OT: Racing 2009 (Spoiler Alert)

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 8:29 am

Briatore and Symonds leave Renault team

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/78668

"The ING Renault F1 Team will not dispute the recent allegations made by the FIA concerning the 2008 Singapore Grand Prix," said a statement from the team.

"It also wishes to state that its managing director, Flavio Briatore and its executive director of engineering, Pat Symonds, have left the team.

"Before attending the hearing before the FIA World Motor Sport Council in Paris on 21 September 2009, the team will not make any further comment."

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 8:54 am

Eddie Jordan chimes in:

BBC pundit and former team boss Eddie Jordan said he was surprised by Renault's announcement but believes it was effectively an admission of guilt. "By suggesting they are not going to contest the allegations is in itself an admission," Jordan told the BBC.

"That's how I see it. Legally, there may be another argument. I think this is a clear-cut admission and I am surprised. "I don't know what goes on in teams but certainly in the Jordan team you would contemplate all sorts of things but you certainly couldn't contemplate that."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsp ... 258987.stm

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 9:01 am

BUSTED. Briatore's and Symonds' careers are over in F1.

The F1 door can't hit Briatore in the ass quickly enough. He never has appreciated the sporting aspects of motor racing; it was just another marketing and business exercise for him. Plus his insouciant playboy act had worn really thin with me this decade.

I'm sad to see Symonds leave F1. He always seemed to be a calm, rational, decent man, and is a brilliant tactician and technical mind. A real motor racing man. I loved his interviews with Holly Samos on The Chequered Flag BBC podcasts.

The big question now is how the Renault board will react to this. Renault boss Carlos Ghosn is a notorious axe-wielder, and Renault teetered on the edge of F1 pullout a few years ago.

Will this PR hit to the integrity of the company be too much for Ghosn and the board to take, especially with automakers worldwide looking to trim costs any way they can?

Veteran F1 journalist Joe Saward outlines various scenarios at grandprix.com:

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns21826.html

Take care,
PK

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:10 am

pk500 wrote:BUSTED. Briatore's and Symonds' careers are over in F1.

The F1 door can't hit Briatore in the ass quickly enough. He never has appreciated the sporting aspects of motor racing; it was just another marketing and business exercise for him. Plus his insouciant playboy act had worn really thin with me this decade.

I'm sad to see Symonds leave F1. He always seemed to be a calm, rational, decent man, and is a brilliant tactician and technical mind. A real motor racing man. I loved his interviews with Holly Samos on The Chequered Flag BBC podcasts.

The big question now is how the Renault board will react to this. Renault boss Carlos Ghosn is a notorious axe-wielder, and Renault teetered on the edge of F1 pullout a few years ago.

Will this PR hit to the integrity of the company be too much for Ghosn and the board to take, especially with automakers worldwide looking to trim costs any way they can?

Veteran F1 journalist Joe Saward outlines various scenarios at grandprix.com:

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns21826.html

Take care,
PK

Thank you Bill O'Reilly for our word of the day !

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:16 am

That hurts, Rod. No more comparisons to O'Reilly, please? Pretty please?

I'm not a fan of that dude.

Take care,
PK

Smurfy · Post by **Smurfy** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:25 pm

Aw shucks.

The tears for Flavio must be flowing in the Alesi and Berger households.

I'm not sure if I should give him some credit for recognizing racing talent and building up a team around it. Flavio did have his successes, didn't he?

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:27 pm

Smurfy wrote:Aw shucks.

The tears for Flavio must be flowing in the Alesi and Berger households.

I'm not sure if I should give him some credit for recognizing racing talent and building up a team around it. Flavio did have his successes, didn't he?

Yeah he recently married a 27 year old. See what money will get you.

DChaps · Post by **DChaps** » Fri Sep 18, 2009 9:29 pm

Don't forget, Indycars live from Japan tonight at 10:30pm EDT on VS!

Or if you don't have VS, watch live online at:

http://indycarnation.indycar.com/racecontrol/

If you have never tried out the race control it is very cool providing incar views, telemetry, etc. for free. Live streaming starts at 10:15pm EDT. Check it out.

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Sun Sep 20, 2009 8:43 am

Don't know what to make of this or the credibility but there appears to be an agreement between McLaren and Kimi for next year if and only Ferrari pays his full salary for 2010.

http://www.motorsport.com/news/article. ... 5921&FS=F1

GB_Simo · Post by **GB_Simo** » Sun Sep 20, 2009 11:22 am

Rodster wrote:Don't know what to make of this or the credibility but there appears to be an agreement between McLaren and Kimi for next year if and only Ferrari pays his full salary for 2010.

http://www.motorsport.com/news/article. ... 5921&FS=F1

Very interesting if true, but the Mirror is a British tabloid which, in common with all British tabloids, isn't noted for accuracy. I only read the Mirror in the week, not on Sundays, so haven't seen the story itself, but I'd wait for another source before getting too far into that one.

Edit: Autosport online editor Jonny Noble's Twitter feed - 'My sources say Raikkonen's future is still totally up in the air - so don't believe stories that he has an outline agreement with McLaren'

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:02 pm

So Renault received a 2 year suspended ban and that's IT, while McLaren received a $100m fine and 1 year suspended ban. I think Renault should have been made to pay at least a $50m fine along with a suspended ban which is equal to a 2 year probation, that's utter bullsh*t.

GB_Simo · Post by **GB_Simo** » Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:30 pm

Two things:

- McLaren had two hearings. At the first hearing it was found that there was no evidence of their using the information from Ferrari, at the second it was found that McLaren had told the FIA lies. Renault took measures to save themselves as soon as it became clear that the allegations made against them had substance.
- Quite a few people are interested in having a Renault engine next year.

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:41 pm

I don't have a problem with anything you said Adam but race fixing is massive cheating especially when it appears the Championship may have changed with that race. I still think they should have been given a monetary penalty just like McLaren.

GB_Simo · Post by **GB_Simo** » Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:56 pm

Renault's offence, though, does appear to genuinely have involved just the three people over one weekend. McLaren's offence involved more people over a prolonged period of time, though neither are in the spirit of fair play.

I know what you mean and don't necessarily disagree with it, but note that Briatore's involvement in FIA-sanctioned championships is over, and that Symonds is barred from involvement in the sport for 5 years. The only one of the people proven to be involved that wasn't punished today is Piquet Jr, whose reputation was more than tarnished enough without any further intervention. The punishment deals with the main people involved and it goes as far as possible to keeping Renault in the sport, so it's understandable.

Whether or not you agree with it, of course, is an altogether different thing, and yes, you would have expected some kind of financial punishment too.

As a side note, can anyone tell me which organisation made up of representatives from each F1 team Briatore was a key, key player in? Just saying.

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Mon Sep 21, 2009 5:10 pm

GB_Simo wrote:As a side note, can anyone tell me which organisation made up of representatives from each F1 team Briatore was a key, key player in? Just saying.

What is FOTA for $500, Alex?

I feel zero sympathy for Briatore. He never loved F1, never cared about it as more than a business venture. He'll move on to his next capitalistic conquest within six months and forget about F1.

But I feel really bad for Pat Symonds. F1 courses through his veins. He's a complete gearhead and racing man in the cut of Frank Williams or Patrick Head.

Symonds is guilty and should be punished. I don't understand why a man of his reputation and stature was complicit in such an affair. He could get a job with ANY team on the grid in a second if he had resigned over this affair when it was proposed.

But five years away from F1 or any FIA-sanctioned motorsport will kill Symonds. It will eat him alive.

Screw Briatore. But I feel some pain for Symonds, one of the brightest and seemingly most genuine veteran fellas in the F1 paddock.

Take care,
PK

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Mon Sep 21, 2009 5:16 pm

I think Nelson should have received at least a two year ban to go along with Renault's two year suspended ban. Not like anyone was going to offer him a ride anyways although I don't think he's as bad a driver as Flavio made him out to be. Heikki has not been the same driver when he left Renault.

I hear what your saying but if Renault had received a slap on the hand fine of $50m which they could afford it would have sent a more just decision. As it stands now it's more of a: we know you did it, now let's all get back to racing.

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Mon Sep 21, 2009 5:21 pm

pk500 wrote:
I feel zero sympathy for Briatore. He never loved F1, never cared about it as more than a business venture. He'll move on to his next capitalistic conquest within six months and forget about F1.

At least i'll never have to read "flamboyant and Briatore" or "The flamboyant Italian" in the same entence ever again.

pk500 wrote:
Symonds is guilty and should be punished. I don't understand why a man of his reputation and stature was complicit in such an affair. He could get a job with ANY team on the grid in a second if he had resigned over this affair when it was proposed.

Take care,
PK

Sometimes it might be as simple as you think you would never get caught. Also sometimes people will do almost anything for the taste of victory.

toonarmy · Post by **toonarmy** » Mon Sep 21, 2009 7:58 pm

I'm sure Flavio will have a lot to say in coming months over this matter. I have a feeling we will be hearing some interesting, truthful or not, information. And, isn't it odd how Alonso has now been a primary driver for two major teams in a row involved in cheating scandals? It's sickening to see F1 with so many shady goings on at a time in which it is drowning in money and support. Hopefully this punishment will serve as a wake-up call to others contemplating engaging in shenanigans.

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Tue Sep 22, 2009 9:06 am

Hey someone agrees with me.

Hill: Renault verdict 'a crying shame'

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/78780

toonarmy · Post by **toonarmy** » Tue Sep 22, 2009 3:37 pm

Rodster wrote:Hey someone agrees with me.

Hill: Renault verdict 'a crying shame'

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/78780

I think what Hill says is entirely true about F1 under Bernie being more about money than being a "proper sport." However, I do not know enough of the inside details about this incident to be able to say that the penalty is too lenient or not in regard to Renault. I mean, if a couple people on a football club are involved in match fixing then you do not ban the entire club and organization for life, rather you punish the specific people involved. So taken from that perspective perhaps the decision about Renault may be fair enough.

davet010 · Post by **davet010** » Fri Sep 25, 2009 4:31 am

Renault now lost 2 sponsors, one of whom, ING, had a deal due to terminate at the end of this season but is finishing it 4 races early. It may be that the powers that be at Renault's senior management decide that the F1 arm is now a publicity nightmare, rather than a positive...

As for what's wrong with F1, welcome to another episode of 'Dave T thinks that all top sports administrators are corrupt scum', with this week's returning guests. Mr B Ecclestone and Mr M 'Spanky' Mosley.

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Fri Sep 25, 2009 9:23 am

I would love to see Renault leave F1 and make a big push at Le Mans and international sports car racing.

Take care,
PK

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Fri Sep 25, 2009 8:33 pm

File this under the world's kept secret. Ferrari President Luca Di Montezemolo let the cat out of the bag that Alonzo will drive alongside Felipe Massa next year. The bigger question is whether Santander is paying for Kimi's buyout worth $46 million?

http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/n ... 2842.shtml

"Speaking with Spanish reporters at an event in Madrid, he said in a video posted on the website of the sports newspaper Marca: "We are very happy about having so many fans in Spain, and next year, with Alonso..."

Montezemolo stopped himself, laughed, and pointed a finger at the similarly-amused ranks of pressmen."

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Fri Sep 25, 2009 10:39 pm

Another scandal to explode this season in F1?

Check out this paragraph from this BBC News story today about the return to Singapore, the scene of the "Crashgate" crime:

"The Singapore paddock was fretting with talk of another scandal to come before the season is out and perhaps that is why few wanted to judge Renault and the "crash-gate" plotters too harshly."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsp ... 274036.stm

Would anyone be surprised?

Take care,
PK

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Sat Sep 26, 2009 7:42 am

Well surprise, surprise, sometimes even a blind squirrel finds a nut.

Santander to pave the way for Raikkonen move?

http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/n ... 4518.shtml

" Ferrari team boss Stefano Domenicali, who has Raikkonen under contract for 2010, on Friday admitted that "the situation has changed... in the last couple of days".

"Sport Bild now reports that mutual team sponsor Santander, keen to make room at Ferrari for Alonso, has agreed to pay McLaren €25m if it will give Raikkonen a race seat next year."