Official Madden 2006 Impressions Thread

[Danimal]

if you are scanning the right side of the field and then decide to throw left without looking over there you are in deep s***. .

But don't you do that without the cone off too? Lets take last year, if my primary WR was covered, i would then look to another one of my WR's, read the coverage, and throw the ball if he was open. I dont know any gamer who would look to one side of the field and then throw to the other side without looking over there. I dont think any gamers play like that.

But do you need a cone to do this? I thought we were all doing this for the last how many so years football games have been out.

So you do all that now, plus you add the second it takes to bring the cone over. In other words, if you play as you always did you still look off your primary WR and look to your secondary. Great he is open, now snap the cone over. It still takes a second longer, and simulates your QB in game vision, not your vision of the entire screen. If you don't you pay an accuracy penalty for the QB's vision not being loicked on his target.

I'm sorry no matter what you say, I can't agree this was simulated in past versions. My eyes would shift and make reads as you say, but my virtual QB could be looking behind me and throw the ball to anyone on the field without a penalty and I highly doubt any game too into account which way your virtual QB was looking when determing the accuracy of a pass.

[ScoopBrady]

You can't just double tap like you were entering a combo in a fighting game. The cone does have to swing around to the target and you still have to place and time your throw. There is a penalty for just double tapping quickly. I've tried double tapping before and it failed miserably. I'd try hitting my fullback in the flat by double tapping and the ball would either hit him in the back or sail right past him. When you use the right trigger you have to wait until the cone is over the receiver before you throw it or your accuracy goes down. When the cone is over the receiver then you time your pass. It's like once you highlight your receiver with the cone they know to expect the pass. There's times where I'll change to a receiver that is open but by the time the cone gets to him he's not anymore and I have to find someone else who is open. It also forces you to make your reads quicker and be a half step ahead of the defense. It's the most realistic representation for passing I've ever had the joy of playing in a football video game.

[Inuyasha]

Thanks for all your explanations. I think as someone else said in this thread, EA is trying to get all the 'cheese ' gamers to play the correct way with the cone.

Like you said, if you've always played the non-cheese way, then the cone just adds to your playing preference.

Now if you're one of those who just took advantage of the previous games and would just chuck a ball to the opposite part of the field without looking and having it completed, now you're forced to actually look over there.

[Danimal]

Thanks for all your explanations. I think as someone else said in this thread, EA is trying to get all the 'cheese ' gamers to play the correct way with the cone.

Like you said, if you've always played the non-cheese way, then the cone just adds to your playing preference.

Now if you're one of those who just took advantage of the previous games and would just chuck a ball to the opposite part of the field without looking and having it completed, now you're forced to actually look over there.

To me it comes down to this. I can think of several ways this could have been implemented better, actually much better. But it is the first shot at it so I am willing to deal with an awkward interface. The simple fact that you have to switch your vision to your target, even if a bit tedious is far better then the standard push a button to throw.

But shame on EA for not allowying you to use precision passing with it off.

[spooky157]

I think what Bad is saying, and I agree with him on this, is that the cone reacts the same way whether it's Peyton Manning or Jesse Palmer when using the double tap method. EA should just get rid of the double tap in the next Madden iteration.

[Badgun]

if you are scanning the right side of the field and then decide to throw left without looking over there you are in deep s***. .

But don't you do that without the cone off too? Lets take last year, if my primary WR was covered, i would then look to another one of my WR's, read the coverage, and throw the ball if he was open. I dont know any gamer who would look to one side of the field and then throw to the other side without looking over there. I dont think any gamers play like that.

But do you need a cone to do this? I thought we were all doing this for the last how many so years football games have been out.

So you do all that now, plus you add the second it takes to bring the cone over. In other words, if you play as you always did you still look off your primary WR and look to your secondary. Great he is open, now snap the cone over. It still takes a second longer, and simulates your QB in game vision, not your vision of the entire screen. If you don't you pay an accuracy penalty for the QB's vision not being loicked on his target.

I'm sorry no matter what you say, I can't agree this was simulated in past versions. My eyes would shift and make reads as you say, but my virtual QB could be looking behind me and throw the ball to anyone on the field without a penalty and I highly doubt any game too into account which way your virtual QB was looking when determing the accuracy of a pass.

Well I respectfully disagree. Since I learned about the double tap, it's almost like the cone is not even there. I was just playing a game with the Cowboys. On the pattern I ran, Keyshawn was my primary receiver on the right side running an out pattern. Glenn was going to be my second option running a comeback on the left. The cone was centered on Keyshawn when I snapped the ball, but he was covered, so I pulled R and double tapped X and my cone snapped to Glenn and I made a perfect throw for a 12 yard gain. This is EXACTLY how I've played the game in the past. I always get in my head at least two receivers that I'm going to go to and if the first one is covered, I go to the second one. Don't frett, though as I did look over to Glenn before I double tapped X and threw the ball to him so I went through my progressions.

This is certainly good news as now I can have the cone turned on without actually having to use it.

[Badgun]

I think what Bad is saying, and I agree with him on this, is that the cone reacts the same way whether it's Peyton Manning or Jesse Palmer when using the double tap method. EA should just get rid of the double tap in the next Madden iteration.

Exactly what I am saying.

[dbdynsty25]

I think what Bad is saying, and I agree with him on this, is that the cone reacts the same way whether it's Peyton Manning or Jesse Palmer when using the double tap method. EA should just get rid of the double tap in the next Madden iteration.

No it doesn't...

By not having to double tap to throw to a secondary receiver that is in Manning's cone...you are saving a step or two that the defender can't make up when the ball is in the air. To me, that's a significant advantage of using Manning as your QB. It's the difference between an interception or a deflection and a nice completion.

[bkrich83]

I think what Bad is saying, and I agree with him on this, is that the cone reacts the same way whether it's Peyton Manning or Jesse Palmer when using the double tap method. EA should just get rid of the double tap in the next Madden iteration.

No it doesn't...

By not having to double tap to throw to a secondary receiver that is in Manning's cone...you are saving a step or two that the defender can't make up when the ball is in the air. To me, that's a significant advantage of using Manning as your QB. It's the difference between an interception or a deflection and a nice completion.

Exactly. A guy like Manning doesn't always have to double tap, because of how many recievers his cone covers.

[spooky157]

I think what Bad is saying, and I agree with him on this, is that the cone reacts the same way whether it's Peyton Manning or Jesse Palmer when using the double tap method. EA should just get rid of the double tap in the next Madden iteration.

No it doesn't...

By not having to double tap to throw to a secondary receiver that is in Manning's cone...you are saving a step or two that the defender can't make up when the ball is in the air. To me, that's a significant advantage of using Manning as your QB. It's the difference between an interception or a deflection and a nice completion.

I've only had the game a couple of days so I've put in very little time with it compared to the rest of you guys but I was under the impression that with the lock on feature (R trigger) you would have to lock on to that receiver specifically in order to get the pass to him, even if he's inside the cone. If what you're saying is true then yes, it does save you time (one extra press of the button).

[bdunn13]

Its very hard to double tap when you are getting blitzed. Its like you almost have to throw to a back or your first read. It takes too much time to double tap.. and if I am not mistaken, your vision takes time to goto your next read. I still think the cone is the coolest feature in recent memory added to a football game. Saying it should be taken off or turned off seems is like saying you should have only 1 button to pass and when pressed it will throw it to the open receiver for you.

[Toper]

Saying it should be taken off or turned off seems is like saying you should have only 1 button to pass and when pressed it will throw it to the open receiver for you.

This is the second time that I've read you mentioning this, and I still don't understand what you're trying to say. I mean, playing with the cone off versus one button passing (which is included under the easy play option) are two COMPLETELY different ways of playing...am I missing something here?

Toper

[Zeppo]

For myself, when I use a QB with a big cone, like Trent Green or Brett Favre, I set the cone in the middle before the snap (unlocked, with the A button) and use the R stick to nudge it to one side or the other if need be. I can see several receivers in the cone at one time with these guys, so at any time I have a few options as to whom I want to throw right away, one button press, plus 'precision passing.' This makes it very tough for the opponent to read what receiver I am concentrating on and cheat towards him accordingly. On the other hand, when I use a QB with a small cone, like Vick or Patrick Ramsey, I am stuck with the one option in the cone, and so I have to use the lock-on feature. What I've discovered is that making an R-trigger switch to a receiver on the same side of the field as the primary read is very quick and I can get rid of the ball in time and with precision. However, if I try to switch sides of the field, the cone takes longer to sweep over to the other side of the field, and often I am too late to make a good throw on time. Thus, the game is an essentially different experience for me depending on how good the awareness rating of the QB I am using is: with big-cone guys, I am scanning the field and nudging the R stick, while with little-cone guys, I am locking on and switching with the R trigger.

The result of the cone is two-fold: one, it makes the QB awareness rating (not the accuracy rating, but the awareness rating) meaningful for human-controlled QBs. The other, and perhaps most important in the minds of Madden project leaders who are concerned with fair online play, the cone helps to eliminate the kind of cheese play that ruins online play agianst random opponents. With the cone, guys can't abuse a QB like Vick by running 20 yds. deep, scrambling around, and throwing 50yds down field on the run to the opposite side of the field and make the play. I hope a lot of guys hate the cone, I really do, because I think a lot of those cone-haters (present company excepted) are cheesers who take advantage of the video-gameness of Madden to make it play less like football and more like darts or some better analogy that I can't think of.

I don't think the cone is the end-all, be-all of passing in video game football, but I think it is clear that this is a good first attempt at more closely simulating the real game by adding a new element (QB awareness rating becomes meaningful for human-controlled QBs) that heretofore has been sorely lacking.

[Badgun]

I think what Bad is saying, and I agree with him on this, is that the cone reacts the same way whether it's Peyton Manning or Jesse Palmer when using the double tap method. EA should just get rid of the double tap in the next Madden iteration.

No it doesn't...

By not having to double tap to throw to a secondary receiver that is in Manning's cone...you are saving a step or two that the defender can't make up when the ball is in the air. To me, that's a significant advantage of using Manning as your QB. It's the difference between an interception or a deflection and a nice completion.

Exactly. A guy like Manning doesn't always have to double tap, because of how many recievers his cone covers.

Well maybe so, but even Manning would have to double tap to go all the way across the field. Your logic holds true if you have all your receivers in one area and you have a big cone.

[dbdynsty25]

Well maybe so, but even Manning would have to double tap to go all the way across the field. Your logic holds true if you have all your receivers in one area and you have a big cone.

That makes zero sense if you're trying to argue with my point. Of course you can't have ALL of the receivers in one area...that would be terrible play design. But Manning can sure as hell cover more than one receiver...Vick on the other hand...not so much.

[Danimal]

Well I respectfully disagree. Since I learned about the double tap, it's almost like the cone is not even there. I was just playing a game with the Cowboys. On the pattern I ran, Keyshawn was my primary receiver on the right side running an out pattern. Glenn was going to be my second option running a comeback on the left. The cone was centered on Keyshawn when I snapped the ball, but he was covered, so I pulled R and double tapped X and my cone snapped to Glenn and I made a perfect throw for a 12 yard gain. This is EXACTLY how I've played the game in the past.

How could it be exactly, your virtual QB now has to move his vision cone over to that receiver. EXACTLY would have been you just hitting the button for glenn regardless of where your virtual QB was looking.

Don't frett, though as I did look over to Glenn before I double tapped X and threw the ball to him so I went through my progressions.

This is certainly good news as now I can have the cone turned on without actually having to use it.

This line is funny, because I've never seen a guy with a bigger hard on then you trying to convince a bunch of people who like something they are wrong.

Also someone please explain to me how the double tap works, because aren't you holding R- Trigger and X to select the receiver, don't you need to let go of the R Trigger and hit X again to throw the pass?

Regardless, first version and something slipped by. The cheesers always find away around things, remember all the D Line problems with 2K series last year?

[wco81]

Anyone seeing slowdown?

The PS2 servers are flaky tonight. But the slowdown occurs in online games whether the servers are good or not.

You know EA hasn't done major enhancements to PS2 graphics so you wonder what the reason for the slowdown is.

Maybe rendering that cone, as it moves across the screen?

Don't know about the Xbox version but maybe we have to go next-gen to be able to use the cone without slowdown.

[bkrich83]

Anyone seeing slowdown?

The PS2 servers are flaky tonight. But the slowdown occurs in online games whether the servers are good or not.

You know EA hasn't done major enhancements to PS2 graphics so you wonder what the reason for the slowdown is.

Maybe rendering that cone, as it moves across the screen?

Don't know about the Xbox version but maybe we have to go next-gen to be able to use the cone without slowdown.

For me Xbox performance tonight was horrid. Laggy, got booted a few times, and had a hell of a time connecting to EA's servers.

[TRI]

You can't just double tap like you were entering a combo in a fighting game. The cone does have to swing around to the target and you still have to place and time your throw. There is a penalty for just double tapping quickly. I've tried double tapping before and it failed miserably. I'd try hitting my fullback in the flat by double tapping and the ball would either hit him in the back or sail right past him. When you use the right trigger you have to wait until the cone is over the receiver before you throw it or your accuracy goes down. When the cone is over the receiver then you time your pass. It's like once you highlight your receiver with the cone they know to expect the pass. There's times where I'll change to a receiver that is open but by the time the cone gets to him he's not anymore and I have to find someone else who is open. It also forces you to make your reads quicker and be a half step ahead of the defense. It's the most realistic representation for passing I've ever had the joy of playing in a football video game.

The read and lead passing in FEVER 2004 and maximum passing in NFL 2K are more like passing in real life compared to the simplistic precision vision cone passing in Madden 2006. In Madden 2006 the pass lead is limited and the pass is laser guided accurate. You can also lock onto a receiver and then the vision cone has no effect on passing . The read and lead in particular allows you to throw far ahead or behind a receiver. This way you have complete control over the pass lead.

[matthewk]

With the cone, guys can't abuse a QB like Vick by running 20 yds. deep, scrambling around, and throwing 50yds down field on the run to the opposite side of the field and make the play.

This could have also been solved by implementing a good physics model.

[matthewk]

Saying it should be taken off or turned off seems is like saying you should have only 1 button to pass and when pressed it will throw it to the open receiver for you.

No, we are saying (at least I am) that I prefer to make my reads myself, which I already do anyways. I do not want to hit one button that decides who to throw to. What football games have you been playing the past 6 years that you do not grasp the concept of passing without a cone, but not one button goes to whomever?

I swear, between this and your "people look for problems to be cool" comments, you're just trying to drum up controversy.

[bdunn13]

This is the second time that I've read you mentioning this, and I still don't understand what you're trying to say. I mean, playing with the cone off versus one button passing (which is included under the easy play option) are two COMPLETELY different ways of playing...am I missing something here?

Toper

Some people are saying the cone should be taken out next year. I am just pointing out I think the cone is the biggest improvement we have seen in passing in many many years... and removing it would be like removing 4 passing buttons.

[RallyMonkey]

Matt,

I hear what you're saying, but i think what those cone, i'll say "dislikers" as opposed to "haters", are missing is that the game is taking your idea of making YOUR reads from the couch or chair actually INTO the game itself. In other words, you scan the field and find the guy you think will be open. You pull the trigger and hit his respective button. That is like a QB in his mind saying "okay, there's my first choice". Button press one, you snap the ball. If he's open, one button press, the ball is off and to your first read. Great, done, terrific, your read was perfect. BUT, after the snap if option A is covered, while you may have identified your second or third read and their respective buttons, the game QB in the pocket HAS to look that way before he throws to make the game more realistic. Button press number two. He looks, SEES he's open, then button press 3 releases the ball to him. Where in past games it didn't matter where the GAME QB was looking when you pressed the button for read's 2,3, or beyond, this year's principle forces you to make the QB look before he throws. A concept absent in any football game up to this point.

And with regards to awareness, the better QB's, Manning, Brady, etc will see more of the field so that possibly two or three options will be "in the cone" and thus a single press will still work for them where it won't work for those in the Vick or lesser rated QB range.

Again, to each his own, but i think the best way to understand this is to realize that the feature is meant to take you from just being a couch potato QB playing the game to playing the game as the QB.

Hope this makes as much sense to you as it does to me.

[bdunn13]

One thing that makes the passing cone great is the fact that the QB awareness rating now actualy matters. In years past, it did not matter if you were passing with Vick or Manning, the awareness of both QBs were completely moot since you were controlling them. The only awareness that actualy mattered was YOURS.

This year, the QBs awareness AND your awareness both batter. I can't think of a better way.

Do I like the cone all the time? Heck no, I struggle like mad with the cone at times. My first 2 dynasty games I threw 9 freaking pics combined... but my 4th or 5th I threw only 1 while throwing for 391 yards.

Online, I get sacked like David Carr. Many times I try to throw the ball as soon as get the ball without changing my target and I get creamed. I have been sacked online 5+ plays in a row before. So yeah, the cone pisses me off too at times... But I still think its great. If it were easy, it would not be any fun.

[Brando70]

If you don't like the cone, that's one thing. Everyone's entitled to their opinion. But how hard is it to understand why it's there? If you've been playing Madden for years the changes are pretty obvious.

--Your QB now has to look in the direction he is throwing to make an accurate throw.

--While your QB can lock on to a specific receiver, he can also throw to any receiver in the cone without penalty. This finally makes the awareness rating meaningful to human-controlled QBs, as a bigger awareness means a bigger cone and a better chance to find an open receiver.

--The tap progression (aka double tap) does not render all QBs equal. As I said before, a QB with low awareness is going to probably have to lock onto each individual receiver before throwing. Someone like Manning will likely have 2-3 receivers in his passing cone. To me, this makes sense, as a really good QB doesn't lock onto his receivers as much and tip his hand where he is throwing.

--In fact, the old method is where all QBs were equal. I used to be able to throw wherever I, the God-like figure above the stadium, was looking. Rex Grossman in 05 had the same vision as every other QB -- mine. That is no longer true, and as DB pointed out, makes a player like Vick in particular much more realistic.

--Likewise, no other football game has never modeled QB vision. NFL 2k5 would penalize you for throwing on the run, but you could be staring longingly at your center's ass and still be able to huck the ball toward the sideline without penalty.

--In my experience, even using the switching method, the delay in the passing game is more realistic now. If I want to hit a player opposite where I'm looking, the R+button, cone movement, and button to pass cause an extra second or so, making blitzes much more effective. I think this forces you to make adjustments to blocking, routes, etc. to avoid getting sacked. I never worried about those before because I could just get rid of the ball to anyone instantly.

--You can actually read a QBs eyes on defense, which is a welcome change.

So again, I'm not bagging on anyone who doesn't like the way the cone is implemented. I thought HipE's War of the Worlds comment was pretty funny myself. It reminds me of the vision fields for the guards in Metal Gear Solid. But like the Hitter's Eye, it's a feature that, while artificial in the way it looks, adds more realism to the game in my opinon.