Madden 08 full game video

sportdan30 · Post by **sportdan30** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 1:04 pm

I agree about the weapons feature as being rather a minor addition. Sure, it'll definitely help the novice player and myself at times, but I'm still going to throw to Torry Holt when he's open despite having a great corner on him.

Now, if that comment about the defensive player magically intercepting a pass when he's not close to the receiver happens too frequently, then that'll be quite disappointing.

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:48 pm

My expectations are much lower as to relieve some of the pain to come.

Last year was the first time I ever returned a madden game before the football season was over. I just hope it is enjoyable enough to last through December if not there will be plenty of non sports games to fill the void.

I think a lot of people have unrealistic expectations on what can happen in a year and how much they will actually change. At the end of the day when your game sells like crazy none of the suits are going to let you tinker too much.

MizzouRah · Post by **MizzouRah** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:58 pm

I'm definitly waiting on thoughts from here and some other places before picking up Madden this year.

wco81 · Post by **wco81** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:37 pm

The elite DEs do make a lot of speed rushes so you have to step up and under them to buy some time.

People online will control them and speed burst for a wide rush, often beating most tackles around the edge.

This is before they even deal with Weapons in 08.

spooky157 · Post by **spooky157** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 3:06 pm

Just saw this producer's blog on Madden...it's looking good.

http://www.easports.com/maddennfl/blogs.jsp

More game videos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYsMMs7asAU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7fvaoxa2gw

10spro · Post by **10spro** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 11:55 pm

More Previews:

http://media.xbox360.ign.com/media/868/ ... ids_1.html

Inuyasha · Post by **Inuyasha** » Fri Aug 03, 2007 1:33 am

I am getting excited about madden this year too now. Just with the 2k competition, maybe the game will be fun to play and all the bells and whistles added.

Just off the previews, the way the game comes off has me looking forward to it. Not sure if that means anything, but for me it's positive. The last decent madden imo was madden2005. Same year as NFL2K5.

wco81 · Post by **wco81** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 1:02 am

Just saw a Madden commercial on ESPN.

It had a Xbox 360 logo at the end and no other logos.

So that means Microsoft probably paid at least part of the cost to air it.

Perhaps the 60 fps vs. 30 fps thing has more to do with business arrangements than technology.

b_assassin · Post by **b_assassin** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 1:44 am

wco81 wrote:Just saw a Madden commercial on ESPN.

It had a Xbox 360 logo at the end and no other logos.

So that means Microsoft probably paid at least part of the cost to air it.

Perhaps the 60 fps vs. 30 fps thing has more to do with business arrangements than technology.

Indeed, making a cross-platform game run at 60fps on the PS3 is as easy as cashing the check from Sony.

wco81 · Post by **wco81** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 2:15 am

b_assassin wrote: Indeed, making a cross-platform game run at 60fps on the PS3 is as easy as cashing the check from Sony.

Maybe not easy but EA hasn't exactly said why there's a difference.

In any event, iD just announced their next game called Rage, using it's Tech 5 engine, will run at 60 fps on both consoles.

Carmack said he hired a PS3 specialist to optimize for PS3. Now, EA probably doesn't have as talented developers as iD but Tiburon alone probably has a bigger staff than all of iD.

There will be more multiplatform games, such as Dirt, where the PS3 version does a lot more.

DivotMaker · Post by **DivotMaker** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 6:30 am

wco81 wrote: Maybe not easy but EA hasn't exactly said why there's a difference.

In any event, iD just announced their next game called Rage, using it's Tech 5 engine, will run at 60 fps on both consoles.

Carmack said he hired a PS3 specialist to optimize for PS3. Now, EA probably doesn't have as talented developers as iD but Tiburon alone probably has a bigger staff than all of iD.

There will be more multiplatform games, such as Dirt, where the PS3 version does a lot more.

The difference at this stage of the game is that the 360 development tools are much farther along than the PS3 dev tools. The 360 is just flat out easier to program for and the tools that MS is providing have improved dramatically since the 07 versions of EA Sports games were released. I expect that by this time next year, the PS3 tools will be much improved and the games will all run at 60 fps and have even more detail and garphical enhancements.

Carmack has been openly critical of the PS3 as the most difficult console to program for. He does not care for the way PS3 allocates memory nor how much memory footprint the PS3 OS runs on. I have not heard that he is hiring a specialist to optimize for the PS3, but iD can afford that luxury as their games are typically AAA games that succeed critically and commercially.

Comparing iD to Tiburon is apples to oranges IMO, since Tiburon is now doing 3-4 games for EA and Madden alone assures a large staff with everything that is riding on that game.

Not sure why you say the "PS3 will do alot more" when it comes to multiplatform games. There is very little difference between the two machines from a hardware capability/output perspective. Sounds more like Sony PR at work again and/or wishful thinking.

Lastly, I do NOT buy into the conspiracy theories that MS or Sony could "write a check" and ensure their games will run at 60 fps or double their current performance. If that were indeed the case, why hasn't Sony done such a thing already? Utter nonsense, again IMO....

Wilk5280 · Post by **Wilk5280** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 9:00 am

wco81 wrote:Just saw a Madden commercial on ESPN.

It had a Xbox 360 logo at the end and no other logos.

So that means Microsoft probably paid at least part of the cost to air it.

Perhaps the 60 fps vs. 30 fps thing has more to do with business arrangements than technology.

This is nothing new. I've seen many commercials over the years for multi-platform games that ended with a system specific logo. I've seen them for Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft.

wco81 · Post by **wco81** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 9:49 am

I could see EA having problems if they were pushing graphics like the concept video. Remember that, and how EA promised the game itself would look even better?

Have they kept their promises after 2 next-gen Madden releases? The previews for Madden 08 also do not look anything like that concept video.

Sports games are at the bottom of the technological barrel. There's nothing special going on in Madden in terms of shaders and lighting compared to other console games.

Do more as in the case of Dirt for the PS3 which will have more consistent frame rates, 7.1 sound track versus 5.1 soundtrack.

But Dirt is using a proprietary engine developed for consoles while a lot of other multiplatform games are using Direct X (because they're often supporting PC SKUs).

On the logo thing, you usually see logos of all the platforms supported by the game. But in this case, it was only Xbox 360 Live. So it appears MS and EA have some kind of co-op arrangement for that particular commercial at least.

I'm not saying EA definitely capped the PS3 frame rate when they could have done better, just suggesting that EA has more financial incentives with MS right now. They also have an in-game ad deal with Massive for the X360 version. Massive is owned by MS.

If EA said, the reason the PS3 frame rates are low is that the PS3 tools are inadequate or PS3 doesn't have enough memory or bandwidth or whatever, then there wouldn't be this speculation. But AFAIK, they haven't given a reason.

DivotMaker · Post by **DivotMaker** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 10:16 am

wco81 wrote:I could see EA having problems if they were pushing graphics like the concept video. Remember that, and how EA promised the game itself would look even better?

Have they kept their promises after 2 next-gen Madden releases? The previews for Madden 08 also do not look anything like that concept video.

Did it ever occur to you that possibly Sony and MS were telling them that the PS3/360 would be able to render the game like the concept video?

wco81 wrote:Sports games are at the bottom of the technological barrel. There's nothing special going on in Madden in terms of shaders and lighting compared to other console games.

Golf games aren't bottom of the barrel. They use all of the latest rendering effects, especially heavy use of shaders and dynamic lighting.

wco81 wrote:Do more as in the case of Dirt for the PS3 which will have more consistent frame rates, 7.1 sound track versus 5.1 soundtrack.

But Dirt is using a proprietary engine developed for consoles while a lot of other multiplatform games are using Direct X (because they're often supporting PC SKUs).

Got a link supporting the more consistent frame rates? I would believe it if the PS3 was the machine the game was developed on then ported to the 360...

wco81 wrote:On the logo thing, you usually see logos of all the platforms supported by the game. But in this case, it was only Xbox 360 Live. So it appears MS and EA have some kind of co-op arrangement for that particular commercial at least.

No idea on that.

wco81 wrote:I'm not saying EA definitely capped the PS3 frame rate when they could have done better, just suggesting that EA has more financial incentives with MS right now. They also have an in-game ad deal with Massive for the X360 version. Massive is owned by MS.

Because the 360 was out a full year prior to the PS3 and the fact that the 360 development tools are far more mature than the PS3's, EA is using the 360 as the base for development, then porting to the PS3. I suspect they will continue to do so until Sony shows a tremendous improvement in the PS3 dev tools to the point that it is easier to build on the PS3, then port to 360.

wco81 wrote:If EA said, the reason the PS3 frame rates are low is that the PS3 tools are inadequate or PS3 doesn't have enough memory or bandwidth or whatever, then there wouldn't be this speculation. But AFAIK, they haven't given a reason.

They aren't going to make such a statement because they have a very good relationship with Sony. EA will never admit to such a thing publicly, but I am quite sure that Sony understands fully what is going on and why, otherwise they would be making one helluva stink about it publicly. And to date, they have not said a word about this publicly that I have seen....

Leebo33 · Post by **Leebo33** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 11:56 am

DivotMaker wrote:Got a link supporting the more consistent frame rates? I would believe it if the PS3 was the machine the game was developed on then ported to the 360...

http://www.psxextreme.com/ps3-news/1503.html

wco81 · Post by **wco81** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 12:34 pm

Golf games don't have much going on screen at a given time. And they cater to gamers with high-end PCs so they've developed better technology to support people with high-end hardware.

But even with that, nobody is going to confuse any golf game with the top FPS or even racing games.

As for your tools argument, there may be some truth but first and second-party games are able to achieve high performance.

I haven't seen the MLB The Show graphics or Madden 08 but in the first year, they're getting 60 fps. I don't know if the baseball stadium models are more or less detailed than the NFL stadium models in Madden. Of course there are fewer baseball players on-screen at a given time than a football game.

Another good comparison will be the NBA2K and NBA Live games versus Sony's NBA game, which is already 1080p60. Of course, arguably, they may have traded off more effects and detail for rendering twice the number of pixels (than 720p) and running at 60 fps instead of 30 fps or lower.

So some development teams are able to use the available tools to get better results. Now maybe Sony is keeping some of these tools for themselves, letting only first and second party developers have access to them.

But it's hard to imagine that if EA really wanted better frame rate for the PS3 version, they couldn't have demanded better 3rd-party developer support from Sony and not received it, given how big Madden was on the PS2 and how big it still is.

DivotMaker · Post by **DivotMaker** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 1:30 pm

Leebo33 wrote:
DivotMaker wrote:Got a link supporting the more consistent frame rates? I would believe it if the PS3 was the machine the game was developed on then ported to the 360...
http://www.psxextreme.com/ps3-news/1503.html

I stand corrected. Thanks for the link.

DivotMaker · Post by **DivotMaker** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 1:39 pm

wco81 wrote:Golf games don't have much going on screen at a given time. And they cater to gamers with high-end PCs so they've developed better technology to support people with high-end hardware.

But even with that, nobody is going to confuse any golf game with the top FPS or even racing games.

Absolute bullshit. Have you seen TW07? The entire environment is animated from the dynamic clouds that have dynamic shadows to individual blades of grass that move with the wind. 3D trees are THE most difficult objects to render in ANY game. You show me a single FPS or racing game that animates and renders dynamic trees on the fly or even better yet, CONVINCINGLY. TW07 does. You should do some research before you make such statements.

wco81 wrote:As for your tools argument, there may be some truth but first and second-party games are able to achieve high performance.

It is NOT an argument. It is a FACT. Numerous developers are commenting publicly about the difficulty of programming for the PS3 and how the tools are nowhere near as easy to work with as Sony's.

wco81 wrote:So some development teams are able to use the available tools to get better results. Now maybe Sony is keeping some of these tools for themselves, letting only first and second party developers have access to them.

Why in the hell would Sony do that? If you are dead last in the NG race and your product is STARVING for AAA games, why would you keep ANYTHING to yourself? That makes NO sense whatsoever.

wco81 wrote:But it's hard to imagine that if EA really wanted better frame rate for the PS3 version, they couldn't have demanded better 3rd-party developer support from Sony and not received it, given how big Madden was on the PS2 and how big it still is.

Who says they didn't ask for support and this is the best they could get at this point in time? You seem to think that people can make a phone call and suddenly the performance of the code will double....unreal.

wco81 · Post by **wco81** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 2:36 pm

Show me any review, preview or article where Tiger Woods graphics are compared to Crysis, Gears of War.

Warhawk and Lair will have volumetric clouds.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lair_(video_game)

Again, all I said was no golf game is as highly regarded technologically as other games. No need to get combative -- you didn't personally develop TW did you?

As for Sony's willingness to share tools, it may be that they apply them first to their in-house games before talking about them to everyone else. Sony does have a lot of first and second-party games in development.

At this year's GDC, they had 3 engineers present on the EDGE acceleration tools. One of the 3 was a Naughty Dog guy who'd worked on Resistance and perhaps, some on the upcoming Uncharted (which you might be interested to know has some really beautiful foliage, since you're interested in 3-D trees). This is the guy that Carmack snagged recently for iD.

Sony is certainly interested in furthering the platform so it will support 3rd-party developers. But it also makes money from publishing and selling first and second-party games.

In the PS1 days, there were suspicions about GameDay having better frame rate and polygons while EA had said polygons weren't possible for PS1 football games. Sony Sports may have had access to libraries that EA didn't have.

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 3:05 pm

I know were not suppose to play mod around here, but guys could we please get this back on topic.

DivotMaker · Post by **DivotMaker** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 4:52 pm

wco81 wrote:Show me any review, preview or article where Tiger Woods graphics are compared to Crysis, Gears of War.

There is no such comparison or I would have linked them. You have to experience the dynamic environment of TW07 to have an appreciation of what it is. Obviously, you have not experienced it or you would not have made such comments regarding Golf games.

wco81 wrote:Warhawk and Lair will have volumetric clouds.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lair_(video_game)

Over a year after TW07 has them is not all that impressive to me, especially if those games are not rendering 3D dynamic trees.

wco81 wrote:Again, all I said was no golf game is as highly regarded technologically as other games. No need to get combative -- you didn't personally develop TW did you?

Golf games in general have never been highly regarded because until recently, none of them could render the kind of environments that would get them noticed. Golf games are a niche' product and probably always will be.

wco81 wrote:As for Sony's willingness to share tools, it may be that they apply them first to their in-house games before talking about them to everyone else. Sony does have a lot of first and second-party games in development.

AGAIN, if Sony has such tools and they are NOT sharing them with companies who can directly impact their ability to sell more PS3's, they are freaking stupid. There is NO justification for sitting on tools that can help you sell your product.

DivotMaker · Post by **DivotMaker** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 4:53 pm

Danimal wrote:I know were not suppose to play mod around here, but guys could we please get this back on topic.

Sorry Dan...no more threadjacking from me...

Slumberland · Post by **Slumberland** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 4:56 pm

I, for one, am excited to enact the yearly ritual of playing Madden for a week and then regretting my purchase. Tradition is comforting.

AJColossal · Post by **AJColossal** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 5:15 pm

Slumberland wrote:I, for one, am excited to enact the yearly ritual of playing Madden for a week and then regretting my purchase. Tradition is comforting.

That was my modus operandi every year, but I think I have the strength this year to hold off, partly due to the quality of APF, and also because of what I've seen from previews that concern me.

One of the developer diaries I saw show how the db AI is so "beefed up" this year, with the video showing dbs jumping around blindly like the Flying Barzinni Brothers, making one improbable interception after the other. Couple this with the interception fest that NCAA turned out to be, and we might be in for some issues.

This is a wait-and-see year for Madden for me, the first in I don't even know how long.

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 5:32 pm

AJColossal wrote:
Slumberland wrote:I, for one, am excited to enact the yearly ritual of playing Madden for a week and then regretting my purchase. Tradition is comforting.
That was my modus operandi every year, but I think I have the strength this year to hold off, partly due to the quality of APF, and also because of what I've seen from previews that concern me.

One of the developer diaries I saw show how the db AI is so beefed up this year, with the video showing dbs jumping around blindly like the Flying Barzinni Brothers, making one improbable interception after the other. Couple this with the interception fest that NCAA turned out to be, and we might be in for some issues.

This is a wait and see year for Madden for me, the first in I don't even know how long.

You're not alone. This is the first year since 1998 that I didn't buy NCAA Football. I've been disappointed the last several years with half baked releases and last year's 360 effort was a turn off. I'm not feeling Madden this year as well..