OT: Busted by the wife

[Badgun]

Remember that give and take line you wrote? He doesn't necessarily need to understand why his wife feels the way she does about porn but as a husband he needs to respect how she feels. That kind of macho bullshit is too late at this stage in the game. I love my wife and if something I didn't think twice about really bothered her that much I'd sure as hell make that sacrifice for her. She is my life partner and the mother of my child. He should still have a heart to heart with her on the subject but to come out swinging is a bad idea in my mind. That doesn't make me a p***y, just a good husband.

Nice. That's exactly what I was thinking. It's just porn. If it makes her feel crappy, it ain't worth it. She cannot help how she feels, and even if she agrees to give in on this, you'll know that it is still hurting her in some way. The fact that she would give in says alot about how much she loves you, but I think for me knowing that it bugged her would be enough for me to just stop. It's just porn... we can live without it.

How about sex? Can we live without that, too? That could be next. I'm sorry, you guys will never convince me that he has to give in.

[James_E]

It's just porn... we can live without it

Speak for yourself brother. Being a young guy who hasn't found "the one" yet i can safely say that there are times when i NEED porn. I don't know what I would do during those times when i'm single and searching for women i would like to date (like right now).

This whole thing is not about a single male... it's a married male who's partner wants him to stop.

How about sex? Can we live without that, too? That could be next. I'm sorry, you guys will never convince me that he has to give in.

Dude... this isn't her saying NO SEX. It's something that might be making her feel bad, I'm keeping her feelings in mind. It's giving in on something that I think is reasonable if it makes her feel bad. Don't you do that? Or do you just do whatever the hell you want and if she doesn't like it she can leave? (Not saying you do... but the tone of your posts hints towards that.)

My wife and I have give and take with each other, I personally think this is a "give" area on my part where I'd give it up.

[Spooky]

Remember that give and take line you wrote? He doesn't necessarily need to understand why his wife feels the way she does about porn but as a husband he needs to respect how she feels. That kind of macho bullshit is too late at this stage in the game. I love my wife and if something I didn't think twice about really bothered her that much I'd sure as hell make that sacrifice for her. She is my life partner and the mother of my child. He should still have a heart to heart with her on the subject but to come out swinging is a bad idea in my mind. That doesn't make me a p***y, just a good husband.

Nice. That's exactly what I was thinking. It's just porn. If it makes her feel crappy, it ain't worth it. She cannot help how she feels, and even if she agrees to give in on this, you'll know that it is still hurting her in some way. The fact that she would give in says alot about how much she loves you, but I think for me knowing that it bugged her would be enough for me to just stop. It's just porn... we can live without it.

I agree with this for the most part and I hope my post in no way conveyed that a woman who does not like a man looking at porn is not worth being with.

Obviuosly Badgun feels strongly about his belief and I understand his point as well.

I am more of the opinion that if the woman you are with does not see eye to eye with you sexually (for the most part) then perhaps you are not totally meant for each other. That is just my opinion and take it with the understanding that I know it is not always so cut and dry. However, IMO, sex is a VERY important part of a relationship with your partner. People who do not think so probably have fairly unhealthy sex lives. It is the one special bond that you can share with someone that you truly love. Of course you can have good sex with plenty of people I am sure, but when you find that ONE, that right one, it is magical and should just continue to get better in many ways, not worse or boring.

Introducing new experiences and being experimental is SO healthy. Porn is only one of many ways to branch out a bit with your partner. You definitely do not have to give them an ultimatum, just make them understand that if your viewing porn is doing anything at all, it is helping out your sexual relationship. It’s really not a matter of if she is okay with porn or not and if she is not, leave her. It has a lot more to do with a mutual understanding and comfortability factor. If a wife is not comfortable with her husband looking at porn at all, perhaps there is something a lot deeper there, like insecurities with herself or jealousy issues. It is usually not the porn itself that is what people are afraid of, it is often something much deeper that makes things of a sexual nature uncomfortable.

Now Matthew and his wife might have an absolutely perfect sex life aside from the porn issue and that is great. I just think that there is obviously a communication issue and perhaps other deeper issues if she is genuinely upset by his viewing porn and it should be dealt with not as an ultimatum, but as an opportunity to grow more together and perhaps enhance their sex life even more.

[Badgun]

It's just porn... we can live without it

Speak for yourself brother. Being a young guy who hasn't found "the one" yet i can safely say that there are times when i NEED porn. I don't know what I would do during those times when i'm single and searching for women i would like to date (like right now).

This whole thing is not about a single male... it's a married male who's partner wants him to stop.

How about sex? Can we live without that, too? That could be next. I'm sorry, you guys will never convince me that he has to give in.

Dude... this isn't her saying NO SEX. It's something that might be making her feel bad, I'm keeping her feelings in mind. It's giving in on something that I think is reasonable if it makes her feel bad. Don't you do that? Or do you just do whatever the hell you want and if she doesn't like it she can leave? (Not saying you do... but the tone of your posts hints towards that.)

My wife and I have give and take with each other, I personally think this is a "give" area on my part where I'd give it up.

This would NEVER happen in my house, but if it did, there would definitely have to be another solution besides me giving it up. There are a number of solutions besides him giving it up, you know. She could just ignore it, he could lie and say he did give it up and continue to sneak and look at it, or maybe she could accept it.

And what if he did give it up, but got horny one night and went to a porn site...now what do you do? Does he go to her and confess as if he cheated on her or does he just feel guilty about it. You're not even beginning to consider the position she is putting him in.

Take one of your favorite hobbies and imagine how you would feel if your wife told you to give it up. What if she told you to give up gaming...would you?

[Brando70]

Remember that give and take line you wrote? He doesn't necessarily need to understand why his wife feels the way she does about porn but as a husband he needs to respect how she feels. That kind of macho bullshit is too late at this stage in the game. I love my wife and if something I didn't think twice about really bothered her that much I'd sure as hell make that sacrifice for her. She is my life partner and the mother of my child. He should still have a heart to heart with her on the subject but to come out swinging is a bad idea in my mind. That doesn't make me a p***y, just a good husband.

Nice. That's exactly what I was thinking. It's just porn. If it makes her feel crappy, it ain't worth it. She cannot help how she feels, and even if she agrees to give in on this, you'll know that it is still hurting her in some way. The fact that she would give in says alot about how much she loves you, but I think for me knowing that it bugged her would be enough for me to just stop. It's just porn... we can live without it.

How about sex? Can we live without that, too? That could be next. I'm sorry, you guys will never convince me that he has to give in.

Look, I'm all for women not trying to change their husbands (and vice versa). Marriage is all about two people learning to live with each other and respecting each other. If my wife was really offended by porn, I would not look at porn. It's not about getting walked all over, it's about respecting something that really bothers her.

Now, having said that, Badgun makes a good point: you need to make sure you're sexually compatible with someone before you get married. You don't necessarily have to have sex before marriage (although honestly, I think that helps). But you should have frank discussions about it. Sex is a very big part of a happy marriage. If you enjoy sleeping with your wife, that goes a long way toward preserving monogamy. If you really like looking at porn, you should try and find out if your future wife has a problem with it.

For me, porn is one of those things I enjoy but could live without, like Ben and Jerry's. I'm not going to get into an argument over a pint of ice cream.

[pk500]

The reality is that my wife would never make that demand to me so I'll never have to make that decision, but I promise you that if my wife EVER asked me to stop doing something I enjoy, then we would have a huge problem.

And what if that "something you enjoy" was harmful or pissed away the family finances?

Hypothetically, let's say you drank a lot or bet football a lot and lost, dipping into the family finances. If your wife said to you, "Bad, you're pissing away a lot of money on that booze or on losing football bets; you need to stop now," would she be on the curb?

Now, I'm not comparing peeping at porn shots to losing big money on gambling or a drinking problem. But your absolutism regarding your pastimes-- it's my way or Trailways -- that is pretty jarring.

For example, when I met my wife, my diet was terrible. But I enjoyed eating that sh*t food, as it tasted good and was easy to prepare. But my wife showed me that it was almost as easy to make good-tasting food that was really good for you, and save money at the same time by avoiding the fast-food spiral.

Now, I could have said, "F*ck it, I love fast food, and you can't tell me to stop eating it. It's Wendy's or the curb for you, b*tch." But you know what? I listened to her logic, and she made perfect sense. Now I'm a hell of a lot healthier than I was 15 years ago. It doesn't hurt that she's a fine cook, too.

Then again, she thinks videogames are a total waste of time. But she doesn't mind that I play them because it's a fun diversion for me that I don't do during "family time." I do it after everyone has gone to bed.

There needs to be give and take, I think, from BOTH sides in a marriage. And that will see MattK through this, I hope.

The only absolutes in my marriage are that I love my wife to bits, that I don't stray on her and that I'm a father who puts my kids first. Everything else is negotiable.

Take care,
PK

[LAking]

This whole thing is not about a single male... it's a married male who's partner wants him to stop

I'm very aware of that. That little paragraph was meant to be a little humorous. I do however know that sometimes even married couples can't have sex all the time, or that males simply enjoy looking at beautiful women and thinking about what sex would be like with them. What really is the difference between thinking about having sex with some hot women you see on the street and jacking off to some hot porn star on the computer? Nothing really.

I know there are these old irrational beliefs (held mostly by women and not talked about in public) that once we fall in love with someone we lose all desire to have sex with anyone esle, or that the person you love is the only person you could possibly find sexually attractive. But let's get real here, that isn't the case. For anyone to actually believe in that and to basically lump their significant other into the category of a adulterer for jacking off to pictures of naked women is being completely irrational and should make an effort to change that way of thought. It's an unreachable ideal that will only cause problems later on down the line. She should make an effort to be comfortable with her husbands maleness. And i'm not talking about his "machismo" or whatever you want to call it. I'm talking about his natural male behavior.

All that being said, i don't think he should just leave her if she says no. If he really loves her, and i'm sure he does, he should at least try and see if thing work out without porn. It's worth a shot if you love her. But it may not work, it may cause all types of distrust and awkwardness. But we won't know for sure.

[Badgun]

The reality is that my wife would never make that demand to me so I'll never have to make that decision, but I promise you that if my wife EVER asked me to stop doing something I enjoy, then we would have a huge problem.

And what if that "something you enjoy" was harmful or pissed away the family finances?

Hypothetically, let's say you drank a lot or bet football a lot and lost, dipping into the family finances. If your wife said to you, "Bad, you're pissing away a lot of money on that booze or on losing football bets; you need to stop now," would she be on the curb?

Now, I'm not comparing peeping at porn shots to losing big money on gambling or a drinking problem. But your absolutism regarding your pastimes-- it's my way or Trailways -- that is pretty jarring.

For example, when I met my wife, my diet was terrible. But I enjoyed eating that sh*t food, as it tasted good and was easy to prepare. But my wife showed me that it was almost as easy to make good-tasting food that was really good for you, and save money at the same time by avoiding the fast-food spiral.

Now, I could have said, "F*ck it, I love fast food, and you can't tell me to stop eating it. It's Wendy's or the curb for you, b*tch." But you know what? I listened to her logic, and she made perfect sense. Now I'm a hell of a lot healthier than I was 15 years ago. It doesn't hurt that she's a fine cook, too.

Then again, she thinks videogames are a total waste of time. But she doesn't mind that I play them because it's a fun diversion for me that I don't do during "family time." I do it after everyone has gone to bed.

There needs to be give and take, I think, from BOTH sides in a marriage. And that will see MattK through this, I hope.

The only absolutes in my marriage are that I love my wife to bits, that I don't stray on her and that I'm a father who puts my kids first. Everything else is negotiable.

Take care,
PK

pk, I totally agree with you on drinking and gambling. Those are two things that I used to do a lot of, but gave them both up when we had kids. She didn't have to ask me...I knew.

But looking at lustylesbians.com is not going to hurt anyone or cost anyone money.

[James_E]

This would NEVER happen in my house, but if it did, there would definitely have to be another solution besides me giving it up. There are a number of solutions besides him giving it up, you know. She could just ignore it, he could lie and say he did give it up and continue to sneak and look at it, or maybe she could accept it.

You have an entirely different view on the relationship. Lying? Not something I do to the woman I love. Especially if it is something that I know bugs her and would really hurt her if she found out.

And what if he did give it up, but got horny one night and went to a porn site...now what do you do? Does he go to her and confess as if he cheated on her or does he just feel guilty about it. You're not even beginning to consider the position she is putting him in.

I'd go find my wife rather than go to the porn site, if the wife didn't want me visiting porn sites.

Take one of your favorite hobbies and imagine how you would feel if your wife told you to give it up. What if she told you to give up gaming...would you?

If it's something that is making her feel bad about herself, not good enough etc. (which can be a reaction to porn for many women) then yes. If it is something harmless like gaming... then no.. but I don't put gaming on the same realm as looking at porn, as far as how it can make a woman feel.

Like it or not, alot of women are insecure about their bodies. Having their hubby off looking at porn can make them feel even crappier about themselves, and might even have a negative effect on their sexuality, which would exacerbate the problem.

Badgun, we'll just have to disagree on this one. No chance that I'll come to your side on this.

[Spooky]

I don't think anyone is saying he should just give an ultimatum, "the porn stays or I go". They should have a good heart to heart where these things are seriously discussed. And from the sound of it, i'm sure their relationship is good enough to be able to discuss this kind of stuff. For her to say that jerking off to porn is like cheating is a sign that she has no idea how different the male and female brains are wired. Her fear of porn is a socially constructed fear, almost like a fear of sex in general. His desire to jack off to images of naked women is something far more biological.

Very well said. I agree.

[James_E]

I don't think anyone is saying he should just give an ultimatum, "the porn stays or I go". They should have a good heart to heart where these things are seriously discussed. And from the sound of it, i'm sure their relationship is good enough to be able to discuss this kind of stuff. For her to say that jerking off to porn is like cheating is a sign that she has no idea how different the male and female brains are wired. Her fear of porn is a socially constructed fear, almost like a fear of sex in general. His desire to jack off to images of naked women is something far more biological.

Very well said. I agree.

Geesh... my desire to f*** other beautiful women is biological too. Yeah, I see a gorgeous girl and I want her. Let me give my wife Cindy a call and see if she's ok with that.

Her fear of porn can come down to just jealousy, a very biological reaction when ones mate is interested in another person.

Edit: I know that nobody is advocating cheating... I'm just taking things to extreme for the discussion purposes.

[JackB1]

caution....threadjack in process......

Hey James.......is that you new Les Paul in your avatar? Looks like
a sunburst. Nice! How much did u drop for that baby? Are you going to attach the pickguard? I like the way they look without them better, plus I think you need to drill holes to attach it.

[Brando70]

"It's Wendy's or the curb for you, b*tch."

LOL, PK, that sounded like a line from a Chappelle sketch.

This has been an enlightening thread to say the least.

[JackB1]

Oh s***... what if Grog posts in this thread... would we all be scarred for life?

LOL!!!

[JackB1]

Nice, a threadjack in a thread about jacking.

As for the Vanessa Williams issue, well let's just say that I had to retire a towel about 2 months after that issue hit.

when all is said and done, this thread may rank up there along with the greats, such as Grog's infamous Bowel thread!

[Spooky]

I don't think anyone is saying he should just give an ultimatum, "the porn stays or I go". They should have a good heart to heart where these things are seriously discussed. And from the sound of it, i'm sure their relationship is good enough to be able to discuss this kind of stuff. For her to say that jerking off to porn is like cheating is a sign that she has no idea how different the male and female brains are wired. Her fear of porn is a socially constructed fear, almost like a fear of sex in general. His desire to jack off to images of naked women is something far more biological.

Very well said. I agree.

Geesh... my desire to f*** other beautiful women is biological too. Yeah, I see a gorgeous girl and I want her. Let me give my wife Cindy a call and see if she's ok with that.

Her fear of porn can come down to just jealousy, a very biological reaction when ones mate is interested in another person.

If your take on looking at porn is being interested in another person, you get WAY more into porn than I do. I watch porn to see sexually exciting things. I look at naked women to see sexually exciting things. I look at women on the street, at my work, ect...in a sexual way sometimes too. My girlfriend does the same thing towards guys I am sure. She looks at porn and sees nice big juicy cocks. She likes that. She also sees them attached to guys who are a lot more muscular than I am. She looks at construction workers and thinks they are sexy. These are biological reactions and facts of life. To be jealous of that to the point of being upset with your partner is not right. BUT, that is NOT to say that acting on these feelings, especially without the others consent is acceptable either.

If one was looking at porn because they were falling in love with the person they were jerking off to, that is different and would justify your opinion. But I think that is not the case here, and is very rare in general. If I was caught beating off to a picture of a friend or co-worker while on the phone with them, that is a LOT different than just looking at a female body or at a random sexual act and finding it arousing. Sex is sex. We all have sexual instincts. It is having strong feelings for another person that should cause jealousy, not sexual fantasies.

Let's turn the tables for a sec... Would you be jealous or feel really insecure if you caught your wife/girlfriend masturbating to a porn of some guy with a bigger dick than yours? Would you think that was disrespectful. If so, why? If not, then why should we accept the same reaction from a wife/girlfriend? Personally, I would find it very sexy to catch my girlfriend being ‘naughty’. Of course it would be a bit different if I actually caught her engaged in a sexual act with another man without my knowledge or consent.

[James_E]

caution....threadjack in process......

Hey James.......is that you new Les Paul in your avatar? Looks like
a sunburst. Nice! How much did u drop for that baby? Are you going to attach the pickguard? I like the way they look without them better, plus I think you need to drill holes to attach it.

Yeah, that's it. It is a Cherry Sunburst. more pics at the link below. I will not attach the pickguard, I prefer the look without it.

Price? Around $2300 CDN. = approx $1870 US dollars. Best price in town by about $250 CDN and is also lower than musician's friend online price. No other store would come close, and it's from the store that I have easy access to, rather than heading to downtown Toronto to one of the bigger stores. It's a 2004 model, built December 9, 2004 in Nashville.


Link:

http://photobucket.com/albums/a172/James_E/Guitar/

[LAking]

Geesh... my desire to f*** other beautiful women is biological too. Yeah, I see a gorgeous girl and I want her. Let me give my wife Cindy a call and see if she's ok with that.

Her fear of porn can come down to just jealousy, a very biological reaction when ones mate is interested in another person.

Never said anyone is acting upon our desire to f*** other women. Everyone knows that when you take those vows that stuff is out of the question, both parties agreed to that.

Her jealousy may be based on biology, but it has been increased dramatically and changed to mean something comlpetely different by our cultural norms. Her jealousy comes from archaic ideals of love. Natural sexual arousal by women other than your wife does not translate to a guy who doesn't love his wife anymore, or who wants to cheat on her. All it means is that certain images are triggering chemical reactions in your brain that are out of your control. When i see a hot women with her breasts practically falling out of her shirt all types of s*** goes through my head that i have very little control over.

[tjung0831]

I have to admit i'm a little suprised at how many of you guys are totally ok with porn and I'm not saying that i'm innocent at by any means. Nothing good has ever come from porn....that's why it's porn. I think there is a huge difference if you are rubbin your chubby to playboy versus rubbin your chubby while looking at violent porn such as rape or bondage or whatever else excites you. I firmly believe porn is something that we are all supposed to outgrow otherwise don't you think it's going to be pretty creepy when you're 65 years old and still looking at porn. I know that's not the grandpa that I strive to be.

[James_E]

When i see a hot women with her breasts practically falling out of her shirt all types of s*** goes through my head that i have very little control over.

Agreed, but I think there is a big difference (and so do women) in seeing a hot chick in real life (at the beach, at work whatever) versus actively going to seek out porn.

[James_E]

I think there is a huge difference if you are rubbin your chubby to playboy versus rubbin your chubby while looking at violent porn such as rape or bondage or whatever else excites you.

Some how I doubt anyone here is talking about "non-standard" porn like rape or violence. That's an ENTIRELY different thing IMHO.

[ScoopBrady]

My point is why does he have to give? What would be harder, for Matt to stop looking at porn or for her to ignore it or tolerate it? He never really mentioned how he got caught. What if she was looking at his browser history or at his cookies...now you enter a whole different area.

If it truly bothers her then, yeah, it would be harder for her to ignore it or tolerate it.

I'm not trying to be macho, but this should not be any area where he has to negotiate. My wife is the mother of my three kids, too so don't try and put that badge on it. If my wife came to me tonight and said I want all the porn out of the house and I want Net Nanny or some s*** put on the computer so NO ONE can look at porn again, I can guarantee you that the porn would still be here tomorrow, not her. It's not about putting porn in front of your marriage it's about someone trying to control what you can and cannot do...don't you see that?

In your case it would be justified to take a stand like that since porn has been on the table during the whole marriage. This is an entirely different scenario. This isn't a control issue like you make it sound like. This has to do with emotions and respect, not control.

The reality is that my wife would never make that demand to me so I'll never have to make that decision, but I promise you that if my wife EVER asked me to stop doing something I enjoy, then we would have a huge problem.

I would have a huge problem if my wife asked me to stop doing something that I enjoy if it was something that didn't stir up negative feelings and emotions about herself or our marriage just like you. If my wife asked me to give up gaming because she doesn't understand why a grown man plays videogames that's something she would need to get over, not me. If treating my c#@$ like a butter churn while looking at 8thstreetlatinas.com made her feel insecure about herself then that's something I have to get over.

[pk500]

pk, I totally agree with you on drinking and gambling. Those are two things that I used to do a lot of, but gave them both up when we had kids. She didn't have to ask me...I knew.

But looking at lustylesbians.com is not going to hurt anyone or cost anyone money.

Agreed. Although onlymovies.com and darlina.com are my stops of choice.

Take care,
PK

[Leebo33]

I think there is a huge difference if you are rubbin your chubby to playboy versus rubbin your chubby while looking at violent porn such as rape or bondage or whatever else excites you

Who mentioned rape and bondage porn? I'm against that. I thought we were talking about straight-up wholesome man on girl on girl on girl on man porn.

[tjung0831]

I think there is a huge difference if you are rubbin your chubby to playboy versus rubbin your chubby while looking at violent porn such as rape or bondage or whatever else excites you

Who mentioned rape and bondage porn? I'm against that. I thought we were talking about straight-up wholesome man on girl on girl on girl on man porn.

I'm not stupid enough to think that everybody is just looking at big boobie porn here..