OT: Racing 2007 (Spoiler Alert)

Smurfy · Post by **Smurfy** » Sat Oct 06, 2007 6:31 pm

Sorry to take this thread a little back in time, but I just want to say that after the Japanese Grand Prix I've changed my mind about Lewis Hamilton. Having survived that weekend without making any major errors I now agree that he'd be a deserving champion should he win it.

I really hope that Alonso stays with McLaren for next year. Formula One was better off with Prost and Senna in the same team and I think it would be better off with Alonso and Hamilton duking it out next year at McLaren. Unfortunately, it looks like Alonso has made it impossible for himself to stay with McLaren. I wish that something would happen to clear the air and fix the relationship between him and Ron Dennis.

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Sat Oct 06, 2007 6:57 pm

I say theres a 1 % chance Fernando will be back at McLaren next year. Flavio has already stated he wants him back and Fernando is all to eager to be the number 1 guy again.

I'm curious to see how McLaren will fare in 1 to 2 years down the road without Fernando. I say that because I have no doubt he defined what was wrong with the McLaren and had the engineers make the proper changes and presto within a short time he helped them get the car on the right track.

If he does the same thing at Renault or wherever he goes then we can say for sure he had something to do with McLarens turn around this year. I also think from reading his comments that he thinks he put the McLaren on te right track as well and he wants credit for that.

Don't be totally surprised if Alonzo is driving a Red car regardless of what Jean Todt says. Luca Di Montezemolo wants him badly and rumors were being floated that they were offering him 45 million per year to drive for Ferrari. I guess there's more than one George Steinbrenner.

And Kudos to Lewis a well earned Championship. A new F1 star is born. Bernie apparently is gushing over his new found star supposedly calling him F1's savior. I never knew F1 was in that much trouble.

GB_Simo · Post by **GB_Simo** » Sat Oct 06, 2007 9:38 pm

Rodster wrote:I'm curious to see how McLaren will fare in 1 to 2 years down the road without Fernando. I say that because I have no doubt he defined what was wrong with the McLaren and had the engineers make the proper changes and presto within a short time he helped them get the car on the right track.

Well, they'll be absolutely fine. Fernando Alonso isn't the first megastar to drive a McLaren, nor will he be the last. It's probably a bit much to take a team that's spent over a quarter of a century, in its present guise, fighting for and winning races and world titles, and then wonder how they'll fare without Alonso. They managed just fine without Prost, without Senna, without Lauda, without Hakkinen, and built the class of the 2005 field with Montoya and Raikkonen as their race drivers - nobody's going to tell me they're renowned as sorters of a car.

Edit: Oh, about Lewis - he's not won the title yet. My little heart is thumping through my chest with nerves already, don't go jinxing him...

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Sat Oct 06, 2007 10:35 pm

There is no possible way Hamilton can lose the championship. I think I heard an overweight lady belting out some tunes so yeah it's in the bag for Lewis.

As far as Fernando goes i'm of the feeling that he's partly responsible for McLarens good fortunes as of late. I'm one to give him credit. How many championships did McLaren win with Kimi, Juan and David once Mika retired? It's ironic Fernando shows up and if it weren't for the Spy row they would have bagged both championships.

While Fernando was at Renault similar things happened. The car was developed and became a contender and shortly after won back to back championships. Obviously not all credit goes to Fernando but I don't think it's a coincidence he leaves a championship team goes to a contending team and within the same year they almost won both championships.

IMO and again just my two cents that Fernando and Michael have that special something that wherever they land the team quickly turns around. Something Kimi or Felipe have not been able to do. Ferrari has fielded cars this year which has not been reliable. But I also think a world class championship driver such as Michael and Fernando seem to pass on to their team whether it's a certain level of confidence or what we call it here in the US..."IT". I don't know, but both Michael and Fernando have that "IT" working for them.

Again maybe i'm in the minority here on DSP but I have to give credit to Fernando for taking the team over the hump. Hell even Dennis on several occasions has admitted that bringing Alonzo to McLaren has been highly beneficial in the teams sudden turn around. Maybe that's why Montezemolo is considering throwing some crazy money Fernando's way.

GB_Simo · Post by **GB_Simo** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 8:41 am

Rodster wrote:There is no possible way Hamilton can lose the championship. I think I heard an overweight lady belting out some tunes so yeah it's in the bag for Lewis.

You, ah, might want to rethink. Lord, my heart sank so quickly this morning.

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 8:56 am

Oh crap, I didn't want to come on DSP after I read what happened, that sucks for Lewis and it would be great to see him take it. I haven't watched the race yet but by all accounts it wasn't all on him. It appears his team took the blame for letting him drive on badly worn tyres one extra lap. And the track got real tricky.

He's still in the drivers seat as all he needs to do is finish 2nd and he wins the title. Come on Lewis you can do it.

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 9:32 am

I know it's remote, but there's a part of me that wants Raikkonen to win the title. All Kimi has done is shut his mouth and drive this season.

Alonso is a selfish, immature prat of whom the world has seen his true character this year. He's not the saint or sympathetic figure everyone thought in the past two years; he's more Machiavellian than Schumacher EVER was.

Schumacher may have been a prick on track, but he was fanatically loyal to his team. Alonso is loyal only to himself and his inner circle, which doesn't include anyone on McLaren. He's a f*ck.

Hamilton isn't pure, either. He's more than willing to practice gamesmanship on the track, and his anti-Alonso comments have become more bitter and open in the last two weeks. He knows he's Ron's boy, and he's using that strength in more open attacks against Alonso. Not exactly the perfect team leader.

Kimi, despite his reticence, remains one of the few captivating figures in F1 because of his insouciance. It appears he doesn't give a f*ck about much besides driving as fast as possible and drinking as much vodka as possible with his friends.

In the incredibly overwrought, self-important world of F1, I like that detachment. I would love to see a guy who is a throwback to old-school hellraisers like James Hunt, Innes Ireland and Graham Hill win the title instead of a prat like Alonso or Hamilton, who is almost more of an experiment from Ron Dennis' 10-year petri dish than a driver I can connect with.

The only negative about Kimi winning the title is that he drives for Ferrari, which I despise. Ferrari and Alonso would be ideal bedfellows, as they share qualities of petty jealousy, paranoia and deceit.

Take care,
PK

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 9:43 am

pk500 wrote: Kimi, despite his reticence, remains one of the few captivating figures in F1 because of his insouciance. It appears he doesn't give a f*ck about much besides driving as fast as possible and drinking as much vodka as possible with his friends.

In the incredibly overwrought, self-important world of F1, I like that detachment. I would love to see a guy who is a throwback to old-school hellraisers like James Hunt, Innes Ireland and Graham Hill win the title

Take care,
PK

That's exactly what I like about Kimi too. Just give me the damn race car, but wait let me get sober first.

GB_Simo · Post by **GB_Simo** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 2:47 pm

Being English I'm naturally pulling for Hamilton, and it was agonising this morning watching his car stuck only a yard or two from the safety of the pit lane entrance - had he made it that far, he'd be champion tonight, but he didn't. As you said, Rod, it's still his title to lose, since whatever happens in Brazil he doesn't have to win, which can't be said of the two men behind him. If Ferrari are quicker, Lewis can take a safe 4th place, and if McLaren are quicker he has only to make sure that his performance emphasises that. He's still the favourite, but we've seen twice in the last seven days how quickly fortunes can change.

I was thinking earlier of 1986. Mansell was the overwhelming favourite with two races left, cocked it all up in Mexico when beating his team mate Piquet would have been enough (a bit different to Lewis, in that Nigel did score points but did so after trying to start with the car either in 3rd gear or no gear at all, depending who you believe), and then had that tyre failure in Adelaide. Hamilton wouldn't be the first odds-on British favourite to fall at the last, and Kimi might wish to remember that in '86, the rank outsider Prost came through to take the title in the last round. Two more contrasting driving styles would be hard to find, but the result might yet pan out the same.

Sticking the neutral hat on for a second, all this uncertainty and doubt over who'll win the big prize is wonderful, isn't it?

Smurfy · Post by **Smurfy** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 11:10 pm

I was clapping when I saw Hamilton come to a stop in the gravel. It's going to make the last race so exciting (I hope). It's Hamilton's to lose and Alonso and Kimi have no reason to play it safe. This should really show us what they are made of.

I'm in the minority here as I'm still more of an Alonso fan than a Hamilton fan. Now I'm pretty ignorant about racing, but I suspect that Rodster's evaluation of Alonso's contribution to McLaren is correct.

However, I also agree with PK that it would be sweet indeed if Kimi were to take the championship this year. Hitting Alonso and Hamilton with a large humble stick might be what the doctor ordered.

Jimmydeicide · Post by **Jimmydeicide** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 2:40 am

Smurfy wrote:I was clapping when I saw Hamilton come to a stop in the gravel. It's going to make the last race so exciting (I hope). It's Hamilton's to lose and Alonso and Kimi have no reason to play it safe. This should really show us what they are made of.

I'm in the minority here as I'm still more of an Alonso fan than a Hamilton fan. Now I'm pretty ignorant about racing, but I suspect that Rodster's evaluation of Alonso's contribution to McLaren is correct.

However, I also agree with PK that it would be sweet indeed if Kimi were to take the championship this year. Hitting Alonso and Hamilton with a large humble stick might be what the doctor ordered.

Your right you are ignorant if you think Mclaren are were they are cos of Alonso. If any of you have followed F1 for any length of time how can you see Mclaren as anything but a top team with whoever is driving. Do you think they are borrowing some money from Alonso to pay their 400million fine ? no they are honouring their employee bonus's for winning the constructors championship.
No doubt the drivers are a very important ingredient in the Mclaren recipe. And as someone said i think rodster earlier in the season about the same thing before all the crying from Alonso, Mclaren would be were they are at with out Alonso.

Sudz · Post by **Sudz** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 1:17 pm

i was watching the STATES on the history channel...

and they were talking about the indy 500....and how they don't release any attendance data... what is up with that?

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 1:37 pm

Alonso and Raikkonen unfazed by Bernie rebuke

Fernando Alonso and Kimi Raikkonen have dismissed Bernie Ecclestone's claim that Lewis Hamilton would make a better World Champion.

F1's chief executive said last weekend that Alonso has "done nothing" for the sport since winning back-to-back titles in 2005 and 2006.

Fellow championship contender Kimi Raikkonen, he added, "barely talks to anyone."

"Everyone has their opinion," Spaniard Alonso said after Sunday's Chinese Grand Prix. "I try to be professional. I don't know what I have to do. I have a contract to drive the car and be with the sponsors, which is normal, so I try to do both things at the same time and that's all."

Finn Raikkonen's response on the other hand, was predictably true to form.

I don't really care too much what people say about me," the Ferrari driver said.

That's what I like about Kimi. Just let me drive the damn car, and I don't give a sh*t about anything else.

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 1:39 pm

Sudz wrote:i was watching the STATES on the history channel...

and they were talking about the indy 500....and how they don't release any attendance data... what is up with that?

Never have, never will. IMS is a private, family-owned company and isn't obligated to any corporation traded publicly or any governing body to release its attendance figures, so it doesn't.

The only fact you'll ever get out of IMS -- and me -- is that with more than 250,000 permanent seats, the Indianapolis Motor Speedway is the world's largest spectator-seating sporting facility.

Take care,
PK

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 1:45 pm

Kimi talks to his mates and a lot of strippers in London after downing endless bottles of vodka. So Bernie is a bit off the mark.

Then again, Bernie is the guy who loves to talk sh*t just to stir attention to the sport. Remember, he called Danica Patrick a nice "appliance" after her strong performance as a rookie in the 2005 Indy 500.

Strange, though, as the title showdown at Brazil will generate enough publicity on its own. Bernie really didn't need to open his wizened trap this time.

And saying Lewis will be a better champion for F1 is one of the all-time "no sh*t?" statements of the year.

Let's see:

Lewis is English, and England is the epicenter of the world's motorsport press and the home of the most voracious and prolific tabloids in the world. CHECK.

Lewis is black. He would be the first black man to win a World Championship. CHECK.

Lewis has a dynamic public personality compared to Raikkonen and Alonso. He's dynamite for sponsors and as an ambassador for F1. CHECK.

Lewis is extremely close with his father and his brother, who suffers from cerebral palsy and is confined to a wheelchair. A great human-interest story. CHECK.

Lewis would be the first rookie in F1 history to win a World Championship. CHECK.

So, Lewis really would be a better World Champion for F1 than Alonso or Kimi? You don't say, Bernie?

Take care,
PK

Sudz · Post by **Sudz** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 1:54 pm

pk500 wrote:
Sudz wrote:i was watching the STATES on the history channel...

and they were talking about the indy 500....and how they don't release any attendance data... what is up with that?
Never have, never will. IMS is a private, family-owned company and isn't obligated to any corporation traded publicly or any governing body to release its attendance figures, so it doesn't.

The only fact you'll ever get out of IMS -- and me -- is that with more than 250,000 permanent seats, the Indianapolis Motor Speedway is the world's largest spectator-seating sporting facility.

Take care,
PK

thanks.

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 1:56 pm

pk500 wrote:Kimi talks to his mates and a lot of strippers in London after downing endless bottles of vodka. So Bernie is a bit off the mark.

Take care,
PK

So true !

Gurantsu · Post by **Gurantsu** » Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:39 pm

So I'm scrolling through the recordings on my DVR, and lo and behold the first race of the A1GP season from Zandvoort was there.

Man, what a great series. Fantastic battles and passing, plus I like the sprint/full race format. And I like that they run a lot of classic tracks that other major series don't.

I was surprised to see Buddy Rice driving the US car.

I also just saw that Ferrari will be supplying the engines for the series starting next year.

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Fri Oct 12, 2007 4:16 pm

Grant:

There's an rFactor mod based on A1GP, under a different name:

http://www.rfactorcentral.com/detail.cf ... 20WorldCup

I haven't tried it.

Take care,
PK

Gurantsu · Post by **Gurantsu** » Fri Oct 12, 2007 4:47 pm

I have an older version of the mod, and it's not bad at all. But there are so many cool open wheel mods that I haven't played this one much.

The cars were stable and a bit generic, which for a mod geared directly for an online league is probably a good thing.

DChaps · Post by **DChaps** » Fri Oct 12, 2007 6:21 pm

I actually have the "banned" A1GP mod from idT (Champcar mod creators). I think the story is that they were actually making the mod for the series, then official A1GP support backed out, lawyers involved, etc., etc. It was never completely finished, but it is actually not bad. I would be glad to provide it to you as long as no one tells on me.

GB_Simo · Post by **GB_Simo** » Fri Oct 12, 2007 6:39 pm

I won't tell. I won't tell a soul.

When they're on their mettle, the A1GP driving staff provide some of the best single seater racing there is. When they aren't, or when they're the Lebanese entry or something like that, they're compelling viewing for altogether crashier reasons, but there've been some very talented drivers in there already and it's well worth watching if you've not already done so.

Latest rumours at the F1 driver merry-go-round have Kovalainen and Alonso swapping places for 2008, thus sticking Fernando back in a Renault but without the possibility of being beaten by another new kid on the block. I'm sad to see Alex Wurz going - even if this season hasn't been stellar, he's always been a favourite of mine and a classy fella to boot - but it'll be interesting to see if Kazuki Nakajima is any faster than his dad was, though it seems Liuzzi to Williams is a done deal for next season so Kazuki's race is probably a one-off rather than a job application.

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Fri Oct 12, 2007 7:38 pm

GB_Simo wrote: Latest rumours at the F1 driver merry-go-round have Kovalainen and Alonso swapping places for 2008, thus sticking Fernando back in a Renault but without the possibility of being beaten by another new kid on the block. I'm sad to see Alex Wurz going - even if this season hasn't been stellar, he's always been a favourite of mine and a classy fella to boot - but it'll be interesting to see if Kazuki Nakajima is any faster than his dad was, though it seems Liuzzi to Williams is a done deal for next season so Kazuki's race is probably a one-off rather than a job application.

It doesn't surprise me with regards to Alonzo. Most of the online press are indicating Alonzo has already signed an intent with Renault when he's released from McLaren. The driver swap also makes sense in more ways than one. Apparently Toyota was willing to pay Fernando $150 million for 3 years. I still think Hammy will take it next week the odds are stacked in his favor.

It's sad to see Wurz go and watching his interview at Spa prior to the race he appeared to have lost his edge. He confirmed that with his retirement speech. He said if i'm ever unsure driving a race car that's the time to leave. A class guy but the good news is he has several things lined up already.

Gurantsu · Post by **Gurantsu** » Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:17 pm

DChaps wrote:I actually have the "banned" A1GP mod from idT (Champcar mod creators). I think the story is that they were actually making the mod for the series, then official A1GP support backed out, lawyers involved, etc., etc. It was never completely finished, but it is actually not bad. I would be glad to provide it to you as long as no one tells on me.

I'm interested!

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:19 pm

Agree with all of you on Wurz. Total class, and along with Webber, probably the most regular guy among the current F1 drivers.

Speaking of driver salaries, it was rumored in last week's Autosport that Hamilton could command $100 million per season for his next McLaren contract. Sponsors are apparently so eager to associate themselves with him that their sponsorship fees would help offset the huge salary.

There is a precedent: Schumacher's $40 million annual salary in his final contract with Ferrari was paid by Phillip Morris. McLaren could assemble a few blue-chip sponsors with that kind of money to align themselves with Lewis.

Take care,
PK