Why the USA Hates bloody futbol

[Zeppo]

I can't believe I am doing this again . . .

Both will always be niche sports,popular in a few cities and locations and basically unwatched by the nation as a whole.

You know, the same thing could have been said about Professional Football as recently as 50 years ago, forget about 60 or 70 years ago, and indeed the 'national pastime' baseball maybe 100 years ago. Both were 'niche sports', popular as specatator sports only in certain areas of the country (=north east).

And let's not get into the history of pro basketball, which has barely even been around for 60 years. Suffice it to say that the NBA wasn't created because of a great mandate from California or the SW.

[pk500]

Same with NASCAR. A supposed "niche, Southeastern, redneck, moonshine" sport now gets the second-highest TV ratings of any major league sport behind the NFL and draws weekly crowds of 100,000+.

Take care,
PK

[koebner69]

Dream on,footie fans.I knew I would get a rise out of you guys

[RiverRat]

The way I see it, the biggest impediment to soccer in the U.S. is climate and baseball, not basketball.

Soccer has to be a summer sport in this country because nobdoy is going to play soccer in Soldier Field in January. This means you have to compete for sports dollars with baseball. Baseball is played every day in the summer here and in spite of it's lackluster reputation lately, it still draws really well every day of the week. You're not going to fill anything in Soldier Field in the summertime on a regular basis with the Cubs and/or White Sox in town. Same thing goes for St. Louis, Los Angeles, New York, or any other city you can think of except for those places that don't have baseball, like Columbus or Washington.

[pk500]

Dream on,footie fans.I knew I would get a rise out of you guys

It would help if you knew what the hell you were talking about when making your points.

I could only laugh when I saw the "3-4 hour soccer game" argument. Pretty clueless.

Out,
PK

[Zeppo]

Dream on,footie fans.I knew I would get a rise out of you guys

Indeed. Say something that is factually untrue in the midst of a discourse regarding issues some of us care about, and you will be rebutted.

If you have anything substantial to say, or any thoughts of consequence, please share them with us.

Otherwise, keep your fictional version of reality to yourself and let the rest of us enjoy our discussion.

[XXXIV]

I could only laugh when I saw the "3-4 hour soccer game" argument. Pretty clueless.

Out,
PK

Now that be a MOE or a RON?

[reeche]

These things tend to be trend based.... If somehow a very marketable and attractive (I mean that in the broad sense) American soccer star came on the scene then perhaps the trends would change. Without that though Soccer will have a hard time catching on here in a major way.

I think the article for the most part is correct on its points. America already has a lot of sports. It's hard for another one to muscle in when the other's have tradition.

While Soccer Fans might love low scoring affairs, it hasn't been proven that the average or casual American sports wants that on a continual basis. In fact most indicators show the opposite behavior such as the sudden explosion in baseball interest whenever homeruns start surging.

The sport also isn't very dynamic for viewing purposes on television. Football is the perfect example of a sport that was made for TV with all kinds of slow motion replays, reverse angles, etc. It makes the sport seem more alive for casual fans who watch it on TV. Soccer doesn't translate in quite that same manner.

The people on this board are quite unusal in some of their sports tastes and aren't really typical of the sterotypical American Sports Fan. If I was to go around my office and ask people to name any soccer team or any soccer player, it would be quite a while before I hit anybody who could do so. That's not the case with the Big Three obviously and that's what soccer has to overcome.

Not really a fan of the sport myself, but that's mainly because I don't have time to follow the sports I like and add any more to that mix. As I get older I have less and less time for sports and drop them instead of adding them in. I no longer follow college basketball or college football really for those reasons.

[ScoopBrady]

I could only laugh when I saw the "3-4 hour soccer game" argument. Pretty clueless.

Out,
PK

Now that be a MOE or a RON?

If you don't have less on you've got.....

[koebner69]

What a coincidence,all 25 passionate soccer fans in the country in the same place at the same time.You're right - it only seems to take 3 or 4 hours to complete a match.Hey,I'm not begrudging your love for the game,but if the question is why isn't it more popular here,then my less than informed blast should give you an idea of what's behind America's antipathy towards soccer;boredom.

[Jared]

What a coincidence,all 25 passionate soccer fans in the country in the same place at the same time.You're right - it only seems to take 3 or 4 hours to complete a match.Hey,I'm not begrudging your love for the game,but if the question is why isn't it more popular here,then my less than informed blast should give you an idea of what's behind America's antipathy towards soccer;boredom.

Koebner69 = Jim Rome?

[davet010]

Not Jim Rome - he was too literate for that.

[K_Mosley]

Boring is in the eye of the beholder, koebner...

Some may find a 2-1 pitchers' duel in baseball boring; or a 10-7 defensive battle in football. I happen to appreciate more than scoring. I appreciate defense. I appreciate players that contribute in ways that aren't reflected in the score book. I appreciate extraordinary effort that's the product of a player's love for the game; not just the publicity or the money. I love rooting for an underdog. I appreciate great athletes competing at a level that many of us will never attain. I appreciate watching two tactical geniuses trying to out-do each other from the coach's perspective. I appreciate watching players rise to the occasion and make great plays, or two great players or teams squaring off against each other. All of that happens in soccer, as well as baseball, football, basketball, and so on.

There are more soccer fans than you think. And, when this generation of kids - who've grown up playing soccer - become the sports-consuming public, America may very well have another NASCAR-type growth in popularity for soccer. Especially if the National team remains competitive at the international level, and Freddy Adu becomes the star he's detined to become.

To each his own; for me, that includes soccer.

Kevin

[pk500]

What a coincidence,all 25 passionate soccer fans in the country in the same place at the same time.You're right - it only seems to take 3 or 4 hours to complete a match.Hey,I'm not begrudging your love for the game,but if the question is why isn't it more popular here,then my less than informed blast should give you an idea of what's behind America's antipathy towards soccer;boredom.

Actually, ignorance -- like the kind you've shown here in spades -- also has more to do with it than boredom. Plus you seem to be the typical instant-gratification American sports fan: If I can't see scoring right away, f*ck it. What? No TV time outs? How do I get my beer and chips and take a sh*t every 10 minutes without missing a play?

It also doesn't help when morons like Rome -- who have a disturbing influence on young sports fans in this country -- blather on about how dull soccer is when they really don't have a f*cking clue of what they're talking about. They simply don't know the game one bit.

That's an example of limited attention span, no doubt ... Maybe if free Ritalin was offered at soccer games it would be more popular, right, Koeb?

Out,
PK

[rubba19]

I read through the thread, and here are my thoughts.

I loved the analogy of footy and chess. Both are tactical sports, and this is why I believe Americans do not have a following for the sport. Yes, many of us played in our youth and many of our parents watched. But, did everyone get taught the how, what, whys of the tactical aspect of footy? I was lucky because my youth teams were coached by a family that relocated from the UK to Michigan. We used to go to his house and watch old replays of EPL and Bundasliga games on PBS and he explained to a bunch of 10-year olds how to play the game. We were taught to move it around and play the longball into the offensive zone, how to create an offsides trap, through-balls, on-and-on. We practiced these skills all the time.

I have a daughter who played and she was taught none of that. She has no comprehension of the game other that to kick the ball into the net and to pass to players in the same color shirts as here.....a little more but hopefully you get my point. Nothing on tactics.

So what I guess I am getting at it, if most Americans don't REALLY understand the game, why would they watch? It's really too sad, as the rest of the world seems to get it.

Sorry for the long ramble.....

[davet010]

Thing is guys, much as we love you, there are only 15 people in the soccer world who care whether the US loves it or not.

They are...

The 14 chairman of the so-called G14 group of 'big' clubs - because they are greedy scum.

Sepp Blatter, chairman of FIFA. Who is a corrupt, greasy abomination who in any reasonable world would be doing life in a Turkish prison with a pink ribbon tied round his charlie. As he has proved so many times before, he'll ally himself with anyone to increase his power and influence within the game, and go to any lengths to grease his own pocket on the way.

So, you are more than welcome to watch the game, enjoy it and become part of the global football family. But for those of you who sit there and say 'why don't they make rule changes to make it more exciting?' - the reason is that we like it as it is, and don't believe that rule changes should be made just to suit one nation's requirements.

(And a special note to any Man United fans out there - don't answer me back, or I'm posting the 'United in Grief' banner....and you don't want that, now do you ?)

[RiverRat]

Thing is guys, much as we love you, there are only 15 people in the soccer world who care whether the US loves it or not.

That much, I believe. I doubt too many people outside the U.S. spend much time worrying about why soccer doesn't play well in the U.S.

If and when the time ever comes when the U.S. wins the World Cup or even becomes a serious contender (not saying they will, just speculating), I wonder what world reaction will be.

[davet010]

RR

I think that if the US develops a significant talent base as it is progressing at the moment, then everyone will be happy. I think that objections would start to be raised only if the MLS started to introduce different rules to the FIFA norm or whatever, which I understand they are consciously trying to avoid this time.

Part of the issue, I think is that the availability of world soccer to the US gives an instant comparator with your domestic game which only modern technology has been able to provide - and this is a two-edged sword. For while you are able to catch top-class soccer from various leagues on TV/cable quite easily, the quality of your domestic product is, to be honest, so far removed from that such that people who have become enthused by watching the EPL on TV must get completely underwhelmed by going to an MLS game. Having now been exposed to some of these games in full, I can comfortably say that the MLS is, at best, League Division 2 standard (ie the 3rd tier of the English domestic game - home to Simo's beloved Hartlepool..).

So whereas in the past fans would grow to enjoy the domestic game and then begin to chance their arm on the world stage, now prospective fans are already being exposed to the finest that the world has to offer (and Man City) - against which the MLS is naturally not going to look great at the moment, because it is only just developing.

Having typed all that, you can take heart, because last time I looked, you were above us in the FIFA world rankings.

[TheMightyPuck]

Sepp Blatter, chairman of FIFA. Who is a corrupt, greasy abomination who in any reasonable world would be doing life in a Turkish prison with a pink ribbon tied round his charlie.

In America it's "Johnson". Charlie is something entirely different. Damn foreigners Sepp Blatter is, however, a greasy abomination any way you slice it. Isn't he trying to get FIFA to adopt MLS circa 1996 rules?

EDIT--I also disagree about your very low rating of MLS. Although I'm probably talking out of my butt since I'm a huge LA Galaxy fan and haven't seen too much lower division games The argument that many MLS fans use--look at how a team of US MLS players obliterated (1-0 but it was far more one sided) a motivated Mexico last spring and other good results we've had--has a big flaw. MLS has a number of very good players but the salary cap means there are also a number of scrubs. I think we've had this discussion here before. On the other hand, I'd put a healthy Galaxy side up against any d1 team in England. One other problem with the salary cap and the small rosters is that a couple injuries to your good players can really screw things up. Take a look at the Galaxy Wizards game about 3 weeks ago on mlsnet.com. (and realize our best CB has been injured most of the season).

Also, I guarantee anyone a good time at a Galaxy game. Great stadium, good team. It's nowhere near pl quality but it can be damn exciting. If you don't mind drunken fools, profanity, and bloodthirsty cheers when hated opposing players take a knock hang out with me and the riot squad in section 138 at victoria street and I guarantee you will have a new appreciation of MLS. Hell I think I have some free vouchers for a couple games down the stretch. Open invitation to soccer fans who are going to be in LA during some stretch games (not sure which my vouchers are good for but I'll check later). MLS has a long way to go but it has come a long way. (Damn the FO should pay me )

[TheMightyPuck]

...Man City...

OT -- That reminds me. I really suck at we7i (love it but you know how it is, never have time to play it yada yada) but I beat Man City last night with Chelsea 2-1 (after losing 1-0 2-1 and 1-0 the three previous games). There's a new pl/cola 2k4 x-port option file i was using. It even has chelsea in their black away strip and swp is pretty good.

[fsquid]

I think it would help if the MLS teams were involved in some sort of continental competition like the Copa Liberatores. Just let our champ get an invite into the first qualifying stage, let us earn our lumps!

[Jared]

Having now been exposed to some of these games in full, I can comfortably say that the MLS is, at best, League Division 2 standard (ie the 3rd tier of the English domestic game - home to Simo's beloved Hartlepool..).

Eek. I always thought of the MLS around mid-table in Division 1/The Championship. Or maybe the Belgian league. But I might be overestimating MLS a bit.

[RiverRat]

I think it would help if the MLS teams were involved in some sort of continental competition like the Copa Liberatores. Just let our champ get an invite into the first qualifying stage, let us earn our lumps!

That would be terrific. I think it would bring a little credibility to MLS and would help connect the US club-level game with the rest of the world.

[TheMightyPuck]

We are involved in the CONCACAF Champions Cup and have had varying results. LA won it in 2001

http://www.footballconfederation.com/ma ... &seid=2000

Not the biggest competition though. Not even close to Libertadores.

EDIT: Galaxy at the HDC from 138

[Naples39]

I don't know if I would rate MLS so lowly. Nobody's saying it's EPL quality, but it's not atrocious bad either. I tend to agree with the comments you hear from guys like Ronnie O'Brien, currently of the Dallas Burn who played in D1 before coming to America,when he says the best teams in MLS would be among the better teams of D1, and the worst of MLS probably wouldn't be able to stay up in D1.

There are however, two important factors to consider. First, depth. Namely MLS teams have none. With such a low salary cap, a lot of MLS teams can field a solid first team, but if any injuries or nat team call ups come up, the quality of players takes a dive VERY quickly, as MLS teams are forced to trot out a bunch of guys making 30k a year. Until MLS sees bigger revenue growth, that won't change.

Second is the heat. MLS will always play a slower game, and often times that makes the game look of lower quality than the players really are. They simply can't push it like they can in England, so teams are forced to be more methodical and measured in their speed of play -- not because the players simply aren't good enough. Just look at these Champions World games. Yes, I am fully aware that it is their preseason so the players are not fully in shape yet, and many of the best players didn't come on the trip, but c'mon, the quality of many of these matches has been downright brutal, especially in the second half. By the 75th minute these guys can barely do anything, and even teams like the Colorado Crapids would be embarrassed by the display put on in the last 25 minutes of that Liverpool-Roma game the other day. Put a mid-table D2 team out to play on 90 degree day in a 30% full stadium and then see what you think about their quality of play.