Willingham out at ND.

fsquid · Post by **fsquid** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 2:47 pm

Its up at ESPN.com.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 2:55 pm

Why'd they wait so long?

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 2:56 pm

And Butch Davis...thoughts Abner?

fsquid · Post by **fsquid** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 3:01 pm

that's Urban Meyer's job in South Bend.

jLp vAkEr0 · Post by **jLp vAkEr0** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 3:04 pm

What!!
Why? I mean.... ugh....

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 3:05 pm

javi wrote:What!!
Why? I mean.... ugh....

Umm...Notre Dame sucks. Why ask why?

fsquid · Post by **fsquid** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 3:13 pm

dbdynsty25 wrote:
javi wrote:What!!
Why? I mean.... ugh....
Umm...Notre Dame sucks. Why ask why?

drink Bud Dry??

Parker · Post by **Parker** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 3:18 pm

Could be as few as 2 African-American coaches next season.

Bill_Abner · Post by **Bill_Abner** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 3:19 pm

dbdynsty25 wrote:And Butch Davis...thoughts Abner?

Had to go. Davis may be a great college recruiter but he's a terrible game day coach (I mean rotten) and one of the worst judges of NFL talent I have ever seen. Combine those two redeeming features with his insistance on being both head coach and GM and he had to go.

The Browns have had some of the worst drafts over the past few years. Couch wasn't his fault and nor was Courtney Brown (Brown is more of a bad luck pick because he's always hurt).

But Davis drafted:

-3rd pick overall DT Gerard Warren who flat out sucks (We could have had Ladanian Tomlinson but no..we wanted this fat ass. Warren is literally stealing his $)
-19th pick overall C Jeff Faine who is terribly average, at best
-16th pick overall RB William Green who is a decent back but not a star
-He wasted a 3rd round pick in a center who never sees the field (thus he had to draft Faine)
-He used a 5th round pick to draft a LONG SNAPPER. Seriously. A Long Snapper.
-He wasted a 2nd round pick on a OLB from West Texas A&M who is still learnng how to play football.
-This season with Winslow and Sean Jones getting hurt not ONE player from the draft made a contribution to the Browns in 2004. None. Zero. He also traded up ONE SPOT to get Winslow and gave up a 2nd round pick to do it. Davis was played, by all people, Matt Millen.

In 4 drafts, Davis has made only a handful of picks that are noteworthy:

4th rnd CB Anthony Henry
5th rnd MLB Andra Davis
4th rnd RB Lee Suggs
3rd round FS Chris Crocker

Add ALL of that with the fact that we never bring any significant FAs (Garcia and Ryan Tucker and Ross Verba being the exceptions) and you have a 3-8 team that needs a new leader.

I hate starting over again, but this absolutely needed to happen.

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 3:22 pm

Parker wrote:Could be as few as 2 African-American coaches next season.

Yeah I am surprised jessie jackson or someone hasn't come out of the woodwork yet screaming.

fsquid · Post by **fsquid** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 3:24 pm

Saunders will carry this flag

Leebo33 · Post by **Leebo33** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 3:28 pm

fsquid wrote:that's Urban Meyer's job in South Bend.

Ara, Urban

Urban, Ara

AcemanPR · Post by **AcemanPR** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 3:32 pm

Now Michigan State needs to fire John L. Smith and hire Ty.

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 3:39 pm

javi wrote:What!!
Why? I mean.... ugh....

Because Notre Dame has been nothing but mediocre the last two seasons and is going nowhere as a football program, that's why. It no longer is a national football power -- on the field, at least. It always will be a national titan with the media and TV networks.

ND also has a very large, impatient alumni base around the nation.

But I'm sure the race card will be played by some "national activist ... "

Out,
PK

jLp vAkEr0 · Post by **jLp vAkEr0** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:04 pm

pk500 wrote:
javi wrote:What!!
Why? I mean.... ugh....
Because Notre Dame has been nothing but mediocre the last two seasons and is going nowhere as a football program, that's why.

Out,
PK

And of course this is all Ty's fault right?

He didn't even get the chance to bring more players that could fit HIS system. Ty's a west coas t offense guy, but didn't have the personel to consisntently run it. I think he was starting to turn things around for the program. I mean, 3 years, 1 BCS appereance and you get wacked?

Yes, It's ND, but come one, considering Bob Davie left the program almost in ruins, you had to give Ty some credit.

Oh well.

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:21 pm

javi wrote:I think he was starting to turn things around for the program. I mean, 3 years, 1 BCS appereance and you get wacked?

Find Frank Solich for a chat if you really want to identify a victim in the college coaching ranks.

Out,
PK

Leebo33 · Post by **Leebo33** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:27 pm

Is it known for sure if he was "whacked"? Chris Fowler was saying on ESPN Radio that he heard rumors that Ty was snooping around Seattle last week. Apparently, his family doesn't like South Bend and he may have underestimated the tremendous pressure associated with coaching Notre Dame. Fowler also said that he felt that Ty may not have even wanted the job in the first place, but was somewhat pressured into taking it by some of his peers since it was so high profile and he is African-American.

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:29 pm

javi wrote:
pk500 wrote:
javi wrote:What!!
Why? I mean.... ugh....
Because Notre Dame has been nothing but mediocre the last two seasons and is going nowhere as a football program, that's why.

Out,
PK
And of course this is all Ty's fault right?

He didn't even get the chance to bring more players that could fit HIS system. Ty's a west coas t offense guy, but didn't have the personel to consisntently run it. I think he was starting to turn things around for the program. I mean, 3 years, 1 BCS appereance and you get wacked?

Yes, It's ND, but come one, considering Bob Davie left the program almost in ruins, you had to give Ty some credit.

Oh well.

It has been a long time since ND was a national power, that is no excuse to fire TY. What is a reason to fire Ty is that his offense was unbearable to watch. Still I don't think he was given enough time and with the schedule ND plays nowadays I do not see ND ever coming back to the glory days if they keep playing that schedule of theirs. They need to cut down on how many rivals they have, settle in a conference (where you get a few easy "W"'s) and then they might just get back to where they want to be.

Even Bob Davie said on ESPN Radio that 3 years was not enough time (he just left out the part of Ty having to clean up his mess). This has nothing to do with race, though I am sure Jessie or someone will speak out. Ty's biggest problem is had too good of a first year leaving an even more bitter taste in the fans mouths the past two years. They are even talking about campus demonstrations at South Bend due to the inability of the football team to win. Ahh what a simpler time when people protested things that really mattered like war.

But before we feel to bad for Ty lets not forget Frank Solich at Nebraska was fired after going 9-3.

Edit: Just noticed PK mentioned Solich, so he get extra points.

XXXIV · Post by **XXXIV** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:41 pm

ND hung on to Faust longer and he was worse than Ty.

NBC is calling the shots now baby.

$$$$$$$$$ talks honor walks.

jLp vAkEr0 · Post by **jLp vAkEr0** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:46 pm

They can keep changing coaches every few years, but if you don't give them a chance to coach and train THEIR recuits for the system HE wants to run for a atleast acouple of years, then the cycle will never end at ND.

bkrich83 · Post by **bkrich83** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:54 pm

javi wrote:They can keep changing coaches every few years, but if you don't give them a chance to coach and train THEIR recuits for the system HE wants to run for a atleast acouple of years, then the cycle will never end at ND.

Exacrly. And you could see progress being made at ND under Willingham. You don't just flip from a option hybrid offense to the WCO in a year. Doesn't make any sense. Some other school is gonna get a very good head coach in Ty.

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 5:02 pm

bkrich83 wrote:
javi wrote:They can keep changing coaches every few years, but if you don't give them a chance to coach and train THEIR recuits for the system HE wants to run for a atleast acouple of years, then the cycle will never end at ND.
Exacrly. And you could see progress being made at ND under Willingham. You don't just flip from a option hybrid offense to the WCO in a year. Doesn't make any sense. Some other school is gonna get a very good head coach in Ty.

Maybe a swap.

Urban Meyer to ND

Ty to Utah (well we can always dream)

By the way raise your had if you honestly knew who Urban Meyer was before the year started.

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 5:09 pm

bkrich83 wrote:Exacrly. And you could see progress being made at ND under Willingham.

Honestly, who would want this job? Unrealistic pressure to recruit big-name players and unrealistic expectations from a rabid alumni base. No guarantee of job security even if you're 10-3 in your first year.

Any ND football coach really better have a hell of an appetite for a challenge and also have a masochism fetish.

Take care,
PK

bkrich83 · Post by **bkrich83** » Tue Nov 30, 2004 5:10 pm

bdoughty wrote:
bkrich83 wrote:
javi wrote:They can keep changing coaches every few years, but if you don't give them a chance to coach and train THEIR recuits for the system HE wants to run for a atleast acouple of years, then the cycle will never end at ND.
Exacrly. And you could see progress being made at ND under Willingham. You don't just flip from a option hybrid offense to the WCO in a year. Doesn't make any sense. Some other school is gonna get a very good head coach in Ty.
Maybe a swap.

Urban Meyer to ND

Ty to Utah (well we can always dream)

By the way raise your had if you honestly knew who Urban Meyer was before the year started.

I did just because I saw his Utah team dismantle SDSU last year, and he recruited me when he was the receivers coach at Colorado St.