Nascar 2011 The Game

[fletcher21]

I picked this up today along with Tiger. I have yet to play it yet. I went with the 360 version. Who all is playing this game? Is the 360 version the one to get, or should I return it for the PS3?

[Rodster]

Dude post impressions ASAP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm going with the 360 version. I need to email Modells.com cause I pre-ordered this game for $36.

[fletcher21]

There is a big thread on OS that's over 1,000 replies long. Here's what I've gathered so far:

Great graphics, sense of speed and handling
A lot of bugs (just like F1 2010)
Online is 100% FUBAR until a patch


Seems like the game has a solid foundation, but it will take at least 1 patch to fix it. Sucks for me, since I do not have Live anymore. I am going to have to get a Live account again just to get the patches.

[Rodster]

Thanks Fletch, I just emailed Modells regarding my pre-order, I hope it doesn't get cancelled.

[Rodster]

I just got an email response from Modell's that they are going to honor my pre-order. It's on back-order and they should get a shipment this week.

[dbdynsty25]

You seriously must work for modells...no one gives a s*** and you bring the damn store name into every thread!

Not one time have I said to myself...good, I'm glad rod is getting his pre-order from Modells. That is a great company.

In fact, I will never buy from Modells just out of spite for you!

[TCrouch]

Copied/Pasted from the OS thread:

Spent an hour with it at lunch. I'm decidedly undecided.

The good parts:

The handling is pretty good. It's a bit on the easy side once you're at speed. I could bobble down onto the apron at Daytona and it wouldn't break loose or wiggle at all. Try that in NR2003 and your traction will be gone faster than a fart in a whirlwind. It is very easy to correct when you overcook it into a corner or press too much.

With both a wheel and a controller, I was able to put the car where I wanted it and held a very smooth line around Indianapolis (even with the controller). I didn't tweak a single setting for controls and it was very smooth with both the pad and the wireless 360 wheel.

It sure is pretty, and I like the cockpit1 camera quite a bit. Gives me just enough peripheral vision out the side windows to know who's even with me. Not sure what I think of that crosshair thing at the bottom with the cars zipping about, however, as my wheel obstructs my vision to it easily at my desk, so I have to sit up really high to see it...then wreck when I had to take my eyes off where I was going.

The bump drafting from AI cars is pretty believable. They didn't cream me at Daytona, but they hit me hard enough to create some wiggle and force me to correct. That was good stuff.

Now, the bad:

The AI half the time I've raced them so far (Texas, Bristol, Indy, and Daytona). At Indy and Daytona, they raced pretty well, but they still had the old school "bunch up at corner entry or exit" way too much. I remember Blue saying that they'd do that at the start, but this is like dropping 50mph coming off of turn 4 at Texas or Bristol. If you're anywhere near them, you're going to destroy them and you, because you'll either overcorrect trying to miss them and send it into a spin, or plow right into them and kill you both. This happened a ton at Texas, and then a ton at Bristol on Very Hard AI with Legend settings and manual tranny. It was enough that I cancelled both races at those tracks because the AI was just way too slow in or out of the corner. That's the trademark of "first gen" AI that really shows its warts sometimes. They were pretty good at Indy and Daytona, so maybe the problems rely entirely on their braking ability and negotiating mile-and-a-half and smaller tracks.

Yellow flags. At both of the problem tracks I ran, I would get tossed into a spin or wreck and NO YELLOW WOULD FLY. This has been reported over and over, but I wrecked probably 10 times in the first two races just getting the feel for it, and I got a yellow twice...despite stopping dead center in the track. They completely ignored solo-car spins or stops, which is what's causing the issue. If another car hit me, it MIGHT pull out a yellow. If TWO more cars hit me, it definitely would. So they are way too lenient with it. They should be tossing out yellows for cars off the pace that can't make it to Pit Road and things like that (impossible to do with no DNFs though). This will have to get fixed or it's going to really piss a lot of people off.

The interface itself is way too clunky. You go to Single Player--load screen. You pick a car--load screen. You set race options, and you're taken to controls. Choose those--another load screen. You suddenly appear on track with no clue what's going on, and then you realize it's a qual session. Finish that--load screen to rolling start in the race.

Just way too many loading sessions and abrupt in-or-out sequences to make it smooth.

At this point, I really don't know. I *think* I like the handling, but it's tough to tell when I have to spend half the corner out of the throttle and putt-putting through turn 2 or 4 to make sure I don't annihilate anybody, or blow by 10 cars on an exit because I'm planning for it and dive down to the apron at mach IV just to avoid the train of idiotic AI drivers.

I think there may be a really good game under here, but my first impression after an hour is decidedly less impressed than I hoped I would be. AI and Yellow Flag implementation are some of the biggest things in NASCAR, so for them to be the two things I'm most unhappy with after my first session, that's not a good thing for me.

[Rodster]

You seriously must work for modells...no one gives a s*** and you bring the damn store name into every thread!

Not one time have I said to myself...good, I'm glad rod is getting his pre-order from Modells. That is a great company.

In fact, I will never buy from Modells just out of spite for you!

Thanks for your Modells impressions now how about the game.

Modell CEO

[DChaps]

Spent an hour with it at lunch. I'm decidedly undecided............I think there may be a really good game under here, but my first impression after an hour is decidedly less impressed than I hoped I would be. AI and Yellow Flag implementation are some of the biggest things in NASCAR, so for them to be the two things I'm most unhappy with after my first session, that's not a good thing for me.

Thanks for the quick impressions Terry. It was probably wishful thinking that this could possibly give us the console version of NR2003. As much as I love iRacing, I still miss the AI racing in NR2003. They were not perfect, but you could get enjoyable, believeable racing at all tracks.

Would love to hear your online impressions as well. I guess I will have to start cheking out the OS forums more frequently. Thanks for posting this over here.

[TCrouch]

No problem. Same thing I wanted, too...new cars, new season, new rule set, etc.

That wasn't even in the game. It's the 2010 season, and the old points system, and the 2011 "Free DLC" won't be out until like May or June, when we're 15 races into the season. Makes no sense.

But I'm about to log some serious laps with it tonight to hopefully get a better understanding of it. I'm hoping I was just rushed and driving like an idiot or something and seeing things that I wouldn't see under *normal* circumstances.

[GB_Simo]

I'm hoping I was just rushed and driving like an idiot or something and seeing things that I wouldn't see under *normal* circumstances.

Given that I've seen you do that exactly once - and who said you can't bump draft an IndyCar anyway? Not I... - it seems a bit unlikely, but I'm looking forward to more impressions, mate.

There are two things I'm particularly keen to know, because this thing isn't getting a PAL release and I'm going to have to go down the import route if it's worth having. First up, you mentioned the AI racing pretty well at Daytona - is it a decent representation of a restrictor plate race, working the draft and all that, or have they loused it up and let you drive away from the field the way EA used to? Secondly, are the AI capable of getting around more than one corner of a road course without a mass pile up taking place?

[TCrouch]

My first race of the night was hilariously bad. It was pretty fun for a bit...did a 20% length at Daytona to start my career.

I qual'd on the pole without any setup tweaks on a plate track...but it was by .1, so it was within the realm of believability.

The bump drafting works pretty well when you're in the thick of it. You really have to keep your car straight if you're the lead car or they'll send you all sorts of sideways. They try to bump draft down the front stretch, which is madness, though. I got wrecked twice when I wasn't quite lined up perfectly with the car behind me, which then send me straight into the outside row. They have 5 rewinds, which is nice on a 40 lapper at Daytona lol

But after a while, I was pulling away, sadly. The fact that I could AT ALL sucked. But then I blinked and brushed the wall, beating up my RF. That let them reel right back in and start pounding on me again. At one point I decided to stick to the low line and I got steamrolled by 7 cars in a row, which was nice. Then it lasted all of about 1 lap as the overexaggerated draft let me climb right back up on them and blow by a few per corner.

Then the green flag stops started.

First round the AI cars from the outside flew across the inside lane headed for pit road. Caution flag flies.

I pitted under caution (which is completely automated and you don't drive during a yellow or down pit lane, ugh), and came back out in front--despite watching 2 or 3 cars get out first in the "pit stop" movie. Ok, whatever.

Then I proceed to watch 3 cars just drive away from me as they're nose-to-tail and I can't be consistent enough to catch them. That's a plus.

But on the second round of green flag stops, I get a speeding penalty entering, and a pass-through on the next lap. As I'm heading in, some wreck happens and I'm stuck looking at a zoomed out "2nd caution" icon at the top, with cars stopped mid-corner in turn 1. Guys are colliding with each other, cars flying...and it never continues.

After 24 laps of a 40 lap event, I'm bugged and can't even finish. Laughable.

Save your money, Simo. Until this buggy thing gets fixed, there's no point in recommending it to ANYBODY. I'm usually pretty lenient with games that I can have some fun with, so that should tell you something about this one. I haven't really been able to even finish a race yet...utterly ridiculous.

[fletcher21]

Terry, are you playing on PS3? I am playing on 360. I just spent the last hour on the game. I did an 8 lap race at Atlanta, Sears Point, Watkins Glen and Martinsville. I was able to finish every race, and did not see any obvious bugs or glitches. I am racing on the 2nd easiest difficulty level, just to get a feel for the car. I am not sure why, but each race was with only 16 cars. I was able to win all 4 races. There were several caution flags, but it takes a good amount of damage to bring them out sometimes.

While racing at Watkins Glen, I did a little test. I went flying thru the tire barrier in the bus stop. A caution flag came out right away, which was nice. I have everything at default, which I am pretty sure means most or all of the assists are on. I didn't see any "big ones" while racing. If I didn't know about all the issues, I would swear this game is all good to go. I will run into the glitches eventually, but this game is a solid start for the franchise. I see this as the Nascar version of F1 2010. Rough around the edges, but a fun game with a very good future. It may not be 100% realistic, but to guys like me who never played any of the hardcore computer Nascar games, I am having a great time. It has a gritty feel to it, kinda like the movie Days of Thunder in a weird way that I can't explain. All in all, I am happy with the game and am looking forward to playing more. It's hard to make time for it, since I also picked up Tiger today and the MLB season starts Thursday.

[TCrouch]

360 on very hard settings, legends mode, manual tranny.

I retried the race at Daytona and this time turned .75 seconds faster than 2nd place...WITH A GAMEPAD. First game I've ever seen where I'm faster with a gamepad at a plate track.

But I got to the first round of stops, and was too fast entering pit road (again...I'm an idiot I guess). But this time, it FLIPS ME UP IN THE AIR AND I DO A TRIPLE BARREL ROLL IN THE AIR!!!!!

With the car not under my control, the idiot driver floors it, spins out, and plows straight into the front stretch wall...he teleported out there I guess.

No caution flies, and I run out of gas on the ensuing lap.

I give up for the night. I have no idea what to say. I haven't been so livid about an unfinished game like this in years.

I may have to just go with the easier assists to see if it's somehow related. Maybe with the default assists, it is what they "intended". I can totally see it being geared to a non-racer mindset, as I've heard their comments in several interviews that they want guys to just hop in and get that "NASCAR feel", whatever the hell that means. I can't imagine it's what I've been feeling, which is homocidal f*cking tendencies.

[dbdynsty25]

Wow...I want to rent this just to see how bad it is.

Why is it that most racing games are the ones with the biggest bugs? Makes no sense to me really.

[Rodster]

Whew not sounding to good, off to cancel that order.

[TCrouch]

I had an epiphany last night--this thing is designed for the ADD race crowd that wants to hop into a ranked match, blast through 10 laps, and then move on to the next.

The actual RACING is quite good. The cars will take high and low lines and go 3 wide without massive pile ups, and fighting your way through a crowd can be really fun. Taken in a short sprint race, it's a very fun game. But the meat and potatoes of a NASCAR race is the strategy within the pit windows and adjustments. It's like they programmed a football game without any rushing plays put in. They take a major factor of a race and virtually ignore it.

That being said, I quit screaming at it about what it's not, and tried playing it on Hard (instead of Very Hard) and Pro (instead of Legend) controls. The pace of the race slowed down and it was a lot more controlled, and the problem then becomes not destroying the field. Near the end of a full fuel run, my tires had fallen off pretty good, but I'm pretty sure the AI doesn't. They were pushing it deep into a corner and sticking it to the low groove early, and I really pushed it to stay out front. That caused me to eat the tires up, but near the end of the run they're just as fast in and still sticking right around the bottom. I think the tire wear doesn't affect AI cars, but (naturally) with no way to check lap times lap-by-lap for the field, I have no way of proving it. But near the end of a green flag run against the AI on Pro at California, they were actually running about the same speed as me, and I had to pick and choose where I'd make my passes.

It seems to do a pretty good job of knocking you off the pace if you plow a wall, so that's one plus. The in-race adjustments with wedge have a big effect, as I started with a boat of a default setup at Fontana and after 2 stops (they both worked, amazing), I had shaved over a second off of my lap time just by adding bucketloads of wedge to get it to turn. So there is a good mechanical base underneath...it's just some of the very basic stuff with the AI on pit stops throws everything out of whack.

That and it taking control away from you as soon as you hit pit road and not giving it back until you're on the backstretch or the green flag drops (after a caution) makes it very tough to have any sort of strategy other than green flag racing. It's sad, because when I get to actually RACING this thing, I have fun, even with a controller. But something has to be done about the pit stops and non existent Yellow Flags unless 2 or more cars wreck. If you solo spin, you're SOL because no yellow flies.

[Wilk5280]

Whew not sounding to good, off to Modells.com to cancel that order.

There, fixed it for ya.

[DChaps]

If you solo spin, you're SOL because no yellow flies.

This may be giving the Devs way too much benefit of the doubt, but do you suppose that is an actual design decision to discourage the purposeful solo-spin/bring out the yellow scenario that could allow someone to get back in the race and/or not go a lap down?

[TCrouch]

That's possible, but I could see that being a bigger issue online than off. If I'm racing 42 CPU cars and I solo spin, then it shouldn't matter. It should send me to the tail end of the longest line and throw a yellow. Didn't break any NASCAR game before this one, really. Not sure why they'd consciously do that, but it's certainly possible.

[Rodster]

Whew not sounding to good, off to Modells.com to cancel that order.

There, fixed it for ya.

Thanks DB

[fletcher21]

I am having a fun time with the game, even with the issues. I don't have the time/patience/desire to master a game like iRacing, so this game gives me the Nascar fix that I am looking for. I am just wondering if the developers flat out lied to us, or if they just ran out of time in development. They hyped the crash and damage features, but it's laughable.

One thing that really bugs me is how easily the AI can spin you around. I can barely get thru 10 laps at Daytona without someone just ramming me off the track. At that point the race is over for me, since everyone will continue on at 185mph while I am spinning wildly with no hope of catching up.

Is there rubberband AI in the game? I've heard there is, but have not gone more than 10 laps in a race so I don't know.

[Murph]

Is there rubberband AI in the game? I've heard there is, but have not gone more than 10 laps in a race so I don't know.

And more importantly, can it be turned OFF?

[TCrouch]

No there isn't rubberband AI.

Just broken AI. I tried a single race at Bristol last night and got 30 laps in--got tapped in the rear bumper in a corner which sent me skidding onto the apron. Apparently my LF clipped the pit entry cone even though I was headed back toward the front stretch and it immediately gave me a black flag on a pit road entry violation.

Every time I play this, I get more pissed off. I just shelved it until another patch hits. Absolutely pointless.

[J_Cauthen]

I'm really disappointed to see the reaction this game is getting. It and the PS3/Move Tiger Woods PGA Tour 12, were my two most highly anticipated titles of the year. They've both turned out to be busts, pending possible salvaging through patching. I think I'll wait and see how the patch turns out for Nascar 2001 TG before I put in my Gamefly Queue. It looks so sexy in so many way, but with the AI issues you guys are describing, it sounds like an exercise in frustation in its current state.