Tiger Woods 14 thread, part II

[DChaps]

I wish that an EA Product Manager had the ability to tell the full story on the SDLC of a release like TW14. If for no other reason, just for my own curiosity as someone who has worked in just about all stages of the dev process. Nine times out of ten, something that seems like a dumb mistake or miss by a developer or QA is more than likely a higher up decision. Devs or the tech support staff never have the ability or authority to tell the truth. Unless they just flat out did not QA TW14 at all, it is highly unlikely this number of blatant bugs were never detected. All the EA sports games have been on basically the same release cycle for several years, and I would assume it is due to market research that says get your sports game out right before the real world sport gets going, otherwise there may be a drop in sales. Ever since Augusta has been part of TW, I am sure they want the game out prior to the Masters so that commercials are able to sell the game. I would not be surprised to find out that there are some EA QA employees that have these defects logged into a queue somewhere, but were told these are shippable defects and we are releasing and will just try to fix later. The QA guys become the scapegoats. But even if QA did drop the ball, many of these defects are so easy to recreate that the Devs themselves should have caught them during Unit Test (for example the cut bug that Danimal has mentioned). Ultimately, no gaming company will change this practice of release super buggy product, patch later, until the gaming consumers themselves stop proving to them that it works. I am a perfect example of why they do it. I was unimpressed by the TW14 demo. Canceled my pre-order. Did not even bother with the early release. Read all the bug and freeze reports from early release DSP users. Convinced myself again to take a wait and see approach, then went out on release day and picked it up anyway. So as much as I want to complain about it, and be surprised that this is the quality of $60 console games at this stage in the current gen cycle, I also have to point the finger back at myself.

[10spro]

Here's another inexplicable glitch and John please enlighten me if you know the answer. Merace and I had a couple of tête à tête, one under the H2H mode in our CC and the other one that we created was under Xbox Live. After both games, our record was still showing as 0-0 unlike your encounter with Truth the other night. So was there something different that you did that made the record show or is it perhaps because Merace can't seem to get out of the game properly when it's over as he seems to wait for the 'please wait' message forever.

Also, remember I asked you if you knew how to delete a CAG? I currently have 3 because as I mentioned earlier in my haste to start my Pro I forgot to include my previous XP's so I created a third one where I finally imported my XP's fom last year.

Back to my H2H games with Merace for a moment. My CAG with the late 80's attributes was nowhere to be seen, but only the original CAG with only mid 20's attributes. In which case, I had to pick a Pro for our second match.

It wasn't the first time. Once I rebooted the game, the CAG that had the most attributes reappeared again...thank goodness. But bugs like this is so damn annoying, and at this point it's the addicting Sim mode that just keeps me rolling. Ggrrrr!

[DivotMaker]

Here's another inexplicable glitch and John please enlighten me if you know the answer. Merace and I had a couple of tête à tête, one under the H2H mode in our CC and the other one that we created was under Xbox Live. After both games, our record was still showing as 0-0 unlike your encounter with Truth the other night. So was there something different that you did that made the record show or is it perhaps because Merace can't seem to get out of the game properly when it's over as he seems to wait for the 'please wait' message forever.

Also, remember I asked you if you knew how to delete a CAG? I currently have 3 because as I mentioned earlier in my haste to start my Pro I forgot to include my previous XP's so I created a third one where I finally imported my XP's fom last year.

Back to my H2H games with Merace for a moment. My CAG with the late 80's attributes was nowhere to be seen, but only the original CAG with only mid 20's attributes. In which case, I had to pick a Pro for our second match.

It wasn't the first time. Once I rebooted the game, the CAG that had the most attributes reappeared again...thank goodness. But bugs like this is so damn annoying, and at this point it's the addicting Sim mode that just keeps me rolling. Ggrrrr!

Server side update scheduled for Saturday should help with this. As far as the CAG's switching around, first I have heard of this. These patches can't come soon enough.....

[pk500]

You guys either are lemmings or show the patience of Job. I'm not sure which.

I hope you're enjoying this game, but TW 13 sure seems more like waterboarding than virtual golf nirvana from reading this thread.

[fsquid]

agree with PK

[J_Cauthen]

I wish that an EA Product Manager had the ability to tell the full story on the SDLC of a release like TW14. If for no other reason, just for my own curiosity as someone who has worked in just about all stages of the dev process. Nine times out of ten, something that seems like a dumb mistake or miss by a developer or QA is more than likely a higher up decision. Devs or the tech support staff never have the ability or authority to tell the truth. Unless they just flat out did not QA TW14 at all, it is highly unlikely this number of blatant bugs were never detected.

Great post Don! I appreciate your insight on this. I have no experience with this other than being a beta tester for Tiger 04, 05, and 06 on the PC. We'll never really know the behind the scenes story on what happened with Tiger 14, but I suspect the QA testing was at best inadequate for this game. The most glaring problems I have with it don't seem to be connectivity related at all. How can a career mode cut eliminating players that should have made the cut have been connectivity related.?

The most obvious problem to me is the borked 'broadcast' putting camera production in what's supposed to be "Follow" camera presentation? That was a late design decision change. If the game was being properly tested, I would think a QA tester would tell them that: A.) This presentation style is contrary to the name of the presentation mode it's in, B.) It all too often doesn't give the gamer a proper look at how the putt actually broke and sometimes takes an angle that doesn't allow the gamer to see the ball roll at all!? I didn't have to play but 27 holes to see an example of each!

So as much as I want to complain about it, and be surprised that this is the quality of $60 console games at this stage in the current gen cycle, I also have to point the finger back at myself.

Guilty of the same here, although I held off on buying the game until I got confirmation that the fatal (for me) putting camera presentation was fixed, I still rented it from the second day until my Historic Edition arrived. But yeah, here I am playing a game that's still holding me hostage to Follow Cam (which I still have to hold my nose to play), even though Follow Cam is what broke me from playing Tiger 13 any more. Broadcast presentation in Tiger 14 is so bad, that it makes me actually... (gulp) - appreciate Follow cam in comparison

So yeah, I feel like I've paid money to be a beta tester for a finished product, but two days after the patch is released, I'll probably be in a state of forgiving gaming bliss and won't remember the lessons learned for next year. I'll be just as gullible a fish for Tiger 15, but hopefully on a Durango or PS4. This console gen has at least proven to me that it can't support the type of cyber golf experience I want.

[J_Cauthen]

You guys either are lemmings or show the patience of Job. I'm not sure which.

I hope you're enjoying this game, but TW 13 sure seems more like waterboarding than virtual golf nirvana from reading this thread.

You mean TW 14? Yes, it has become more like waterboarding for me. I finally blew my cork yesterday when I was playing a round at Augusta 1934, and couldn't see any portion (in real time) of three, consecutive putts of my 5-putt extravaganza on the 4th hole (the current day 13th hole). I shouldn't have to watch replays to freaking see what I should have seen in real time!! I'm going to play out our 4 round Master's competition for the DSP CC this week, and Dan's Master's challenge on Sunday, and I'm parking this beast until the patch

Now, are you happy that you triggered this outburst out of me? You know what? I owe you PK... I somehow feel "cleansed"... this has been very therapeutic for me

[Danimal]

I'll just say I agree with Don and leave it at that.

This could of been the game that set Tiger apart, instead its the one that will have most of us taking a wait and see attitude next year

[dbdynsty25]

You guys either are lemmings or show the patience of Job. I'm not sure which.

I hope you're enjoying this game, but TW 13 sure seems more like waterboarding than virtual golf nirvana from reading this thread.

To be quite honest...it's mostly because of the swing difficulty. Even after playing 13 for a few days with my created golfer, it was damn easy to do almost anything even though I was a disaster around the green. In 14...its ALL hard. Which I'm definitely all for. So dealing with the server and some bugs occasionally is worth the aggravation to get an awesome swing mechanic. So I think that's why most of us are pushing through this release phase of the game for that reason alone. It's that good.

[10spro]

You guys either are lemmings or show the patience of Job. I'm not sure which.

I hope you're enjoying this game, but TW 13 sure seems more like waterboarding than virtual golf nirvana from reading this thread.

To be quite honest...it's mostly because of the swing difficulty. Even after playing 13 for a few days with my created golfer, it was damn easy to do almost anything even though I was a disaster around the green. In 14...its ALL hard. Which I'm definitely all for. So dealing with the server and some bugs occasionally is worth the aggravation to get an awesome swing mechanic. So I think that's why most of us are pushing through this release phase of the game for that reason alone. It's that good.

Yeah, and there are so many other modes that I haven't touched yet, such as legends, career mode etc. Have been playing mostly online tourneys and the sim mode is that good. To finally see realistic scores is what keeping my interest in the Live tournaments, despite the other flaws that we all commented on already. Now after two weeks of the release, would I have payed the full $70 for the HE. Nope. But at $40 south of the border, it's worth at least a try for the sim mode alone. It's challenging, frustrating and rewarding at the same time. And of course, every one is still hoping for the big patch day, which obviously EA never should have allowed for the current state of affairs to get by the QA department.

[J_Cauthen]

I just played my final round in this week's DSP CC 4 Rounder at Augusta. It was a case in point as to how close this game is at greatness, while making me want to pull my toenails out at the same time. Every shot I hit in this round was like something you would see a short hitting pro play in real life. I had a 4 birdie, 3 bogey, 71. Two of the bogeys were 3-putts from 44 and 62 feet. I think I hit 10 of 14 fairways and 10 of 18 greens. From a gameplay challenge standpoint, it was as good as I've ever seen in a console golf game.

OTOH, at least 10 of the putts I played in this game were shown from cut view angles that made it look like the producer was on acid. I missed seeing a 30 foot birdie putt drop because the camera was so far away that the only way I knew it went was by the sound. All the while I'm playing, I'm looking at a leaderboard that Stephen Hawking couldn't decipher. I finished with round scores of +6, +4, E, and -1, yet the leaderboard has me at "E" for the tournament!? Thankfully I didn't hit into any hazards this round. I'm sure the drop I would have received would have made the list of things that outraged me

This round served two purposes. It shows me that there is a game worth playing underneath the baling wire that's holding it together right now. OTOH, it strengthened my resolve not to play it any more after Sunday's DSP CC Master's challenge. I just can't keep polluting my brain with the tarnished product it is in its present form.

[Danimal]

I saw your final scores as well and was scratching my head as to how that equaled Even par.

The stats banners that show up are a joke, even if they fix them and that's a big if since they claimed it was a server side fix thats taken 2 weeks. They are irrelevant half the time. Why show me round scoring (which is wrong) when you later show me tournament final scores or force me to see them when signing my card?

I come into a hole in my 2nd round, I know 5 people have played round one and the field has 9 bogeys and 2 birds... what???

Ugh, its really the only word to describe this Ugh.

[Jackdog]

You guys either are lemmings or show the patience of Job. I'm not sure which.

I hope you're enjoying this game, but TW 13 sure seems more like waterboarding than virtual golf nirvana from reading this thread.

To be quite honest...it's mostly because of the swing difficulty. Even after playing 13 for a few days with my created golfer, it was damn easy to do almost anything even though I was a disaster around the green. In 14...its ALL hard. Which I'm definitely all for. So dealing with the server and some bugs occasionally is worth the aggravation to get an awesome swing mechanic. So I think that's why most of us are pushing through this release phase of the game for that reason alone. It's that good.

I don't play online so most of the complaints I'm reading here are foreign to me. I'm playing a career in sim mode. Currently on the Web.Com Tour, haven't finished in the top 10 yet and having a blast. Best TW game I've played.

[Teal]

So...is most of the problematic stuff in online play?

[sportdan30]

You guys either are lemmings or show the patience of Job. I'm not sure which.

I hope you're enjoying this game, but TW 13 sure seems more like waterboarding than virtual golf nirvana from reading this thread.

To be quite honest...it's mostly because of the swing difficulty. Even after playing 13 for a few days with my created golfer, it was damn easy to do almost anything even though I was a disaster around the green. In 14...its ALL hard. Which I'm definitely all for. So dealing with the server and some bugs occasionally is worth the aggravation to get an awesome swing mechanic. So I think that's why most of us are pushing through this release phase of the game for that reason alone. It's that good.

I don't play online so most of the complaints I'm reading here are foreign to me. I'm playing a career in sim mode. Currently on the Web.Com Tour, haven't finished in the top 10 yet and having a blast. Best TW game I've played.

I don't play much online either. I read impressions over at OS and they're mostly all positive and I come here and read pretty much the opposite.

[Diablo25]

I'm just continuing to mess around with offline stuff until the patch comes. I did play a one day DSP CC tourney or two but until the patch comes I won't go nuts with the game. Putting cam might be the most ridiculous thing I've seen in a game in a decade.

[Jackdog]

So...is most of the problematic stuff in online play?

I think so. Like I said I haven't seen most of the complaints online players have. I use the follow cam and see all my putts just fine. All my drops have be fine. No freezes. Online sounds like a nightmare.

[Danimal]

So...is most of the problematic stuff in online play?

Most of it is yeah. The cut line problem is a big issue for me because I am always hovering around it. If you're really good or really suck you are never on the line and wouldn't notice it. I've read guys getting into the pga season have suddenly lost all their progress and needed to start over. That was enough to stop me playing career until a patch.

For just one off games and I would dsay daily connected tournaments the game is fine. Oh and ball drops....yuck.

[Inuyasha]

Other than some freezes and slow down, Offline its the best TW console game ever.

[MUTTS]

So I caved and bought it for 39 at Target. Seemed like a good deal.

However I stuck the game and a receipt in my desk drawer and will wait to see what happens with the patch. Ill return it if the stuff doesnt get rectified.

Tony

[10spro]

Well, it doesn't look like I'll be able to finish the weekly at Augusta as the game froze on me again at this particular tourney, this time at the very first hole.

So I went on to play the daily and the not that I miss Nantz and Flaherty but the 18 holes went without any commentary whatsoever. It was nice hearing the chirping of the birds and ocean waves at Pebble though.

[pk500]

Good to know many of the problems are online only. I spent probably 75 percent of my time with TW13 playing offline.

Hmm. Maybe I'll become a lemming soon.

[Pete]

All of my time with this game is offline and I am loving it.

Maybe it is the modes I play but I have not had many issues with the game at all. The stuck overlays sometimes pose a problem but not enough to cause any real damage to my score. You can usually get rid of them by pushing start.

I am playing on the 2nd highest difficulty with wind mph on and strike meter to perfect and find the game incredibly challenging. With pros, I am shooting anywhere from 75 to 90.

Also, the legends mode is really cool and a great pick up and play 30 minute mode.

[Spooky]

Is this yet another version where you have to "level up" your created character? Can you play online and in tournys with an already made pro? I freaking HATE leveling up. Oh how I wish they'd just give he players a set amount of points/stats to distribute right away to a created player (or give us that option).

[DivotMaker]

Is this yet another version where you have to "level up" your created character? Can you play online and in tournys with an already made pro? I freaking HATE leveling up. Oh how I wish they'd just give he players a set amount of points/stats to distribute right away to a created player (or give us that option).

Yes, but there is a catch....if you had character built or XP accumulated from TW13, they would let you import 75,000 XP to start a new CAG which would put you at a pretty decent player right off the bat. Imported my 75K XP and was at level 100 in 2 days. If you don't have any XP to import, you will likey start off with a golfer with fairly mediocre attributes.

You can play with Pros in all online modes and the connected tournaments. You can't play with one in Career Mode.