Just watched the Madden Challenge 2003.

Badgun · Post by **Badgun** » Fri May 28, 2004 7:01 pm

With the G4/Tech TV merge, we are finally getting some of that G4 programming and I saw my first episode of "Sweat" today, G4's show about sports games. I had heard they would be previewing the new football games, but what they actually showed was last year's Madden Challenge where someone would win 50 grand.

Basically they picked it up at the round of 8 in Las Vegas. Hehe, I can't tell you how many of the games were Falcons vs. Falcons, but it was most of them. I think one guy used Tampa Bay and one guy used Pittsburgh...the rest used the Falcons.

What I couldn't get over was the guy that called the same play practically every frigging down. Some kind of long pass from Vick to Finneran that worked EVERY time. Not as much running with Vick as I would have expected, some of these guys were just idiots. Going for two when a kick would tie and stupid stuff like that. I'm sure they were good and maybe their l33t skills just didn't show well on tv, but it looked like to me if someone played a little defense, they could kill these guys. Unless of course, this play was a money play.

Anyway, the guy that won looked like some playground bully from my childhood days. I thought the show was fun to watch, but I don't know how good these guys really were.

It was also puzzling why they played the games on the PS2 since the Xbox version looked so much better.

Pretty cool show and they had some NFL stars there as well.

Post by **ScoopBrady** » Fri May 28, 2004 10:01 pm

Yeah, I saw that Madden Challenge joke when it aired originally. Talk about a f#cking cheesefest. That made me truly realize how far Madden is from being a good sim. It sure is fun to play with the right person or against the cpu but until they majorly lower the completion percentage of scrambling quarterbacks or majorly lower the completion percentage of balls thrown into tight, double, or triple coverage the Madden Challenge will always be a joke.

XXXIV · Post by **XXXIV** » Fri May 28, 2004 10:13 pm

ScoopBrady wrote:Yeah, I saw that Madden Challenge joke when it aired originally. Talk about a f#cking cheesefest. That made me truly realize how far Madden is from being a good sim. It sure is fun to play with the right person or against the cpu but until they majorly lower the completion percentage of scrambling quarterbacks or majorly lower the completion percentage of balls thrown into tight, double, or triple coverage the Madden Challenge will always be a joke.

Ditto......

bkrich83 · Post by **bkrich83** » Fri May 28, 2004 11:19 pm

Talk about a f#cking cheesefest. That made me truly realize how far Madden is from being a good sim

Been saying this for years, Madden is no where near the ultimate sim, some people try to tout it as. But you're right with the right opponent/friend it still is a lot of fun.

Kazuya · Post by **Kazuya** » Sun May 30, 2004 3:53 pm

The comments on this thread are pretty ignorant. The problem isn't Madden, it's the conditions of the tournament. I've been to and competed in the King of the Couch tournaments in Texas, and believe me there is no game on earth that would stand up very well in such a setting. You put a bunch of nerds who play the game 24/7 in a room with cash at stake, and you are going to get the cheapest strategies and plays in the game. It wouldn't be any different with ESPN or Fever or whatever... the games don't even resemble football. My friends and I enjoy both Madden and ESPN in a relaxed setting, but believe me if a zillion dollars were at stake I would play both games a lot differently and it wouldn't be pretty. I would never punt on either game, the odds of completing a pass are too high compared to the NFL.

As far as why they used the PS2 versions, I suspect it would be pretty obvious. Madden PS2 outsells Madden Xbox by a tremendous margin and it's a no-brainer to pick the version that everyone is going to be familiar with the controls on. At King of the Couch, all games are played on PS2.

Post by **ScoopBrady** » Sun May 30, 2004 4:10 pm

Kazuya wrote:The comments on this thread are pretty ignorant. The problem isn't Madden, it's the conditions of the tournament.

Just how are the comments in this thread ignorant? The problem IS Madden not the conditions of the tournament. Of course with money on the line people are going to do whatever it takes to win the game. My point (and maybe others) is the fact that cheese works in Madden and it shouldn't. Here's some things that need to be worked on to prevent the Madden challenge from being a cheesefest and bring some credibitlity to the event IMO.

1. If a player runs the same play for the third time in a row than the chances of it's success should plummet to around 10%.

2. If a player drops back 20 steps and lets one loose the chances of a completion should be 20-30%.

3. If a player is scambling with the quarterback all over the backfield the chances of a completion should be 20-30% and the chances of a sack should be 60-70%.

4. Players staying in the pocket with their quarterback and getting rid of the ball quickly should be rewarded for doing so with an increase in success. Players that stay in the pocket but hold on to the ball too long should either be sacked more often or have their completion percentage drop as a result of the pressure put on their quarterback. Players that leave the pocket and hold on to the ball too long should have minimal success at all.

5. When throwing into double or triple coverage, a quarterbacks completion percentage should be drastically lower than it currently is in Madden. Interceptions and blocks should be much more prevelent as well.

As stated, Madden is a very fun game against the cpu or somebody who plays a straight up game of football, but the fact that players can play like they do in the Madden Challenge and other such tournaments and have great success is a detriment to the game not the player of the game.

wco81 · Post by **wco81** » Sun May 30, 2004 4:15 pm

I've set up my Tivo to record a bunch of these Sweat shows but they haven't yet.

I've heard stories about these Madden tournaments. There are "professional" Madden players who play for fairly high stakes (way higher than you would imagine someone wagering on a video game).

They are suppose to have amazing stick control and will use one play and often goal line defenses or jacked up defenses which they could manipulate into getting maximum pressure (nanu blitzes). It isn't that they're using money plays so much as the fact that they can do things which most players can't. Considering the momentum in Madden which makes player control difficult, it is a kind of a skill.

And I agree that if ESPN or any other game had the market share instead of Madden, these guys would compete using whichever game most people played. If not video games, some of these guys would be hustling cards or something else.

FloridaGators · Post by **FloridaGators** » Sun May 30, 2004 4:37 pm

Does ESPN have a similar tournament to the Madden challenge?

Kazuya · Post by **Kazuya** » Sun May 30, 2004 5:59 pm

ScoopBrady wrote:Just how are the comments in this thread ignorant? The problem IS Madden not the conditions of the tournament. Of course with money on the line people are going to do whatever it takes to win the game. My point (and maybe others) is the fact that cheese works in Madden and it shouldn't. Here's some things that need to be worked on to prevent the Madden challenge from being a cheesefest and bring some credibitlity to the event IMO.

You're absolutely right, but you miss the point. There isn't a game you could name that "cheese" doesn't work in. The problem isn't Madden, it's trying to build a tournament around Madden or any other game that isn't made for such things. No game would hold up under such conditions, because playing the game to win is completey different than playing it the way it was intended to be played. Sega, EA and everyone else are more concerned with putting in features they think their customers would enjoy. This in turn upsets play balance.

Kazuya · Post by **Kazuya** » Sun May 30, 2004 6:11 pm

wco81 wrote:They are suppose to have amazing stick control and will use one play and often goal line defenses or jacked up defenses which they could manipulate into getting maximum pressure (nanu blitzes). It isn't that they're using money plays so much as the fact that they can do things which most players can't. Considering the momentum in Madden which makes player control difficult, it is a kind of a skill.

Precisely. These guys are good, make no mistake. It's all they do. But they realize there is a difference between trying to win and playing the game as it was meant to be played. These guys are good enough to do it either way, but they know how to win. If you were to play them in their living room, they would probably sit down and play you right. That's what turned me off to these tournaments, they just aren't any fun. I mean, if you commit one turnover against some of these guys, you're done. They will sit there and milk the clock with their money plays and using up the entire clock to call plays.

Post by **ScoopBrady** » Sun May 30, 2004 7:31 pm

I guess there probably isn't a game out there that would stand up to that kind of test but that's what I'm hoping for. I'd love to see 2 settings in football games. One that you could get away with cheese for those who like nachos and one that you need to play straight up ball to be successful. Alas, I know that will never happen

koebner69 · Post by **koebner69** » Sun May 30, 2004 10:05 pm

Mind you,they don't use any slider alterations in the Madden Challenge,either.Like almost all sports games it is an easy scorefest "out of the box".