macsomjrr wrote:Whatever happens I'll still be watching come opening day regardless. Every professional athletic competition on the planet has cheaters so why should all this attention focused on baseball change my opinion about this great sport? I mean the freakin congress got involved with this game for crying out loud. How is that not trying to clean up the sport? Next comment is gonna be "well why did congress have to get involved in the first place?" Because baseball had failed and let the problem get to big. They needed help. They got that help and now a better system is getting put into place.
Play ball!
Now let's start talking about how great the Tigers are going to be this year.
Sorry but American sports in general are WAY behind the international standards. Which is sad...We should have WADA standards in all of our sports.
I think its because we we have the WWF/NBA mentality. Entertainment over sport. Why didsgraces like the Mgwire-Sosa scumfest happened in the first place.
MLB and the MLB writers sucked both their cocks all summer long......assholes.
Again, while looking at Sosa, it appears obvious that he did something, I wonder why there hasn't been any leaks, or hearsay whatsoever, inregards to him doing any PEDs.
The Mitchell report just emphasizes in details what every baseball reporter, J. Canseco, K. Caminiti and rumor mongerer sources knew for years. B. Selig was slow to acknowledge the problem for more than a decade when fans where debating the Sosa-McGuire HR derby race. This report details only a fraction of the problem that plagues Baseball. The Commish at one point closed the front door of the barn but was allowing side entrances to the world of drugs.
I am just interested to see how the exclusion from the HOF, and records will be viewed for those that were accused. It'll be difficult to strip the CY Young awards fromt the Rocket man but if there's sufficient proof on these guys, I wished someone would have the guts to follow what the Olympics committee did to Marion Jones. It's the only way to protect the integrity of the game.
The report won't keep people away from the game, it's just a peek into the sleazy underbelly of the world of Baseball.
As most of you would agree, the list provided is not complete. One name that is missing from the Yankee organization is #13, and according to Canseco, while he didn't mentioned his name directly, he said 'It's incomplete'. Ironic how they announced the new huge contract for A-Rod while rumors continue to swirl.
10spro wrote:As most of you would agree, the list provided is not complete. One name that is missing from the Yankee organization is #13, and according to Canseco, while he didn't mentioned his name directly, he said 'It's incomplete'. Ironic how they announced the new huge contract for A-Rod while rumors continue to swirl.
Canseco said on WEEI a few months ago that he has stuff on AROD.
macsomjrr wrote:I mean the freakin congress got involved with this game for crying out loud. How is that not trying to clean up the sport? Next comment is gonna be "well why did congress have to get involved in the first place?" Because baseball had failed and let the problem get to big. They needed help. They got that help and now a better system is getting put into place.
Therein lies the problem. MLB should not need government intervention to clean up a well-known problem like steroids. If I am MLB Commish, the LAST place I will look to is the US Government to help me solve or even intervene in ANY issue. Bud Selig willingly had his head up his ass for years and to this day STILL does not strike me as someone who is concerned enough about this issue. MLB is now the poster child for what steroids can do to a sport because they let this fester and did not deal with it swiftly and directly because their leader is not a visionary and refused to see the big picture of what steroids would do to his sport. Selig either needs to put the hammer down and adopt THE most stringent drug testing protocols for MLB or step down and let someone with some cajones do it for him....
A few here have mentioned hockey's drug policy. The NHL tests its players up to three times per season, and any player who plays internationally, in the annual World Championships or Olympics, is tested according to WADA standards.
Only one player, Sean Hill, has tested positive for steroids. And the NHL suspended him for 20 games -- almost one-quarter of the season -- after his first offense.
In no way am I saying hockey is clean. Amphetamines and other stimulants are a problem. You never know about HGH, either. But steroids apparently aren't a scourge on hockey like in baseball.
With the honed agility needed to cope with the constant movement in hockey, I would think steroids would be the last thing a hockey player would take due to the increased chance of connective tissue injuries. Baseball is a perfect sport for steroid abuse because it's so sedentary compared to the other stick-and-ball sports and because power is rewarded so richly at the plate and on the mound.
Take care,
PK
Last edited by pk500 on Sat Dec 15, 2007 11:24 am, edited 2 times in total.
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macsomjrr wrote:I mean the freakin congress got involved with this game for crying out loud. How is that not trying to clean up the sport? Next comment is gonna be "well why did congress have to get involved in the first place?" Because baseball had failed and let the problem get to big. They needed help. They got that help and now a better system is getting put into place.
Therein lies the problem. MLB should not need government intervention to clean up a well-known problem like steroids. If I am MLB Commish, the LAST place I will look to is the US Government to help me solve or even intervene in ANY issue. Bud Selig willingly had his head up his ass for years and to this day STILL does not strike me as someone who is concerned enough about this issue. MLB is now the poster child for what steroids can do to a sport because they let this fester and did not deal with it swiftly and directly because their leader is not a visionary and refused to see the big picture of what steroids would do to his sport. Selig either needs to put the hammer down and adopt THE most stringent drug testing protocols for MLB or step down and let someone with some cajones do it for him....
Selig is incompetent and IMO is buddies with Donald "Grampa Munster" Fehr. There in lies the problem. A very powerful players union in fact too powerful which dictates to baseball what it can and cannot do and a incompetent baseball commish who looks the other way.
I also believe that steroids is no longer a big issue in baseball or in other sports because they moved on to HGH which is much harder to detect and always has the testers guessing. Until the MLB gets tough on the cheaters like they do in the NFL or in the IOC this will continue to be a problem.
Unfortunately most fans don't give a damn but I do as I tuned out of baseball when I realized most if not all of the record breakers were frauds.
TheGamer wrote:Again, while looking at Sosa, it appears obvious that he did something, I wonder why there hasn't been any leaks, or hearsay whatsoever, inregards to him doing any PEDs.
Sosa doesnt speak english so he is a hard inteview ...
Mac on the otherhand had stuff illegal in every other sport in his locker and the writers just kept on licking his balls....
MMMMM...yummmy gives us more and more drug induced home runs.
Oh yeah and though Sosa,Pryor and Wood didnt make the "final report"....apparently that was due to the lack of cancelled checks level of evidence.
Former Cub: I Saw Teammates Inject Steroids
Several Others Who Once Played For Cubs, White Sox Implicated In Mitchell's Baseball Steroid Report
CHICAGO (CBS) ― A former Cubs pitcher said in the Mitchell report that he had watched two teammates take steroids while playing with the Cubs.
Matt Karchner pitched for the Cubs from 1998 to 2000, and before that for the White Sox from 1995 until 1998. He told the Mitchell investigative panel that he saw two Cubs teammates take steroids in 1999 while in an apartment with them during spring training. He claimed that one player injected the steroid's into the other's buttocks, then injected them into his own body.
He would not identify the players, according to the report.
Karchner also told the panel that he was offered steroids by Cubs teammates, but would not disclose their names either.
Numerous others who played for either the Cubs or White Sox during their careers were also named in the report, but in all but one case, their alleged purchases of drugs did not happen while they were playing in Chicago.
This crap is running rampant. The names mamed were just the tip of the iceberg. It will NEVER end.
Didnt anyone notice that Clemens was getting better in his late 30s?
XXXIV wrote:
Didnt anyone notice that Clemens was getting better in his late 30s?
And his melon got bigger to.
I think he started doing his HGH during his Jays' days.
A.Pettitte admits using HGH.
Only twice. And then he says "If what I did was an error in judgement..."
WTF is that? Translation, I knew what I was doing, I didn't get caught and I don't feel bad about it.
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macsomjrr wrote:
At least they are doing something and I would even argue that they are doing a lot. I mean Roger Clemen's name is in here! Andy Pettite, Pujols, you name it. These guys are superstars.
PUJOLS IS NOT IN THE REPORT!!!!!!
Amazing how one piece of slanderous misinformation about Pujols being "on the list" before it was released, and then when it's actually released he's nowhere to be found yet he gets lumped in with everyone anyway.
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I always suspected Clemens simply because of the unusual nature of his career actually improving as he got older. It is complicated by the fact that he was always great at pitching in games where he did not have good stuff and there was some contention when he left the Red Sox, but it did seem odd that his career looked to be on the downturn and then suddenly blossomed as he hit his late 30's and 40's. This is a guy who appeared worn down late in '86 against the Mets, but as a much older player was still going strong into October. Throw in the wild-eyed bat throwing incident in the World Series and nothing I read surprises me.
As for all the names being thrown around the day the report was released, I wonder where the hell these names came from??
The bottom line is that we are basing a lot of this on supposition and innuendo, but I can't imagine any of these players named trying to take legal action. While players have for the most part refused to talk to Mitchell, I think things would change if you put them under oath.
kevinpars wrote:I think things would change if you put them under oath.
Forget english like Sosa?... take the 5th like Mac?...or even change their minds like Schilling?...I have seen these dopes or should I say dopers under oath...
macsomjrr wrote:
At least they are doing something and I would even argue that they are doing a lot. I mean Roger Clemen's name is in here! Andy Pettite, Pujols, you name it. These guys are superstars.
PUJOLS IS NOT IN THE REPORT!!!!!!
Amazing how one piece of slanderous misinformation about Pujols being "on the list" before it was released, and then when it's actually released he's nowhere to be found yet he gets lumped in with everyone anyway.
You're absolutely right. Pujols name was initially on an ESPN report that I read but he isn't actually listed in there. Still, subjectively, doesn't he just "look" like he is on 'roids?
macsomjrr wrote:
At least they are doing something and I would even argue that they are doing a lot. I mean Roger Clemen's name is in here! Andy Pettite, Pujols, you name it. These guys are superstars.
PUJOLS IS NOT IN THE REPORT!!!!!!
Amazing how one piece of slanderous misinformation about Pujols being "on the list" before it was released, and then when it's actually released he's nowhere to be found yet he gets lumped in with everyone anyway.
You're absolutely right. Pujols name was initially on an ESPN report that I read but he isn't actually listed in there. Still, subjectively, doesn't he just "look" like he is on 'roids?
Oh boy, bubba. Have you even bothered to read where that "initial" report came from? A NBC NY station picked it up off of "some" website & decided to print it(my guess is...no, you are unaware). They have since printed an apology. Pujols wasn't the only guy slandered in that 'fake' report. Congrats on believing everything you read. You'll like this, though I can't verify it's validity:
macsomjrr wrote:Still, subjectively, doesn't he just "look" like he is on 'roids?
Pujols' "look" and body type haven't changed since 2001 when he was called up from AAA as a 21 year old.
If anything's suspect about Pujols, it's his actual age... although, my college roommate was prematurely bald at age 19 too.
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macsomjrr wrote:Still, subjectively, doesn't he just "look" like he is on 'roids?
Pujols' "look" and body type haven't changed since 2001 when he was called up from AAA as a 21 year old.
If anything's suspect about Pujols, it's his actual age... although, my college roommate was prematurely bald at age 19 too.
First - Pujols = not on the list. Second - Minor leaguers can do steroids too. Pujols looks about as roid'ed out as anyone playing professional baseball. Right now I'm suspicious of anybody who excelled during the "steroid era" including A-rod. Does it change my opinion of the game? No.
Roger isn't getting much love down here in Houston. Phone call with McNamee was pretty creepy. Guilty or not, Clemens is really coming across as a total prick.
macsomjrr wrote:Still, subjectively, doesn't he just "look" like he is on 'roids?
Pujols' "look" and body type haven't changed since 2001 when he was called up from AAA as a 21 year old.
If anything's suspect about Pujols, it's his actual age... although, my college roommate was prematurely bald at age 19 too.
First - Pujols = not on the list. Second - Minor leaguers can do steroids too. Pujols looks about as roid'ed out as anyone playing professional baseball. Right now I'm suspicious of anybody who excelled during the "steroid era" including A-rod. Does it change my opinion of the game? No.
The way I understand it ...the scouts are passing out steroids like candy in the Dominican.
Clemens' PR team is f*cking up this entire situation royally.
The portion of the "60 Minutes" interview in which Clemens said he didn't want to file suit against McNamee due to the legal expenses was hilarious. Remember, this is a guy who made more than $100 million during his baseball career, and he's worried about legal expenses?
There was a public backlash to his claimed concerns about legal bills, so of course, Team Clemens filed suit against McNamee today.
The "I don't give a rat's ass about the Hall of Fame" remark during the press conference today also showed what an arrogant jackass this clown is, too.
What a joke.
Take care,
PK
Last edited by pk500 on Mon Jan 07, 2008 10:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"You know why I love boxers? I love them because they face fear. And they face it alone." - Nick Charles
"First on the throttle, last on the brakes." - @MotoGP Twitter signature
pk500 wrote:Clemens' PR team is f*cking up this entire situation royally.
The portion of the "60 Minutes" interview in which Clemens said he didn't want to file suit against McNamee due to the legal expenses was hilarious. Remember, this is a guy who made more than $100 million during his baseball career, and he's worried about legal expenses?
There was a public backlash to his claimed concerns about legal bills, so of course, Team Clemens filed suit against McNamee today.
What a joke.
Take care,
PK
Apparently 60 minutes is only "tough" when dan rather is making s*** up to get his man....
XXXIV wrote:Apparently 60 minutes is only "tough" when dan rather is making s*** up to get his man....
Yeah, I don't understand why Mike Wallace still has this "tough" reputation. He was tough about 20 years ago. Now he's a candy ass, about one cream puff away from being Larry King.
Take care,
PK
"You know why I love boxers? I love them because they face fear. And they face it alone." - Nick Charles
"First on the throttle, last on the brakes." - @MotoGP Twitter signature
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