OT - Apple iPod Nano

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 6:19 pm

Oh, and Ghost...you can hang it around your neck...the only problem is that you need to buy the headphones that have the lanyard built in. I'm all about the pocket at the gym so that's no big deal to me. Plus, with the way it scratches...I wouldn't want the thing hanging around banging into equipment and stuff like that at the gym. And the headphones are 40 bones...eeesh. Hopefully they come out with a lanyard skin case (iskin or javo-edge probably will). That's what I'll go with.

wco81 · Post by **wco81** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 7:49 pm

That's why I prefer the anodized aluminum over the glossy plastic and the steel used in the regular iPods. If there weren't skins and cases for those things, people would be sick of those designs.

The Minis were the best-sellers, mostly because of size but the aluminum let them have colors for the cases.

According to iLounge, they didn't notice any sound difference when they briefly checked it out at the event. The hard-disk players used Portaplayer chips while the Shuffles used SigmaTel chips.

Those tubes seem to give them colors that cover up the white or black.

I wonder about the headphone port on the bottom (and it's incompatible with iTrip and other accessories which draw power from the port). Apple is suppose to have a headphone/lanyard combo but it's with those Apple buds (although lot of people still seem to want to be seen with those white buds in public.)

Hope they have a belt-clip option too.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 7:58 pm

The more I listen, the more I'm not impressed. I did the pepsi challenge after tweaking the sound on the Ipod and it just doesn't sound anywhere close to the iAudio I have. It's rather disappointing actually...when I was listening to it earlier, I didn't have the iAudio next to me to test against...now that I do...I'm actually kind of pissed. We'll see if I can tweak it some more to get an acceptable sound. Why Apple hasn't improved on the sound in the last year since the 4g came out is beyond me.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 8:45 pm

Well I will sell my 4gb Black Nano to anyone who wants it. $250 shipped via Paypal. So you save $35-40 (no tax, no shipping) rather than buying it in the store. Both of us save money that way because Apple has their ridiculous restocking fee.

If you are happy with the iPod sound then the Nano is par for the course...I'm just used to my iAudio and it doesn't compare in my ears.

If anyone wants it, obviously still in brand new condition since I returned the first one I scratched...lol. The only thing that has been opened is the USB cable...everything else is still brand new and sealed (headphones included).

I'm going to list it on Ebay later tonight if no one here wants it first.

tsunami · Post by **tsunami** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 9:02 pm

dbdynsty25 wrote:Well I will sell my 4gb Black Nano to anyone who wants it. $250 shipped via Paypal. So you save $35-40 (no tax, no shipping) rather than buying it in the store. Both of us save money that way because Apple has their ridiculous restocking fee.

If you are happy with the iPod sound then the Nano is par for the course...I'm just used to my iAudio and it doesn't compare in my ears.

If anyone wants it, obviously still in brand new condition since I returned the first one I scratched...lol. The only thing that has been opened is the USB cable...everything else is still brand new and sealed (headphones included).

I'm going to list it on Ebay later tonight if no one here wants it first.

Wow...that didn't take long! I have an idea for a new business...electronic/gear rentals! It could be a new Netflix type business model and maybe db could be my first customer.

Actually, I thought about something like this for fashion clothes/accesories since they are so cyclical and can often be expensive. But it would be perfect for people who want that great outfit/accessory for a big party or event or just want to have new things all the time without paying full prices.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 9:05 pm

Yeah...all I had to do was take it home and compare it to my iAudio player.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 10:16 pm

Now it's on ebay for $240 shipped. I guess that is the going rate.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... %3AIT&rd=1

Dave · Post by **Dave** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 10:20 pm

Could be a record for the forum.

PK & DB take a combined 4 trips to the mall.

Both products end up on eBay by the end of the day.

Fortunately, I do most of my listening on a city bus and on crappy speakers at work, so the sound quality isn't as big a deal for me.

Out of curiosity, have you listened to a shuffle? Would like to know if you noticed a difference between it and the other iPods. I've only listened to the 3 & 4G and a mini, so I'd be interested to know what you think.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 10:26 pm

I have never listened to a Shuffle...I think they are ridiculous so I never bothered to even try one. According to the guys at the ipod lounge, the sound is similar. I guess if you don't listen to the iAudio, you'd really have no idea what good, true sound is really like. So I almost wish I didn't have the iAudio player...because the Nano is damn sexy and damn easy to use.

I just put audio quality first and formost and with the headphones I use (Bose Tri-Ports in the office and Shure E2's at the gym) I can EASILY tell the difference between the two. In fact, my girl who could care less about sound quality (she's got a Mini of course) took the pepsi challenge. I gave her the headphones and asked her which sounded better...she said the iAudio by far.

Sport73 · Post by **Sport73** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 10:34 pm

dbdynsty25 wrote:The more I listen, the more I'm not impressed. I did the pepsi challenge after tweaking the sound on the Ipod and it just doesn't sound anywhere close to the iAudio I have. It's rather disappointing actually...when I was listening to it earlier, I didn't have the iAudio next to me to test against...now that I do...I'm actually kind of pissed. We'll see if I can tweak it some more to get an acceptable sound. Why Apple hasn't improved on the sound in the last year since the 4g came out is beyond me.

What type of file are you using? How was it compressed (application, bit-rate etc.)? What about EQ settings? Same headphones?

I'm not even saying this as an Apple advocate, but there is a lot of misinformation out there about the sound quality of various devices. The only one I know of with a distinct advantage is the Creative line which uses a specialized chip for better signal to noise performance. Most the other players perform 'differently' depending upon the source, codec used, bitrate, headphones, EQ settings etc. A 128 kbps - MusicMatch encoded mp3 might sound better on an iPod than a iRiver, while a 192 kbps iTunes enconded mp3 might sound better on the iRiver. The point is that the codec/decoder relationship has a lot to do with sound quality; and there is no way to be sure other than a controlled test using multiple codecs etc.

Add in that every player ships with a different default EQ (and volume level); some punch up bass, others treble, others are flat - then consider the headphones (likely the most important part of the equation) and half the comments about sound quality are worthless.

Again, I'm not suggesting that iPod is the best, rather that every player needs to be evaluated by the listener using the standards that matter to them. If you've already encoded your entire library and aren't willing to do it again in AAC or another codec, you will want to choose the device that suits your library/headphones and plans for the future..

All that said, buy an iPod because it's DAMN SEXY!

Dave · Post by **Dave** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 10:40 pm

Very valid points Sport. It was probably in one of your posts, but I think I've read that the iPod, with no EQ settings, is one of the "truest" sound qualities of all of the players.

Sound quality is an interesting, elusive quality. A lot of people swear by the sound coming out of expensive Bose home-theater-in-a-box systems. But they are engineered to produce a pleasing sound while completely ignoring other frequency ranges. Despite that, I dig the TriPorts, outside of the fact that they broke on my car ride back from my vacation this weekend...

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 10:43 pm

I tried three different files on both players:

MP3 @ 320kbps
MP3 @ 192kbps
WMA @ 320kbps & the Ipods conversion of the file to AAC

Same headphones...and I've tweaked the hell out of both players. The Ipod just can't reproduce sound like the iAudio. I challenge you to find someone with an iAudio X5 or a U2...and then come back and tell me there is even close to a comparison between the two with ANY type of file. It's that big of a difference.

Here's the problem...the iAudio pales in comparison to the iPod when it comes to ease of use, style and build quality. It just can't hang in the performance category. I'd love more than anything to keep it...I just can't when I know that my iAudio will outperform it every time. I can't tell as much on the Bose headphones, but on the Shures, it's night and day.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 10:44 pm

Dave wrote:Despite that, I dig the TriPorts, outside of the fact that they broke on my car ride back from my vacation this weekend...

Bose TriPort headphones are different than their home audio equipment...that stuff is garbage for the price (including the Silent Comfort 2 Headphones...eesh). Plus you can just take them back to a factory store and they will replace them...even if they are out of warranty.

wco81 · Post by **wco81** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 11:00 pm

dbdynsty25 wrote:Why Apple hasn't improved on the sound in the last year since the 4g came out is beyond me.

Because one, they are selling like crazy and two, sound is subjective and three, if you're about quality sound, you wouldn't be dealing with a lossy compressed format in the first place. Or listening to pop music.

Someone in Japan took one of these apart and it does have a new PortaPlayer chip (meaning it could be an improvement or just a smaller die) rather than SigmaTel.

Bassy sound is produced in a lot of portable electronics via equalization to make up electronically what is missing physically (namely big transducers and enclosures). So I don't know that a portable audio device which has more bass means necessarily a cleaner or more accurate sound.

I recall a couple of years ago, at CES, The Absolute Sound or one of the other snooty audiophile mags passed judgement on iPods and they weren't harsh about it. Mind you, these are people who think CDs sound bad unless the DAC and post-DAC processing is done through a lot of expensive transistors or even tubes in boutique CD players costing thousands of dollars.

We all know iPods and by extension, all DAPs, are really about convenience and style more than sound quality. I've seen so many people wearing those white ear buds along with very expensive fashions, meaning they could afford better-quality earphones but they must have the white.

Dave · Post by **Dave** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 11:00 pm

dbdynsty25 wrote:Bose TriPort headphones are different than their home audio equipment...that stuff is garbage for the price (including the Silent Comfort 2 Headphones...eesh). Plus you can just take them back to a factory store and they will replace them...even if they are out of warranty.

I agree completely--I thought you had gone through a set of the TriPorts and had no problems getting them to do an exchange.

We got a set of the QC2s for free. They do a great job of blocking out low rumble frequencies, much better at that than my Sennheiser PXC-250s, but I think the active noise cancelling overwhelms the natural sound of the music more on the Bose, while the Senns' noise cancelling isn't as overpowering.

kicko · Post by **kicko** » Fri Sep 09, 2005 8:45 am

just wanted to see if you guys hear dabout this one http://www.cdfreaks.com/news/12388

wco81 · Post by **wco81** » Fri Sep 09, 2005 9:04 am

People are saying bad timing by Sony to announce at the same time as Apple.

The display looks nice, with no borders. But that shape... Guess it's a subjective thing.

Suppose to support WMA in addition to MP3 and ATRAC.

The thing is, it won't be available until November in Japan and Dec over here. Prices are high.

I thought the 512 MB flash player is the equivalent of $199 in Japan?

Sony has promised that their software team is working more closely with the hardware team. So their software is suppose to get better and one person noted that it looks like iTunes. They're also revamping their Connect music download service.

Sony can be more of a formidable competitor than Creative and the rest of those Korean and Taiwanese companies. They are shooting for 4 million of these players sold by end of March, compared to like 600k in the previous fiscal year.

Some people feel the real threat to iPod will come from companies like Nokia, Sony Ericsson and the wireless companies coming up with phones which will encourage people to leave the iPod at home or ditch it completely. They certainly have the marketing money that the smaller companies don't have as well as experience marketing devices people lust after.

sportdan30 · Post by **sportdan30** » Fri Sep 09, 2005 9:05 am

Guys,

What brand of headphones would you recommend I purchase? I'm perfectly content with our IPod Mini but would be interested in upgrading the headphones. I'm using it primarily when I go to the gym and when I start sweating, usually one of the ear buds feels as thought it's about to slip out of my ear.

Thanks.

wco81 · Post by **wco81** » Fri Sep 09, 2005 9:05 am

People are saying bad timing by Sony to announce at the same time as Apple.

The display looks nice, with no borders. But that shape... Guess it's a subjective thing.

Suppose to support WMA in addition to MP3 and ATRAC.

The thing is, it won't be available until November in Japan and Dec over here. Prices are high.

I thought the 512 MB flash player is the equivalent of $199 in Japan?

Sony has promised that their software team is working more closely with the hardware team. So their software is suppose to get better and one person noted that it looks like iTunes. They're also revamping their Connect music download service.

Sony can be more of a formidable competitor than Creative and the rest of those Korean and Taiwanese companies. They are shooting for 4 million of these players sold by end of March, compared to like 600k in the previous fiscal year.

Some people feel the real threat to iPod will come from companies like Nokia, Sony Ericsson and the wireless companies coming up with phones which will encourage people to leave the iPod at home or ditch it completely. They certainly have the marketing money that the smaller companies don't have as well as experience marketing devices people lust after.

sportdan30 · Post by **sportdan30** » Fri Sep 09, 2005 9:36 am

Well, it appears the Shures are the way to go but dang, they're expensive. They ever run specials on them?

Dave · Post by **Dave** » Fri Sep 09, 2005 9:43 am

Maybe buy.com, I think they have run some specials on the Shures. Not sure if anyone here has tried them, but there are some Sony in-ear phones, the EX71 (I think) that seem to get generally good reviews. They are more in the $30-40 range.

As far as Sony's new MP3 offerings, I think they look cool. But I've read way too much about what a b*tch it is to get their software working well. They also need to realize that in this market, their ability to charge a premium has been usurped by Apple. Going in with a higher price than them without offering additional features (outside of saying Sony on the unit) isn't the best idea.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Fri Sep 09, 2005 10:30 am

sportdan30 wrote:Well, it appears the Shures are the way to go but dang, they're expensive. They ever run specials on them?

You can buy the Shure E2's off of Amazon or Ebay for the 60-70 range...I've got them and they are oustanding. My buddy bought the Shure E4's (200 bucks) and I can't tell the difference so I was glad to go with the E2s.

sportdan30 · Post by **sportdan30** » Fri Sep 09, 2005 11:00 am

dbdynsty25 wrote:
sportdan30 wrote:Well, it appears the Shures are the way to go but dang, they're expensive. They ever run specials on them?
You can buy the Shure E2's off of Amazon or Ebay for the 60-70 range...I've got them and they are oustanding. My buddy bought the Shure E4's (200 bucks) and I can't tell the difference so I was glad to go with the E2s.

Sweet! Thanks. Gonna check that out.

GridIronGhost · Post by **GridIronGhost** » Fri Sep 09, 2005 1:20 pm

dbdynsty25 wrote:
sportdan30 wrote:Well, it appears the Shures are the way to go but dang, they're expensive. They ever run specials on them?
You can buy the Shure E2's off of Amazon or Ebay for the 60-70 range...I've got them and they are oustanding. My buddy bought the Shure E4's (200 bucks) and I can't tell the difference so I was glad to go with the E2s.

How the Sure E2's compare to the Sony Fontopia MDREX71SL ? Which is the best bang for my buck?

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Fri Sep 09, 2005 1:23 pm

I like the Shures quite a bit more. I've had both the Ex51s and the Ex71s and the Shures reproduce sound better in my mind. They also stay in my ears a lot better because they make a better seal in your canal. Now...some people would be bothered by that (my girl hates em)...but I like how nice and sealed they get, which in turn produces a better bass response (especially on the iAudio).