Madden 10 - Will they prove us wrong?

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Mon Feb 02, 2009 1:16 am

http://www.operationsports.com/newspost.php?id=292010

First Madden 10 Feature Revealed

It is my pleasure to introduce Madden’s newest piece of technology, one that is also shared within many of the EA SPORTS games, called "Procedural Awareness". What is it? We’ll you’ve likely heard of “head tracking” with IK. If you haven’t, it’s a way to turn the players head around to face a target dynamically, without the need for canned animations. Well, think of Procedural Awareness (PA for short) as the “next-gen” version of head tracking. Since it is so early in the year, unfortunately I can’t show you any videos of it running in the game, but I can show some “tech demos” of sorts:

the rest at the link

Brando70 · Post by **Brando70** » Mon Feb 02, 2009 10:41 am

Next up: Madden's all new Groinal Awareness, where players will scratch themselves in real time!

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Mon Feb 02, 2009 11:02 am

Let the hype begin for another huge letdown.

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Mon Feb 02, 2009 5:08 pm

Not sure if there is a point in trying to keep this thread useful but I'll try, from the long post BD linked to.

Well now we can make a DB track the ball realistically and we’ll make sure that he has a true line of sight before he can make a play on the ball. And if/when he gets burned, he can dynamically look down and shake his head with zero new animations or engineering support.

If they actually implement this it will be a big upgrade, ignoring the last sentence because that is fluff. I really don't ever want to see a guy who is unaware make a play on the ball again. Of course the WR / DB interaction in terms of animations needs a lot more work then just head tracking, but from an awareness stand point that would be huge.

I fully understand that this feature was in an older game whose name shall not be spoken, but I hope they actually put this in place. Of course talk is cheap.
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bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Mon Feb 02, 2009 5:30 pm

That is why this should not have been the first thing mentioned. Those who played that "other game" have been there done that. Now five years later it becomes a new feature. Would have left this on the bullet point list and actually put something new out there. Probably has more to do with marketing not wanting to let them release anything of note.

hellbent · Post by **hellbent** » Mon Feb 02, 2009 9:44 pm

bdoughty wrote:That is why this should not have been the first thing mentioned. Those who played that "other game" have been there done that. Now five years later it becomes a new feature. Would have left this on the bullet point list and actually put something new out there. Probably has more to do with marketing not wanting to let them release anything of note.

My thoughts exactly. The features we will be briefed about are going to be largely items that are easy for the general game buying public to digest - especially features that graphically "pop" off the screen. Still, one hopes they will have some even more "head-turning" features to show off as summer approaches. Something akin to Live's DNA feature, using the red-hot postseason play of the Cardinals as an example would have been impressive.

I'd personally love to hear more about gameplay improvements (naturally). But, if AI enhancements were easier for EA to show off with videos or explain in tight bullet points to stoke the early discussion of Madden, they'd have touted it every year (whether it actually improved or not). I think "Liquid AI" in Madden 98 was the last time EA made AI enhancement the centerpiece of the marketing for a new edition of Madden.

Despite my skepticism brought on from the next-gen Maddens thus far, I'm going to very much keep an open mind until I actually play the game myself. Gameplay enhancements won't be evident no matter what until someone gets a hands-on preview in a few months, so I will just sit back and enjoy the latest press releases for now.

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Mon Feb 09, 2009 8:04 pm

http://www.operationsports.com/forums/m ... moore.html

Madden NFL 10 blog 2: Ratings philosophy by Donny Moore

Hey guys, we thought it would be a perfect time to share something that I am personally very excited about for Madden NFL 10. We took each and every rating in the game (over 50+ player ratings) and scaled them up/down in a way that is now using much more of the scale. I like to describe it around the office like this…”We basically stretched out the ratings.” We want to use more of the numbers so we get a bigger, more noticeable affect in the game.

Read the rest at the link...

dougb · Post by **dougb** » Tue Feb 10, 2009 8:21 pm

bdoughty wrote:http://www.operationsports.com/forums/m ... moore.html

Madden NFL 10 blog 2: Ratings philosophy by Donny Moore

Hey guys, we thought it would be a perfect time to share something that I am personally very excited about for Madden NFL 10. We took each and every rating in the game (over 50+ player ratings) and scaled them up/down in a way that is now using much more of the scale. I like to describe it around the office like this…”We basically stretched out the ratings.” We want to use more of the numbers so we get a bigger, more noticeable affect in the game.

Read the rest at the link...

Thanks BD - It'll be interesting to see how these kind of tweaks work out. The good news is that there appear to be people leading the project who are passionate about addressing the shortcomings of the game.

I'm worried though that they won't have the time to address things like line blocking, player interaction and player and ball physics, things that really would lead to a significantly improved game experience. I've gone back to All pro 2K8 - although I absolutely hate the lack of real teams and current rosters, there's so much good gameplay there that it has become my football game of choice. I wish EA would move the release to the beginning of November and give the development team a little more time to implement improvements to the engine.

Best wishes,

Doug

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Tue Feb 10, 2009 11:00 pm

Ive been playing APF of late as well and well there are plenty of the same problems in that game. Suction Blocking, O Linemen running down field and blocking no one, my favorite is the dive where a guy is about to hit the ground and then magically floats back up and tackles someone. I can very easily sprint outside the pocket and complete passes at will, especially out patterns.

Yet I find myself really enjoying the game now that I have limited my running backs to generic players and don't call runs out of the I-Joker set.

So I ask why am I enjoying myself when I see the problems above? The reason is simple, First most don't happen with the frequency they do in Madden. But the main reason is their are 100's upon 100's of more animations which basically obscure me from seeing these problems. Watching a line men fight off a double team and tackle the QB is not only cool but satisfying as hell. Watching a DB break up a pass looks like it should most of the time. In essence this butt load of animations make the game look and feel more organic.

This is why I think madden 10 will not be successful, while I think that certain guys on the team are going to make big changes in the next year or two if the team stays in tact. They are never going to get anywhere near the animations that APF has, they have had years to do it and they aren't even close. I can't say why that is, but I just know that until they set a team aside dedicated to creating animations for this game on a year round basis they will never get the look some of us want. It's a simple numbers game if Game A has 200 line men animations and Game B has 1000, Game B is always going to feel more realistic.

I know some will disagree with what I have said here and claim that there is a major difference in game play. That's fine and we will just agree to disagree. While i agree their are differences I don't agree that APF always does things better, yeah it ALWAYS looks better though. I make my judgment by playing many, many games of both products.

So head tracking a good start if it's more then window dressing, tweaked ratings, well anyone who has played HC can tell you it makes a big difference and since the same guys are doing it in Madden I think that is a no brainier in terms of game play changes. But if the rumored Ol/DL changes consists of a meager amount of animations then you're f***ed before you begin.

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 1:15 pm

Good points Dan. I am pretty sure I posted this here a couple years ago but this comparison video pretty much nails what you said.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxAsz_xbB0s

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 2:22 pm

The one thing I don't understand is that instead of fixing the serious problems with their game engine they highlight another band aid, ratings.

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 3:25 pm

Rodster wrote:The one thing I don't understand is that instead of fixing the serious problems with their game engine they highlight another band aid, ratings.

A. It's not a band aid, if you played HC you would know it makes a difference. I'm not going to complain if they actually have OL who suck rated in the 60's

B. I wouldn't call this high lighting new fetures, this isn't marketing 101. they are trying to discuss things they can well in advance with the fans to get opinions etc. There is another thread on signature styles for players by the Art director.

I have no idea how it will all turn out but it is unfair to complain about what they are talking about in Feb.

From what I read yesterday the first "new" feature is going to be announced by Peter Moore on his blog, along with the first Madden 10 screen shot. Apparently he is there today looking at a build.

Sudz · Post by **Sudz** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 3:25 pm

SEARCH NERD

http://trends.google.com/trends?q=madde ... mtd&sort=0

2010 is what the fans are using not 10

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 4:12 pm

Thanks Sudz,

Never used that before but it is pretty interesting and accurate to sales figures.

Popularity rankings for combined search (Madden 2010, NCAA 2010, NHL 2010, Fifa 2010, Tiger Woods 2010)

USA 12 mo

http://trends.google.com/trends?q=madde ... ytd&sort=0

UK 12 mo

http://trends.google.com/trends?q=madde ... ytd&sort=0

Japan 12 mo

http://trends.google.com/trends?q=madde ... ytd&sort=3

Germany 12mo

http://trends.google.com/trends?q=madde ... ytd&sort=3

Canada 12mo

http://trends.google.com/trends?q=madde ... ytd&sort=2

Wow Canada dissing your Hockey for some Fifa love.

Of course this is a Madden thread so enough of this from me.

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 4:28 pm

I have no clue what those charts mean. Even so that's for EA to worry about not me.

bulls23 · Post by **bulls23** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 7:12 pm

bdoughty wrote:Thanks Sudz,

Never used that before but it is pretty interesting and accurate to sales figures.

Popularity rankings for combined search (Madden 2010, NCAA 2010, NHL 2010, Fifa 2010, Tiger Woods 2010)

USA 12 mo

http://trends.google.com/trends?q=madde ... ytd&sort=0

UK 12 mo

http://trends.google.com/trends?q=madde ... ytd&sort=0

Japan 12 mo

http://trends.google.com/trends?q=madde ... ytd&sort=3

Germany 12mo

http://trends.google.com/trends?q=madde ... ytd&sort=3

Canada 12mo

http://trends.google.com/trends?q=madde ... ytd&sort=2

Wow Canada dissing your Hockey for some Fifa love.

Of course this is a Madden thread so enough of this from me.

How do you have the time to look up this crap, when you should be bonkin' that hottie in your picture?

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 7:24 pm

That's Tim Tebow and his Hottie.

Murph · Post by **Murph** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:03 pm

Rodster wrote:That's Tim Tebow and his Hottie.

Are you saying bdoughty couldn't get her?

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:20 pm

Oh, I could get her.

Of course chloroform and some rope would be required.

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:53 pm

Murph wrote:
Rodster wrote:That's Tim Tebow and his Hottie.
Are you saying bdoughty couldn't get her?

I never said that.

bulls23 · Post by **bulls23** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 9:03 pm

Rodster wrote:That's Tim Tebow and his Hottie.

no s***! I thought that was really bdoughty

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 1:49 pm

http://insideblog.easports.com/archive/ ... pdate.aspx

Quick Madden NFL 10 Update

Hey Madden fans, we’re back again with another (quick) update for Madden NFL 10. After talking about technology and philosophy for the past few weeks, we thought it was a good idea to actually show you a new feature this week. Now being that it’s so early in the year, we obviously can’t show big grandiose new features, so we wanted to show something that is in the game that came directly from community feedback and wishlists. It’s been a long time coming for this one...I’m stoked that we were finally able to get this in.

Our screens are in a very rough phase right now but we figured it’s no big deal to show you this screenshot to give away the new feature. I’m sure you’ll notice it right away.

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 5:16 pm

I love how it only took 2 comments on the blog before it got ripped as a new feature.

Thanks for the link BTW.

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 7:27 pm

Danimal wrote:I love how it only took 2 comments on the blog before it got ripped as a new feature.

Thanks for the link BTW.

Hey it only took a couple hours for some OS detective to call it possible broken gameplay.

http://www.operationsports.com/forums/m ... -10-a.html

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 7:43 pm

Yeah I saw that, was the guys first post wasn't it?

My understanding is there will be news each Monday for Madden and the an undetermined day for NCAA. I'm going to try and stay away from the forums over there and just see what develops, I mean really do we have any other choice?