Soccer thread 07/08

pigpen81 · Post by **pigpen81** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 6:14 pm

He'll be gone by morning.

PK..ugh, I called this Saturday night on R-Factor. I wish I was wrong.

WOW!

Some pundits were saying it would be the best thing to happen to England....we'll see if they are right by World Cupp 2018.

davet010 · Post by **davet010** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 6:19 pm

More distressingly, if they listen to the 'English manager only' crew, who on Earth are they going to pick ? Names like Alan Shearer are being bandied about, who might not be too bad allied with someone who actually has experience of management and the European game, like Ray Wilkins.

Failing that, maybe Marcelo Lippi could find a long-lost Yorkshire grannie in his family tree.

What's the betting Terry 'described by a High Court judge as fundamentally corrupt' Venables is working out whether he can paint himself as being sufficiently distanced from McClown to get the job.

Croatia deservedly through as the best team in the group - Russia are as crap as England but didn't blow as many chances.

pigpen81 · Post by **pigpen81** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 6:28 pm

Some thoughts on the aftermath:

I wonder if Alexi Lalas and Don Garber are doing backflips around their confines right now at the news Becks won't be cup bound in 08?

With the Croats at Euro 08, we have to watch the Purina Dig Chow prancy about the pitch again.

Just think no country from the UK is in Euro 2008....mostly impart to the cheating Italians and the choking Brits.

Eueo 2008 wont be nearly as much fun now.

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 6:52 pm

All great points, Piggy, especially about Garber and Lalas! Never thought of that.

Take care,
PK

10spro · Post by **10spro** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 7:01 pm

When a coach decides to start a game with a 4-3-3 formation, you have to stick with it. But P. Crouch was the lone Ranger all by himself in attack and was easily handled by the Croatians. Would the result be different if Beckham was the starter? Hard to say as he may not be in shape to play 90 minutes but he made a difference in the second half. A little too late for McClaren, he'll be gone to no one's surprise. Wonder how many fans wished P. Robinson was still the starter?

Post by **Jared** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 7:23 pm

Wow...McLaren has got to go. Putting in a keeper that gives up an absolute howler, going with a 4-5-1/4-3-3 that didn't work, and then not playing defensively enough to hold onto the 2-2 draw. England is clearly not as good as Croatia right now...but they are better than Russia. However, they clearly blew it.

It was a fun game to watch for the neutral supporter, though.

RobVarak · Post by **RobVarak** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 7:23 pm

pigpen81 wrote:
With the Croats at Euro 08, we have to watch the Purina Dig Chow prancy about the pitch again.

Hey now, that's over the line! That's a proud national symbol, hailing as it does from the coat-of-arms of Hrvatska. And you're talking about the Brazilians of Europe, so have some respect!

dougb · Post by **dougb** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 7:28 pm

davet010 wrote:More distressingly, if they listen to the 'English manager only' crew, who on Earth are they going to pick ? Names like Alan Shearer are being bandied about, who might not be too bad allied with someone who actually has experience of management and the European game, like Ray Wilkins.

Failing that, maybe Marcelo Lippi could find a long-lost Yorkshire grannie in his family tree.

What's the betting Terry 'described by a High Court judge as fundamentally corrupt' Venables is working out whether he can paint himself as being sufficiently distanced from McClown to get the job.

Croatia deservedly through as the best team in the group - Russia are as crap as England but didn't blow as many chances.

Dave,

Do you think that the players have the technical skill and tactical acumen even if England land a top notch coach? Just wondering what one of the managerial geniuses could do with that squad - at times they look like they don't have a clue how to fashion an attacking move. And the traditional English strength in net seems to be completely lacking for some reason.

Best wishes,

Doug

fsquid · Post by **fsquid** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 7:48 pm

This news just made me happy. Dave, do you need the Germany to close down this Wembley too?

GB_Simo · Post by **GB_Simo** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 7:57 pm

10spro wrote:Wonder how many fans wished P. Robinson was still the starter?

Not many, I'd have thought. I'll be quite happy to see Scott Carson in goal for England for quite some time, if he's capable of reproducing his club form in national colours. He made a dreadful error tonight, yes, but we got a glimpse of his talent in the second half, and what odds would anyone like to give me on an error-free Robinson performance for his country right now?

McClaren was damned either way with that choice. If he played Robinson, no matter how good Robbo might have been tonight, he'd be criticised for sticking with a goalkeeper who instils as much confidence in his defenders as a blind knife thrower does at a circus. If he played James, he'd be going back to a man who'll never feature in a major international tournament again.

Gerrard, Bridge, Lampard and Barry didn't turn up. Crouch, one of the few to emerge with credit, hardly lost a thing in the air for 45 minutes but had no support - not a case of the Croatians handling him as much as a case of England not bothering to capitalise on his work. Largely devoid of attacking ideas that didn't involve a long ball, and barely capable of even doing that for the last 10 minutes, we were fortunate enough to get back to 2-2 and then sat and invited Croatia on to us, culminating in that third goal when the striker was given time and space to strike. Our entire qualifying campaign has been poor - at least, though, we're free to enjoy a summer of football free from the traditional outbreak of overdone patriotism.

pigpen81 · Post by **pigpen81** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:25 pm

RobVarak wrote:
pigpen81 wrote:
With the Croats at Euro 08, we have to watch the Purina Dig Chow prancy about the pitch again.
Hey now, that's over the line! That's a proud national symbol, hailing as it does from the coat-of-arms of Hrvatska. And you're talking about the Brazilians of Europe, so have some respect!

My bad Rob, no disrespect intended....just an eye sore....I knew there must be a reason for their unis relating to country history....plus...I am bitter they beat England today...a definite sadness in me.

Reminds me of the Maryland State flag....a striking flag that has a history dating back to the civil war whejn in the aftermath...they combined the blue and the gray version into one united flag...pretty cool. Learned that in Annapolis last May on our 8th grade East Coast trip.

Jimmydeicide · Post by **Jimmydeicide** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:26 pm

Mc tithead makes a bold decision to play Carson knowing if he has a howler it might deflect some of the attention after a loss and bringing off a forward when they were down to put on another forward while we had 4 ball watchers still on defense,wtf what difference is it if we have 3 guys standing flat footed watching the ball or 4 it was typical hope this works conservitive mclarten bullshit.

And that shot of him and Venables at the end was classic, Venables may as well been behind him with a big foam finger pointing at him saying "he picked the side" .

Lets play Barry as a stopper while Hargreaves gets wet alongside Becks.
SRPhilips is awful, s*** scared cant beat a man, Beckham at least doesnt have to try and beat anyone to get a cross in.
A very dissapointing day for a lot of lads in so cal today and one British Dominion club left wondering how their gonna make money on Crown green bowling this summer.

RobVarak · Post by **RobVarak** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:35 pm

pigpen81 wrote:
RobVarak wrote:
pigpen81 wrote:
With the Croats at Euro 08, we have to watch the Purina Dig Chow prancy about the pitch again.
Hey now, that's over the line! That's a proud national symbol, hailing as it does from the coat-of-arms of Hrvatska. And you're talking about the Brazilians of Europe, so have some respect!
My bad Rob, no disrespect intended...

NP, Piggy. I was just bustin' your balls. I would've liked to see England go through, and not just because the next several months of handwringing and hair-brained schemes (player quotas etc.) will be unbearable.

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:47 pm

Take the under on McClaren's job life expectancy, fellas. The FA has scheduled a meeting for 8:30 a.m. (GMT) Thursday. He'll be out of a job by the time us Yanks wake up tomorrow.

What about Mourinho as successor? He's very available, but does an elite club manager want to take over a squad whose next meaningful tournament MIGHT be in 2010, especially one with an ego as large as Mourinho's that just craves the big stage?

Take care,
PK

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:52 pm

Pretty biting column about the lack of quality in the England national side now:

http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/sport/2007/ ... _foot.html

Take care,
PK

Jimmydeicide · Post by **Jimmydeicide** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 11:26 pm

I hope we could get Mourinho that would be awsome.

10spro · Post by **10spro** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 1:24 am

J. Mourinho would be the sentimental favorite, but here's a guy that did wonders for Portugal: L. Felipe Scolari.

fsquid · Post by **fsquid** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 1:35 am

10spro wrote:J. Mourinho would be the sentimental favorite, but here's a guy that did wonders for Portugal: L. Felipe Scolari.

England does need to learn how to dive better. Good point.

JRod · Post by **JRod** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 4:54 am

I stayed away from this thread because I wanted to watch the match.

The irony, Becks actually helped the team tonight. Not only that, he was the only one was a threat with his passes.

I don't know about anyone else, but I think Peter Crouch hurts this team. Hear me out, with him in, all they do is hoof it towards him. They don't run with the ball, they don't try 1-2s, its just kick it towards Crouch.

Beckham was the only one running down the channel and getting a cross if from the right. Cole wasn't sending in passes. And when is the media going to look at Gerrard. He was absent today.

Still a good match even though the result wasn't what I wanted. Oh and a quick note about the ref...didn't notice him. That's what's supposed to happen.

davet010 · Post by **davet010** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 5:19 am

Media here hasn't gone into mega-meltdown mode yet because everyone knows that McLaren is a Championship-standard manager who was propelled into position by a mixture of moronic xenophobia and lack of viable other English candidates.

Crouch played well last night - he was perhaps the only one who was obviously thinking about what he was doing. Just a pity that there was no one else up with him, as McLaren decided to play 4-5-1 to accomodate both Fat Frank (man of the match, that got the biggest laugh of the evening) and Stephen Gerrard, as well as the media's latest wonderboy, Gareth Barry. Defoe got another chance to prove that he is not international quality, which he duly accepted with aplomb, and SwP's backward progress since joining Chelsea has been so noticeable that even his dad said that he couldn't understand why he was playing.

Carson is more questionable. Yes the first goal was a howler, but each Robinson game has its own entry in that category, and he was playing behind what is essentially the England 'B' defence. Lack of international experience is not really a stick to beat him with either, as he plays against teams that are better than Croatia regularly in the Premiership.

Mourinho ? Don't think he could hack it, given that he couldn't go out and waste his money-laundering boss's money to cover lack of players in key positions. Unfortunately the problem is that too many of the current crop can't pass a ball 10 yards, read the game or keep possession, and youth team coaches are too often mistaking athleticism for intelligence and skill (yes, Sol Campbell, Rio Ferdinand, Wayne Bridge, Micah Richards et al...I'm referring to you).

On the upside, the u-21's qualified for their version of the Euro Championship with no problem, and do have some promising players.

News Just In ! - It's 10.45am here and McLaren got binned an hour ago. Current front runners at the bookies are Mourinho and the vastly over-rated Martin O'Neill, with Alan Shearer in the mix as well.

Interestingly enough, Fabio Capello has indicated an interest - now THERE is a man used to dealing with tough media (Italy and Spain), who has won things at all levels and is also used to dealing with buffoons in the hierachy above him (a big shout out to Silvio Berlusconi and Ramon Calderon at this point). All of which will rule him out for the post as far as the FA is concerned, no doubt.

Laughably, Stuart Pearce has been put forward 'due to the great job he has done in ensuring England's qualification for the u-21 Euro Championship'. That'll probably come as a surprise to the previous holder of the post, who actually put the squad together.

10spro · Post by **10spro** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:43 pm

If I were Martin O'Neill I would see far more upside in staying at Villa and building a solid team with the youth they have than trying to fix England's National squad. Mourinho would be too much of a circus, so if Capello wants it let him have the job.

Regarding yesterday's failure, actually for a change Crouch was dangerous, Beckham and Cole played fine and of course missing 5-6 starters due to injury and suspension is not easy. They should have groomed Carson for a game of this importance cause he obviously was not ready.

fsquid · Post by **fsquid** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 1:18 pm

Funny thing is that Carson was playing at Sheffield Wednesday 15 months ago

Jimmydeicide · Post by **Jimmydeicide** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 1:48 pm

While Carson did have a a real dodgy game the conditions couldnt be any worse for a goalie and that stupid american football game didnt help things either, now the spoilt brats remember what it was like playing in the pub league on those pitches, Wembly was a disgrace.

And Rod is right its not Crouch's fault as he was probly the best player on the park for us but all they did was try and hoof it up to him the croats ate that up , a bean pole versus a 6ft hod carrier is a mismatch throw another one in and Crouch doesnt have a chance, he did do well tho and a goal of the highest class he scored.

Thank heavens Mclaren is gone.

RobVarak · Post by **RobVarak** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 4:13 pm

JRod wrote:
I don't know about anyone else, but I think Peter Crouch hurts this team. Hear me out, with him in, all they do is hoof it towards him. They don't run with the ball, they don't try 1-2s, its just kick it towards Crouch.

Liverpool had the same problem when they first signed him. They were totally preoccupied with crossing to him. This made them one dimensional and played away from his strengths, which are nodding the ball down for others and playing the ball at his feet. They started the season very poorly in part due to this mistake, but once they learned how to use him he became much more effective and valuable.

Then he apparently ran over Rafa's dog or something...

fsquid · Post by **fsquid** » Fri Nov 23, 2007 5:28 pm

England doesn't qualify and now Dave Allen just resigned from WEdnesday. I really don't think this day could get much better.