Live or 2K5 Revisited

jLp vAkEr0 · Post by **jLp vAkEr0** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:39 pm

Leebo33 wrote:
grtwhtsk wrote:Leebo - What did you like which 2K5 had over Live, and what in 2K5 just doesn't measure up to Live? Thanks.
There are three things that I enjoy more in Live:

1) Fouls. There are plenty of foul calls of many different varietys in Live. I know people are claiming they have realistic foul totals with ESPN and I believe them, but the problem is I wasn't seeing it. I played too many games of ESPN with hardly any fouls or not nearly enough foul shots. I love that in Live fouls influence my substitution pattern and the way I attack the CPU.

2) I like freestyle a lot more than ISO.

3) I like playing defense much more in Live.

This basically sums up why I like Nba Live much more.

Too bad it doesn't have ESPN's presentation and graphics.....

grtwhtsk · Post by **grtwhtsk** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:46 pm

javi wrote:
Leebo33 wrote:
grtwhtsk wrote:Leebo - What did you like which 2K5 had over Live, and what in 2K5 just doesn't measure up to Live? Thanks.
There are three things that I enjoy more in Live:

1) Fouls. There are plenty of foul calls of many different varietys in Live. I know people are claiming they have realistic foul totals with ESPN and I believe them, but the problem is I wasn't seeing it. I played too many games of ESPN with hardly any fouls or not nearly enough foul shots. I love that in Live fouls influence my substitution pattern and the way I attack the CPU.

2) I like freestyle a lot more than ISO.

3) I like playing defense much more in Live.
This basically sums up why I like Nba Live much more.

Too bad it doesn't have ESPN's presentation and graphics.....

Are the graphics that much better in ESPN? Is it the players, arenas, animations, etc.?

tsunami · Post by **tsunami** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:46 pm

Leebo33 wrote:
Tsunami,

Try lowering "on ball physical defense", increasing "freestyle effectiveness", and goofing with sliders like the "CPU fakeout percentage" or whatever it is called. That may open the game up a bit for you. I really don't know what to say. I can usually get plenty of good looks through a set offense, driving and dishing back out, or by faking a drive with freestyle getting the defender to step backwards and then shooting or drop stepping.

Thanks for the suggestions...unfortunately I've tried them already. I actually lowered "on ball physcial defense" to zero and didn't see much (or enough) improvement. And I can occasionally get some open looks and shots, but more often than not there is too much frustration in trying to get space.

Diablo25 · Post by **Diablo25** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 3:10 pm

I've been pumping up Live for a bit now but, I must say, I got ahold of some sliders for ESPN from a friend and I may be changing my mind. Man, its playing a pretty nice game of hoops right now. Started to get a bit frustrated with Live's perimeter game so I gave ESPN some more time and now its getting most of my attention. Both are good but ESPN is making a come back.

grtwhtsk · Post by **grtwhtsk** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 3:23 pm

tsunami wrote:
Leebo33 wrote:
Tsunami,

Try lowering "on ball physical defense", increasing "freestyle effectiveness", and goofing with sliders like the "CPU fakeout percentage" or whatever it is called. That may open the game up a bit for you. I really don't know what to say. I can usually get plenty of good looks through a set offense, driving and dishing back out, or by faking a drive with freestyle getting the defender to step backwards and then shooting or drop stepping.
Thanks for the suggestions...unfortunately I've tried them already. I actually lowered "on ball physcial defense" to zero and didn't see much (or enough) improvement. And I can occasionally get some open looks and shots, but more often than not there is too much frustration in trying to get space.

Tsunami - How are you liking 2K5? Anything you don't like about it?

grtwhtsk · Post by **grtwhtsk** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 3:25 pm

Diablo25 wrote:I've been pumping up Live for a bit now but, I must say, I got ahold of some sliders for ESPN from a friend and I may be changing my mind. Man, its playing a pretty nice game of hoops right now. Started to get a bit frustrated with Live's perimeter game so I gave ESPN some more time and now its getting most of my attention. Both are good but ESPN is making a come back.

Diablo - Would you share your sliders for ESPN please?

jLp vAkEr0 · Post by **jLp vAkEr0** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 3:38 pm

grtwhtsk wrote:
javi wrote:
Leebo33 wrote: There are three things that I enjoy more in Live:

1) Fouls. There are plenty of foul calls of many different varietys in Live. I know people are claiming they have realistic foul totals with ESPN and I believe them, but the problem is I wasn't seeing it. I played too many games of ESPN with hardly any fouls or not nearly enough foul shots. I love that in Live fouls influence my substitution pattern and the way I attack the CPU.

2) I like freestyle a lot more than ISO.

3) I like playing defense much more in Live.
This basically sums up why I like Nba Live much more.

Too bad it doesn't have ESPN's presentation and graphics.....
Are the graphics that much better in ESPN? Is it the players, arenas, animations, etc.?

Everything.....

Some animations are clunky since you lose control of your player until the damn animations ends. Other than that, ESPN just looks damn good.

tsunami · Post by **tsunami** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 3:44 pm

grtwhtsk wrote:
Tsunami - How are you liking 2K5? Anything you don't like about it?

I like it...just not sure if I like it more than ID 2004. I've already posted some of the things I don't like, but to reiterate:

- Lack of fouls
- Too easy to penetrate and score with guards
- Too many "hook" type shots from the paint (no matter who it is)
- Delay in responsiveness in relation to button presses and/or movement
- Lack of team specific plays right out of the box
- Seeming lack of dominance by superstar players (it's hit or miss alot)
- Direct pass icons go away too quickly
- Really don't like the free throw system

Again, this is not a total knock on ESPN, as Live too has it's share of problems IMO.

XXXIV · Post by **XXXIV** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 6:06 pm

I took the same approach with Live as I did with NHL 2005.
I have gone no where near it.

I know its a bit short sighted.......But I have been buying EAs games every year since the beginning of time.....I finally found a good enough reason to ignore the Gods at EA sports.......2K5 at $19.99.......

I probably would have bought them all again this year but NCAA left a very bad taste in mouth....
Not to mention that I found nothing compelling enough in even the most generous EA over 2K5 comparisons to justify flushing anymore money down the toilet.....

Diablo25 · Post by **Diablo25** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 6:24 pm

grtwhtsk wrote:
Diablo25 wrote:I've been pumping up Live for a bit now but, I must say, I got ahold of some sliders for ESPN from a friend and I may be changing my mind. Man, its playing a pretty nice game of hoops right now. Started to get a bit frustrated with Live's perimeter game so I gave ESPN some more time and now its getting most of my attention. Both are good but ESPN is making a come back.
Diablo - Would you share your sliders for ESPN please?

They are from a guy named Scoman at the OS forums:
Human\computer,number represents number of clicks from far left of slider

inside range-15
med range-15
long range-20
dunk success-15
layup success-15
swat jumpers-0
swat dunk/layup-0
blocking hop-0
sagging d-20
pick success-20
pick strength-20
off transition speed-20
def transition speed-20
steal-0
block-0
ballhandling-10
dunk-10
off dbl team aw-20
off court vision-20
def court vision-0
injury chance-10
injury effect-20

Toper · Post by **Toper** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 7:16 pm

javi wrote:
Leebo33 wrote:
grtwhtsk wrote:Leebo - What did you like which 2K5 had over Live, and what in 2K5 just doesn't measure up to Live? Thanks.
There are three things that I enjoy more in Live:

1) Fouls. There are plenty of foul calls of many different varietys in Live. I know people are claiming they have realistic foul totals with ESPN and I believe them, but the problem is I wasn't seeing it. I played too many games of ESPN with hardly any fouls or not nearly enough foul shots. I love that in Live fouls influence my substitution pattern and the way I attack the CPU.

2) I like freestyle a lot more than ISO.

3) I like playing defense much more in Live.
This basically sums up why I like Nba Live much more.

Too bad it doesn't have ESPN's presentation and graphics.....

I pretty much share leebo and javi's sentiments (especially with regard to fouls and graphics).

Also, I want to add that having NBA Live's separate button for dunks/layups is something I can no longer live without in a basketball videogame. I'm just finding it really frustrating (for me) to play espn and have to "guess" where the "dunk zone" is when going towards the hoop, or driving the lane thinking I'm gonna take it strong, only to have my guy end up shooting a jumper or hook shot. I just feel like I have more shot control and variety with Live's setup.

Toper

JackB1 · Post by **JackB1** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 9:33 am

I finally tried Live last night. I have had ESPN since it came out. I have to say, I feel like I just have "more to do" while playing Live, especially on defense. Not to mention the ability to go for the rebound, or a tip or rebound slam. The ability to dunk/layup or jump shot is great and Live DEFINITELY does fouls better than ESPN. I love how I can "face up/crouch" on D and raise or lower my arms. I think Live has a higher "fun factor" for me, but I will now have to go back and play some more ESPN to be sure. I was also surprised at how similiar freestyle is to ESPNs isomotion now. They both have a bit of animation delay, but besides that, they are both pretty similiar.

These 2 games are definitley both good in there own ways and preference will definitley be a personal taste thing. Also, everyone saying how much better ESPN's graphics are, so I was expecting Live to look like crap, but I was pleasantly surprized. ESPN does look "sharper" and more colorful, but Live's graphics overall are not that bad. Definitly wouldn't make me choose one game over another. IMO, Live's biggest flaw is the "skating" effect of the way the players move accross the court. IN ESPN, every step is a definitive plant of a foot and so on. If you can get past that, you can have a lot of fun with the game.

Does anyone know how the "foul difficulty" slider works in Live? It doesn't seem to speed up the moving lines, which I had hoped it would.

Leebo33 · Post by **Leebo33** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 9:42 am

Toper, I didn't know you were a Steelers' fan!

Has anyone played Live online? It seems like it would play great head-to-head, although I am worried that the blocks would be too high without slider adjustments.

BTW, I think Live has the same problem as Burnout 3 as far as erroneously reporting a user online. AlanB has been online in Live on my Friend's list for a few days now...LOL, but when I go online in Live he is offline.

dskrizzy · Post by **dskrizzy** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 10:45 am

Im actualy from the camp that likes both games. Both bug me with their respective problems. Live's fast breaks are more miss than hit. Although for some reason, I find it easier to fast break from the center and sideline cam. Espn with quick plays off and playsets enabled, I see that stupid sg hook shot from the post that is unblockable no matter if Theo Ratliffe is coming from weak side to help. Despite problems I enjoy both games quite a bit. Have been playing more Live than Espn, cuz as mentioned, there is more to do on defence and dont feel so helpless trying to guard someone.

Leebo, Javi or anyone, I finally got my xbox back and am ready to take any of the bball titles online for some runs. I'll be around tonight if anyone wants to get a game.

and1,
d.

FloridaGators · Post by **FloridaGators** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 10:47 am

I gotta say that I really enjoy Live this year. Fun game. Though, I haven't played tons of games, since I've spent countless hours playing the dunk contest and 3 point contest with friends. Really a great idea from EA.

I haven't read too much about ESPN 2k5, I'm guessing the horrible analog system of shooting free throws is back?

Leebo33 · Post by **Leebo33** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 11:18 am

dskrizzy wrote:Im actualy from the camp that likes both games. Both bug me with their respective problems. Live's fast breaks are more miss than hit. Although for some reason, I find it easier to fast break from the center and sideline cam.

Don't get me wrong. I like both games too. I just don't need two NBA games, especially when I'm positive I will be picking up College Hoops to get my fix of Sega basketball. I thought College Hoops was much better than NBA last year and if that is the case again then we will be in good shape.

I agree about the Live fast breaks. If Live had the transition game of 2K5 it would be a superb game IMO rather than just very good.

I will probably be on tonight after 9PM.

grtwhtsk · Post by **grtwhtsk** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 1:55 pm

FloridaGators wrote:
I haven't read too much about ESPN 2k5, I'm guessing the horrible analog system of shooting free throws is back?

I for one hate that system. Is it back?

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 1:59 pm

Yup, it's a little different though this time.

grtwhtsk · Post by **grtwhtsk** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 1:59 pm

Diablo25 wrote:
grtwhtsk wrote:
Diablo25 wrote:I've been pumping up Live for a bit now but, I must say, I got ahold of some sliders for ESPN from a friend and I may be changing my mind. Man, its playing a pretty nice game of hoops right now. Started to get a bit frustrated with Live's perimeter game so I gave ESPN some more time and now its getting most of my attention. Both are good but ESPN is making a come back.
Diablo - Would you share your sliders for ESPN please?
They are from a guy named Scoman at the OS forums:
Human\computer,number represents number of clicks from far left of slider

inside range-15
med range-15
long range-20
dunk success-15
layup success-15
swat jumpers-0
swat dunk/layup-0
blocking hop-0
sagging d-20
pick success-20
pick strength-20
off transition speed-20
def transition speed-20
steal-0
block-0
ballhandling-10
dunk-10
off dbl team aw-20
off court vision-20
def court vision-0
injury chance-10
injury effect-20

Diablo - Are they all the same for human and CPU? I don't see any "/" for any of the above sliders.

grtwhtsk · Post by **grtwhtsk** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 2:01 pm

dbdynsty25 wrote:Yup, it's a little different though this time.

Scott - In what way? For some reason, I always have problems with that analog system.

Leebo33 · Post by **Leebo33** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 2:11 pm

Oh yeah. That's another plus for Live. I abhor the free throw shooting system in the Sega games. I much prefer the Inside Drive or Live method. Plus, Live is fully adjustable with the slider depending on your skill level.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 2:14 pm

They try to make it more difficult by using a bouncing ball at the same time. You push the triggers to a certain point and then you have to time the ball. It's lame, I know, but I still like ESPN better.

Diablo25 · Post by **Diablo25** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 2:55 pm

Diablo - Are they all the same for human and CPU? I don't see any "/" for any of the above sliders.

Yep. I believe the "Start" buton switches you between the CPU and Human sliders.

Toper · Post by **Toper** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:48 pm

Leebo33 wrote:Toper, I didn't know you were a Steelers' fan!

Leeb,

Yeah, big "stillers" fan since the 70's...I finally got a chance to get to pittsburgh a couple of weeks ago and buy a terrible towel and some unis. Also, got to meet randle el at one of the malls there where he does a weekly radio show. Anyways, I think the "Big Ben" era is off to a pretty good start.

Toper

BasketballJones · Post by **BasketballJones** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 11:00 pm

Toper,
Glad you enjoyed the city. In a few weeks we will be renaming it Roethlisburgh.