the game seems to be about car collecting, designing, upgrading, track memorization, etc. The real racing happens online, I guess. Every once in a while the planets align and that car/difficulty combos make for a good offline career race, but even when that fails, the pokemon-like rush of winning cars and customizing them is too good to pass up.

Jumped into a random room last night and raced against some really friendly brits, good racing. All sort of different cars with different strengths... I spent the whole race in second, better on the turns than the leader but he had more power on the straightaways. He made one mistake near the end that should have been fatal but he did a good job of not letting me pass without being cheap about it.

As these games get better I get closer and closer to caring a little bit about car culture.

Post by **ScoopBrady** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 1:18 am

The more I play this game the less I like it. I'm getting frustrated by the handling of the cars. I freely admit that I suck at this game but I have not improved in a week. I have more fun painting cars than racing them. I'd rather pop in TDU to race. At this point I'm glad I Gamefly'd this one. I don't remember ever having this much of a problem with Forza.

JRod · Post by **JRod** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 4:28 am

ScoopBrady wrote:The more I play this game the less I like it. I'm getting frustrated by the handling of the cars. I freely admit that I suck at this game but I have not improved in a week. I have more fun painting cars than racing them. I'd rather pop in TDU to race. At this point I'm glad I Gamefly'd this one. I don't remember ever having this much of a problem with Forza.

What about the handling frustrates you?

I have problems with some cars but not all. I'm like you the more I drive with the cars I want a little more out of the game. I'm not talking about the extras I've mentioned before. I think the sense of speed is off. I also think the cars feel too heavy.

I can fly around in a Nissan Z but I can't drive a Corvette. Rear wheel drives with the engine in the back are death for me. Now I can drive most S's through the R1s if I really pay attention to how I accelerate. Too fast and I'll spin out.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 4:33 am

JRod wrote:I can fly around in a Nissan Z but I can't drive a Corvette. Rear wheel drives with the engine in the back are death for me.

So you can't drive front-engine rear wheel drives either?

Spooky · Post by **Spooky** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 7:50 am

I am having the opposite reaction to this game. The more I play it the more comfortable I am getting. I now have all assists off (even the braking line) and am really beginning to feel it much better. Hell, I may even be able to actually compete for the middle pack in a race or two now.

Sure, different cars handle WAY differently, but it usually seems to boil down to figuring out just how quickly or carefully you have to accelerate out of a turn with each different car.

The other thing that I actually really like is the limited number of tracks. This game really requires the player to learn the tracks and if there were too many it would make that much tougher. I am starting to recognize little things on each track that make me able to drive them much better out of repetition.

Naples39 · Post by **Naples39** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 11:20 am

dbdynsty25 wrote:
JRod wrote:I can fly around in a Nissan Z but I can't drive a Corvette. Rear wheel drives with the engine in the back are death for me.
So you can't drive front-engine rear wheel drives either?

That makes three of us. I have recently resorted to putting STM on when driving rear wheel drives because I simply can't get around some tracks otherwise (otherwise I leave only the braking line on). I know it often occurs by accelerating too aggressively which I am getting better at, but it also happens to me a lot during changes in elevation, or even if I cut the wheel too sharply on entering a corner. Are RWD cars really that much more prone to spinning in such situations when I'm only braking or coasting? I basically never spin a FWD or AWD.

JRod · Post by **JRod** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:41 pm

I thought the Corvette had the engine in the back. Maybe it's just mid.

That's the only car I cannot drive.

Slumberland · Post by **Slumberland** » Mon Jun 11, 2007 9:33 am

Any tips for driving with the wheel? I love how immersive it is, but last night I was running races with both controller and wheel and I was ridiculously faster with the controller. Just seems like my brakes are constantly locking up when using the pedals, and my tires are constantly spinning. Is that rubber ball trick I read about the way to go?

mixdj1 · Post by **mixdj1** » Mon Jun 11, 2007 11:19 am

Slumberland wrote:Any tips for driving with the wheel? I love how immersive it is, but last night I was running races with both controller and wheel and I was ridiculously faster with the controller. Just seems like my brakes are constantly locking up when using the pedals, and my tires are constantly spinning. Is that rubber ball trick I read about the way to go?

It takes several days to really get comfortable with the wheel and start beating your controller lap times (for me at least). But the one thing I did that really helped was to buy a $1.97 car wash sponge from Walmart and cut a piece that just fit behind the brake pedal. It adds a lot of resistance and really helps you avoid locking the brakes.

The other thing to do is make sure you've got a stable and comfortable setup for the wheel. I used Terry's advice and attached the wheel to a toddler table. Then I made an wedge shaped platform for the pedals to get a more natural angle. And yesterday I took a hacksaw to a steel folding chair to get it just the right height for the table/pedal setup. Obviously you don't need to do all of that but it sure made using the wheel a lot more comfortable.

Slumberland · Post by **Slumberland** » Mon Jun 11, 2007 11:26 am

Thanks! Fun racing with you on Saturday night...

Teal · Post by **Teal** » Mon Jun 11, 2007 11:38 am

mixdj1 wrote:
Slumberland wrote:Any tips for driving with the wheel? I love how immersive it is, but last night I was running races with both controller and wheel and I was ridiculously faster with the controller. Just seems like my brakes are constantly locking up when using the pedals, and my tires are constantly spinning. Is that rubber ball trick I read about the way to go?
It takes several days to really get comfortable with the wheel and start beating your controller lap times (for me at least). But the one thing I did that really helped was to buy a $1.97 car wash sponge from Walmart and cut a piece that just fit behind the brake pedal. It adds a lot of resistance and really helps you avoid locking the brakes.

The other thing to do is make sure you've got a stable and comfortable setup for the wheel. I used Terry's advice and attached the wheel to a toddler table. Then I made an wedge shaped platform for the pedals to get a more natural angle. And yesterday I took a hacksaw to a steel folding chair to get it just the right height for the table/pedal setup. Obviously you don't need to do all of that but it sure made using the wheel a lot more comfortable.

geeks...

If it weren't so damn expensive, I'd have the wheel and some ridiculous setup, too...

Slumberland · Post by **Slumberland** » Mon Jun 11, 2007 11:42 am

I traded in my poor little Gamecube for $30 at Gamestop to take the edge off.

Teal · Post by **Teal** » Mon Jun 11, 2007 11:45 am

Slumberland wrote:I traded in my poor little Gamecube for $30 at Gamestop to take the edge off.

That'd be the ticket if I had anything like that to trade off. I suppose I could trade in some old games, but old games don't bring much. Eh, what am I talking about?! I haven't even bought Forza yet-it still belongs to Gamefly at the moment. Probably need to rectify that first...