Forza 5

[XXXIV]

Hopefully someone else can check. I'm in Nashville today. Took my daughter to the open casting call for the female lead in Star Wars VII.

Awesome! Good luck to her mix.

+1

Good luck!

[mixdj1]

What is the maximum number of players in an online race in Forza 5?

I just created a private session and it allowed up to 16 players.

Can you have a mix of private slots with AI racers filling up the field?

Yes, you can fill the empty slots with Drivatars. In fact there are four full screens worth of multi-player options. Looks like it would make a good league racer:

Rules:
Game type (Timed, circuit, elimination, etc)
Environment (location)
Track
Max Players (1-16)
Max Drivatars (0-15)
Laps (1-50)
Damage (cosmetic, simulation)
Collision mode (on, off, default (ghosts stalled or reversed cars))
Car Class
Drive type

Advanced Rules:
Scoring type (time, distance)
Bigger is better (score based races)
Compare best lap scores (best lap wins)
End condition (laps, time)
Laps (1-50)
Grid ordering (Pl, random)
Per car roll off delay (0-60s)
Player Buckets (number of groups allowed)
Tag enabled (enables tag mode)
Number of teams (0-4)
End of race timer (5s to 10m or none)

Overrides:
various restrictions on driver aids, views, etc

Car restrictions:
restrictions for just about any car spec (class, performance index, power, weight, year, body, model, etc)

[Pete1210]

Can you have a mix of private slots with AI racers filling up the field?

Yes, you can fill the empty slots with Drivatars. In fact there are four full screens worth of multi-player options. Looks like it would make a good league racer:

Thanks! This was the tipping point for me. That and the amazon deal: Forza 5 with 1 year XBL for $90!

[DChaps]

The Turn 10 Forums are full of complaints from long-time Forza fans with regards to the limited number of cars, tracks, elimination of all time leaderboards, auction house, etc., but the overwhelming criticism seems to be the addition of the "pay to play" model. For those of you that have Forza 5, is it really as bad as described below, and would the Lotus F1 car really cost over $97 US dollars to purchase it outright using tokens? It can't really be that bad, is it?

http://www.teamvvv.com/en/news/comments ... al-rip-off

Forza 5's monetisation is a monumental rip-off

In the world of free-to-play racing games, if you want to get to the good stuff then you have two options: be prepared to endure some serious grinding, slowly rising up the ranks whilst being drip-fed in-game currency, or part with your cash to bypass it altogether.

It’s a practice that’s been adopted by Microsoft and implemented into Forza Motorsport 5 - in-game tokens can be purchased with real world money to gain access to some of the game’s more prestigious motors.

Except there’s one crucial difference: Forza 5 isn’t free-to-play. Far from it, when you consider the steep cost of the Xbox One, plus a Thrustmaster TX 458 wheel for more serious racers in addition to the £54.99 RRP of the game. And therein lies a serious problem.

As outlined by the outraged NeoGaf community, some of Forza 5’s most sought after cars are inexcusably extortionate.

Case in point: the Lotus E21 formula one car, one of Forza 5’s new star attractions keenly publicised by Microsoft as this is the first game in the series to feature open wheel racecars. What they failed to mention was the astronomical price of admission. In-game, it costs a whopping 6 million credits. Alternatively, at the time of writing you can buy it for 10,000 tokens – in real world cash, this equates to over £60.00. £60.00 for one digital racecar? That's more expensive than the actual game. No. Just no.

The average player, then, won’t ever be able to experience the pleasure of driving this car unless they’re prepared to grind through around 60 hours-worth of laborious racing. And that’s before you take into account sifting through menus, tuning the car and practicing to stay competitive. In practice, you could be spending over 100 hours just to drive one car. Yes, there still needs to be a sense of progression and car rarity, but this is unfeasible.

Of course, Microsoft will argue that micro-transactions are entirely optional. But in the case of Forza 5, it’s abundantly obvious that the fundamental game design has been detrimentally altered to endorse in-game purchases.

Unlike in Forza 4, free cars are no longer regularly rwarded for winning races and levelling up – in Forza 5 you have to purchase each and every one of them using in-game credits or tokens. This restricted access is only compounded by the fact that players who don’t have time to grind in the career and simply want to test drive their favourite cars at their leisure can’t experience them in free drive mode. In Forza 4, every car was available to drive in free mode – the catch was that you couldn’t customise or upgrade them outside of the career, which was a fair compromise for casual players. In contrast, free drive in Forza 5 has been stripped-down to just 40 cars.

There are other changes that were clearly engineered to encourage you to pour more money into Microsoft’s pot, too. The much-loved manufacturer affinity, where sticking with the same manufacturer reaped regular rewards in Forza 4, has been scrapped altogether, so you can say goodbye to free upgrades. Auction houses to sell and share cars are also gone, and you can’t gift cars either.

Meanwhile, the game is constantly reminding you that you can double your XP and credits by buying tokens, or recommending you cars that can only be bought as DLC. Again, this is the sort of tactic you expect to see in a free-to-play mobile racing game - not in a full price retail console game. Worse still, you can’t even buy a car on its own in the majority of cases – Microsoft obviously want you to buy the entire DLC package. It's pure unbridled greed.

This all has bleak implications for the next generation, as monetisation mechanics start to seep into more racing games. Gran Turismo, for example, has always required excessive grinding before you can afford the more desirable cars - the announcement that optional micro-transactions will be in-place for Gran Turismo 6 could exasperate this debacle. Let’s just hope its arcade mode will give access to the full car roster this time which would alleviate the problem somewhat, as rumours suggest.

At least DriveClub Plus Edition will actually be free-to-play in the proper sense, with the option to buy the full game and access all the content. It’s an exemplary business model that allows everyone to have a free test drive but doesn’t punish players who have already purchased the game – a concept that Microsoft don’t appear to have grasped.

[dbdynsty25]

I fail to see a valid complaint about pay to play. If you don't want to shortcut it and pay money to buy a car...just play the F'n game like it's intended. 3-4 years ago there was no way to unlock all the good stuff unless you put in the grind. All they are doing is allowing you to spend real money to skip that part.

[Macca00]

I actually insert the bills into the Blu-ray drive and the car pops up on screen.

I kid.

I'm not far enough into the game to speak on the monetization but there was this hilarious set of gifs on NeoGaf that showed that even if you bought $100 (real money) worth of tokens you still wouldn't have enough tokens to buy the F1 car.

That said, your Drivatar does earn money for you when you're not playing.

My only beef with Forza is the relatively pared down feature set but that's generally to be expected in a launch game on any system. Disappointing but I am still really enjoying this game.

EDIT:

Here they are;

http://i.imgur.com/rDGKTOI.png

http://i.imgur.com/oYfR8UG.png

That's 10,000 tokens for the F1 car, and $99.99 buys you 8,000 tokens. "XBOX, f@ck off"

Though, like db and Terry said - if you don't want to pay to get the shortcut then grind like in GT, no one is forcing you to pay for the tokens.

[TCrouch]

Same. By the end of my first series I had something like $120,000. A new car for the next series was like $50,000. It's really not much to just play the game and buy stuff with the in-game currency.

And that's just the entry level career stuff. I highly doubt that the late-game high-octane series only pay out $120K by the end. I don't see the issue. It's no different than me running Gran Turismo race after Gran Turismo race years ago trying to get cash to buy some race car.

[dbdynsty25]

And that's just the entry level career stuff. I highly doubt that the late-game high-octane series only pay out $120K by the end. I don't see the issue. It's no different than me running Gran Turismo race after Gran Turismo race years ago trying to get cash to buy some race car.

Exactly...sure it's a little harder to progress through the game because you always have to buy newer cars for the next series, but you can grind away on the high paying races w/ the same care all night if you want. Just gotta be dedicated enough. Gamers have turned soft.

[Aristo]

Well, if they increased the grind in order to generate more revenue, that's making the gameplay worse. But I'm not sure it is as bad as folks are imagining. For one, I've already earned 27,000 credits from my Drivatar's performance in other races. Who knows how much that could grow to if I could drive worth a crap. And that is in about 2 days. I've seen some others already making more than that.

And the complaints about the reduced number of cars and tracks (leaving out Nürburgring is pretty unforgivable) is understandable, but the game already clocks in at 31GB. If they dropped a 50-75GB, you would get complaints about the hard drive space it is taking. This the price of next gen, and I suspect is a large part of why GT6 is not coming to the PS4. If you are a die hard, you are going to pay extra to fill up your hard drive with more tracks and cars. Everybody else is going still have hundreds of hours of great games play without the extra's.

I have a friend that is pretty upset about the loss of the Auction House. He spent a lot of time and energy doing research and designing faithful designs, logos and all, of real race cars. And it brought him a ton of credits in return. But there is still some function of selling your designs, since there is an achievement for that.

I suspect the Auction House was more hassle than it was worth for Microsoft. As with any feature like this, it created drama in the community when people "stole" designs and whatever other ways gamers break the code to gain some advantage.

i suspect Microsoft is more than happy with the real result of their changes, which is a lot of reviews and impressions that say the game is more accessible and fun for the casual gamer. It still has high end customization and driving, but there are far more folks like me than true simheads.

The real problem with letting people buy their way into expensive rides is that it diminishes the prestige of owning one of the those cars. It's just like the UT modes in EA games. Every time someone faces a team full of great players, it is assumed they are just paying to win and are terrible players. So the benefit of working your way up to that is to get treated like a cheeser.

I think the move to microtransactions is overall a negative one. But it has weaseled its way into almost every genre of video games. If folks want to be mad at anyone, take it out on the MMO players that alerted the industry that gamers are willing to spend a crazy amount of money every month to play the same game over and over. They will even spend money to let someone else play their game. It was only a matter of time before companies figured out how to bleed the rest of us.

[Dave]

So far I don't feel like the in-game economy is pushing me towards more of a freemium model to unlock cars. From this post, Turn 10 has been listening and is going to be making some adjustments:

http://www.forzamotorsport.net/en-us/news/wir_11_27_13

All cars are on sale for 50% off this weekend, so load up! VIP members get a couple nice perks, the Lotus F1 car and one car of their choice from the on-disc cars (to make up for poor wording about credits).

[pk500]

The 'Ring is an inexcusable omission by Turn 10, install sizes be damned.

[Pete1210]

Check your Forza Rewards. I got 3,000,000 credits.

http://www.forzamotorsport.net/en-us/

[TCrouch]

Thanks for this. After trying many times to get to the page (seemed to load incessantly a lot yesterday), I got 4 mil in FM5. That would have helped when the cars were half price--unfortunately it didn't work for me until late in the evening and it took "up to 4 hours" to show up in game. Oy.

[Dave]

Redeeming the reward was a painful process, I eventually got it to work by using the Xbox One's Internet Explorer. I went on a shopping spree after it finally worked and now have an IndyCar, Audi R18, Shelby Cobra, and all classes covered with at least one car.

[dbdynsty25]

Redeeming the reward was a painful process, I eventually got it to work by using the Xbox One's Internet Explorer. I went on a shopping spree after it finally worked and now have an IndyCar, Audi R18, Shelby Cobra, and all classes covered with at least one car.

Yeah, it wouldn't work in Google Chrome...finally got it to work on my MacBook through Safari. What a crappy website.

[Aristo]

I got my 3 million, and spent 1 million of it. I then forgot to finish up my shopping spree, and my the race car I was going to get for 1.25 mill is not 2.5 mill. I really wanted to spend more of the money since the prices were so cheap. Now I will wait and hope for another sale.

[greggsand]

I finally bought a fast car (R series), and wow, it's s whole different game now! Driving a Honda Accord around a track is ok, but once you get a car that hits 170+, it's a totally new experience.

[dbdynsty25]

I finally bought a fast car (R series), and wow, it's s whole different game now! Driving a Honda Accord around a track is ok, but once you get a car that hits 170+, it's a totally new experience.

It really is nice that you can run about ten races with your free car and then you pretty much can skip ahead and pick up a significantly faster car. That way it doesn't feel like such a grind.

LOL...that's what I said. Thankfully the slow ass cars don't take so long to get out of in F5. However, if you want to actually complete the game, there are gonna be quite a few races in those slow compacts.

[DChaps]

Terry, do you have your new TM wheel for Forza 5 yet, and if so what do you think so far?

[TCrouch]

Nope, couldn't get one. I have one on order, may have it as soon as tomorrow. But not yet.

[Dave]

Wow, the IndyCars are a blast to drive. The rumble triggers are a huge help when trying to get the power down in first gear,

[Zeppo]

I'm so frustrated by this reward claim thing! Even on the MacBook with Safari, I get to the "click to redeem" page, but the button just doesn't respond.

Beware my drivatar. I've put only a tiny amount of time in and am a mess out there. I can't figure out what assists to use (traction control and stability management) and do a lot of fish tailing in the two cars I own.

Also I'm a bit confused when I look to buy a car. It looks like the game auto-upgrades the car when I highlight it. I'd rather buy the stock car and add upgrades myself (sure maybe I'll use the auto upgrade feature but maybe not). Is there any way to turn off this auto upgrade when you buy a car? Is it actually auto upgrading or am I misreading it?

[Dave]

Have you tried using Explorer on the Xbox One? That's what it took to get my reward.

Where are you trying to buy the car, is it after you pick a series? The game tries to make your car as competitive as possible...maybe? I remember seeing the 'auto upgrade' thing but my recent purchases were 'stock' when I bought directly from the main career menu (I think).

Some cars are tough to keep straight, the S2000 was a nightmare for me. I have ABS on but the stability management drives me crazy.

[mixdj1]

Also I'm a bit confused when I look to buy a car. It looks like the game auto-upgrades the car when I highlight it. I'd rather buy the stock car and add upgrades myself (sure maybe I'll use the auto upgrade feature but maybe not). Is there any way to turn off this auto upgrade when you buy a car? Is it actually auto upgrading or am I misreading it?

If you buy the car from the championship menu it auto upgrades it to that class. It also maxes HP before anything else making them fast but a pain to drive. I have started buying my cars from the main menu and manually upgrading them so I can get the speed and handling I want. Hope this helps.

[Zeppo]

Also I'm a bit confused when I look to buy a car. It looks like the game auto-upgrades the car when I highlight it. I'd rather buy the stock car and add upgrades myself (sure maybe I'll use the auto upgrade feature but maybe not). Is there any way to turn off this auto upgrade when you buy a car? Is it actually auto upgrading or am I misreading it?

If you buy the car from the championship menu it auto upgrades it to that class. It also maxes HP before anything else making them fast but a pain to drive. I have started buying my cars from the main menu and manually upgrading them so I can get the speed and handling I want. Hope this helps.

Thanks guys. That's the info I needed to know.