DSP Blog League Version 2.0 Ready To Go!

Brando70 · Post by **Brando70** » Fri Oct 15, 2004 4:22 pm

XXXIV wrote:
Brando70 wrote:Ugh, I had the worst game of my life tonight. Todd (Tampa Bay) just strangled me with his defense. Grossman completed 3 of 15 passes for 8 yards. .

Nice to see I am not alone. Warner was 6 for 27 my last game vs db.
I kept trying to jam the ball into Toomer...Barbers injury has gotten into my head...I gave up on Dayne , even though hes been okay.....
My tendenacy for Martz like " Fast and Furious" play calling is pretty ironic, considering, I complain about him every week.

Like you , I love the league ...

I was a dummy for abandoning the run, for starters. Despite getting just creamed in yards, I was in it until the 4th quarter. Should have just kept feeding it to Jones. Then I kept trying to throw underneath and there just never seemed to be anybody open. I actually played decent defense except on third downs, where I just got killed.

I am open for business in terms of a WR trade. My best receiver right now is Desmond Clark -- yikes. I have some depth at guard, RB, and CB and am looking for an 80-ish receiver with decent catch and route running ratings. I'll be happy to do a 2-1 and throw in a WR for depth purposes as well.

bkrich83 · Post by **bkrich83** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 12:12 am

HipE and I just played out league game. Neither one of us controlled any dlinemen. Although neither one of us threw much, there was a grand total of 2 sacks, one by each team. The game was quite enjoyable.

Take it for what it's worth since I enjoy controlling my LB's, but I perosnally feel the gameplay is a little more balanced by not manually controlling the dline's, while still making sacks possible.

RobVarak · Post by **RobVarak** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 12:20 am

I'll abide by majority rule, but this is way over the line IMO. There is definitely a point of legislatie saturation, and this is well into that range.

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 12:21 am

And you guys thought all the drama would be over once the Non-DSP guys were out of the league.

You know the one nice thing about playing someone in the same room is the ability to use proper diplomacy. Guy uses DL, getting too many sacks and is pissinig you off? A knuckle punch to the funny bone will put an end to that.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 12:54 am

bkrich83 wrote:HipE and I just played out league game.

HipE is in our league?

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 12:56 am

Nevermind, you meant Hipstersudz. Different guys (although I'm not 100% positive??).

laurenskye · Post by **laurenskye** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 1:01 am

RobVarak wrote:I'll abide by majority rule, but this is way over the line IMO. There is definitely a point of legislatie saturation, and this is well into that range.

How is this over the line?
It seams you're insinuating that this is some shepard leading blind sheep or something.

just trying to understand what you mean.

bkrich83 · Post by **bkrich83** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 1:04 am

dbdynsty25 wrote:Nevermind, you meant Hipstersudz. Different guys (although I'm not 100% positive??).

Yeah that's what I meant. Old habit talking about HipE I think.

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 1:50 am

Ok again Spooky and I got disconnected. This time it was in the 3rd quarter and I was up 10-7.

How can I play 2 hours straight of SW:B, 6 games in a row of Madden without being disconnected once, but I only seem to have a %50 shot of completing an ESPN game? In fact come to think of it the only game I ever lose connections in our ESPN sports games.

What is this their 4th year of supporting XBL and they can't get their s*** together. This time Spooky got dropped and last time it was me so it is not my equipment.

I can't see myself finding the time this weekend to replay this game a 3rd time, so as far as I am concerned give Spooky the win Bill. With a wife who is due in 3 weeks and a 16 month old running around I have more important things to do this weekend.

seanmac31 · Post by **seanmac31** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:12 am

Quick question- do we have multiple hot routes enabled or not?

Sully · Post by **Sully** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 8:04 am

Danimal wrote:Ok again Spooky and I got disconnected. This time it was in the 3rd quarter and I was up 10-7.

How can I play 2 hours straight of SW:B, 6 games in a row of Madden without being disconnected once, but I only seem to have a %50 shot of completing an ESPN game? In fact come to think of it the only game I ever lose connections in our ESPN sports games.

What is this their 4th year of supporting XBL and they can't get their s*** together. This time Spooky got dropped and last time it was me so it is not my equipment.

I can't see myself finding the time this weekend to replay this game a 3rd time, so as far as I am concerned give Spooky the win Bill. With a wife who is due in 3 weeks and a 16 month old running around I have more important things to do this weekend.

Do you have DSL Danimal?
I had the same problems as you, constant disconnects on ESPN games. Even some lag. Then I found out that the phone line running to my satellite dish didn't have a dsl filter on it, like all of the phone lines in my house did.
Slapped one on that line and I've had no problems since.

RobVarak · Post by **RobVarak** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:25 am

laurenskye wrote:
RobVarak wrote:I'll abide by majority rule, but this is way over the line IMO. There is definitely a point of legislatie saturation, and this is well into that range.
How is this over the line?
It seams you're insinuating that this is some shepard leading blind sheep or something.

just trying to understand what you mean.

Not at all. I understand the impulse to implement house rules to create a fair gaming experience. I just think there's a point where the level of regulation becomes absurd. And that point is definitely passed when you're limiting the gaming experience by removing the entire defensive line from user control.

But again, I'm committed to the league and I'll abide by the choice of the majority.

Badgun · Post by **Badgun** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:57 am

RobVarak wrote:
laurenskye wrote:
RobVarak wrote:I'll abide by majority rule, but this is way over the line IMO. There is definitely a point of legislatie saturation, and this is well into that range.
How is this over the line?
It seams you're insinuating that this is some shepard leading blind sheep or something.

just trying to understand what you mean.
Not at all. I understand the impulse to implement house rules to create a fair gaming experience. I just think there's a point where the level of regulation becomes absurd. And that point is definitely passed when you're limiting the gaming experience by removing the entire defensive line from user control.

But again, I'm committed to the league and I'll abide by the choice of the majority.

Yeah, I agree. I think limiting it to the DE would serve enough purpose, but then again I don't play this game much either. As for me, I always control the right DT...it's just what I've always done in football games. Forcing me to control a LB or DB would seriously take me out of my comfort zone as I would be lost controlling anyone else. I think the real problem is guys that move their DE to the outside, charge them up, and then speed rush. Using a DT, I have one sack in two games and this is with a pretty good Cowboys defense.

I don't think telling people they can't control any defensive lineman is the answer anyway and RobVarak can verify this. In our first attempt at this league, I played him in our first game. He had like 8 sacks and I kept asking him what play he was calling to get to me so fast and he replied that he wasn't even blitzing that it was just four down linemen pass rush. The real problem is that this game is woefully broken and even telling someone that they can't control any DL is not the answer. You're going to have some of these guys that are just going to take a speedy LB and line him up on the corner and get you that way. I'm against cheese and an unlevel playing field probably moreso than anyone here, but I have to agree with Rob that if we keep adjusting what we can and can't do we're going to wind up with a rule that says you must control the SS and count to 3 before you switch to another player or something crazy like that.

I appreciate everything Bill's trying to do to make the league a fair and fun one, but just like the brain dead DBs, the entire pass rush vs. blocking scheme in this game is broken. Try playing against the CPU and stand in for longer than 2-3 seconds and you will get owned.

I voted against the limitation on the league site for several reasons...first of all because I use a DT and I don't get any sacks. Second of all, I don't like being forced to control a player I'm not comfortable with. I suggest you try and see if not using a DE solves the problem before completely taking the DL out of the equation. I plan to play my league game today and I plan to use my right DT like always. If my opponent has a problem with that then I'll just give him the win.

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:09 am

Sully wrote: Do you have DSL Danimal?
I had the same problems as you, constant disconnects on ESPN games. Even some lag. Then I found out that the phone line running to my satellite dish didn't have a dsl filter on it, like all of the phone lines in my house did.
Slapped one on that line and I've had no problems since.

Yes I do have DSL, but I double checked this morning I have a filter on every line. I am using a wireless option to my Xbox, and someone told me that is a problem with the ESPN games (I have no idea if this is true)

But it wasn't even me who disconnected last night. When I do lose connection, my dsl connection is never down or anything. In fact it says you lost connection, but yet I am dumped to the league lobby and still have a Live connection.

I am being totally serious that I can play any other Live game I have and never remember being disconnected. But it always happens in ESPN games. I'm sure a lot of people in this league have been dropped at 1 point or another while playing NFL2K5, can you think of other games that has happened in?

Anyway I don't want to make this an anti ESPN rant, I just want to figure out how to fix it.

Sully · Post by **Sully** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:14 am

I'd call your DSL provider.
I had the exact same problem. I couldn't finish an ESPN sports game without a disconnect. My service didn't shut down either, I was just booted back to the lobby. I could play Madden, NCAA, Rainbow 6, and SW with no lag or problems at all. It was just ESPN NBA, NFL, and NHL. That's it.

I put a filter on the line running to my satellite receiver and I've had no problems since. Connection has been running smooth, with no lag.

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:14 am

Badgun wrote: I voted against the limitation on the league site for several reasons...first of all because I use a DT and I don't get any sacks. Second of all, I don't like being forced to control a player I'm not comfortable with. I suggest you try and see if not using a DE solves the problem before completely taking the DL out of the equation.

Well they did try it and said it seemed better, myself and a few others (bkrich I think) play in other leagues where there is no controlling of the DL and we are telling you it makes the game better. Do you need more confirmation then 4 or 5 people who have tried it saying it helps?

I do agree with your assesment that the OL vs DL play in this game is really broken. But this one simple rule can make it a little better.

Bill_Abner · Post by **Bill_Abner** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:51 am

I appreciate all the feedback guys.

Rob, you're totally right. I'm not that democratic.

The only reason I asked for feedback and put this to a vote was because I don't want to bog down the league with rules. I think most of the house rules are no-brainers, though, designed to keep games fair and play marginally realistic (going for it on 4th down, onside kicks, etc.). I'm actually really torn about the DL issue, which is another reason why I wanted to get feedback from you guys on it. I *always* use a DL in football games. Always. I'd like to keep the DL use if we can. I just want everyone to have fun with it and not get sacked 4-6 times a game with a stat line of 6/20 for 100 yards.

Again, from the email I sent, this rule, if it's implemented, would not disallow any DL use; it would just prevent you from starting a play using a DL. You could switch to a DL as soon as the ball is snapped, if you wanted to. Still, I'm not sure what we're going to do yet. I want to wait until more people vote and we can keep discussing it.

Let me ask this: do you guys (who feel that there is an issue with this) feel that limiting DL shifts would suffice? Or is this simply a matter of the power-up moves useds by the DL are simply too good regardless?

Right now, there are 10 sacks per game, on average, which to me sends up a red flag. That would be a lot if we played 15 minute quauters, let alone 6.

I'm *all* for listening to other suggessions on what to do.

Is everyone keeping at least 1 RB/FB in to help pass block?

Is everyone allowing the QB to drop back before manually controllng him and dropping FARTHER back? (This is a HARD habit to break)

If there are any tips out there to give the QBs just another second or two of time, I'm all ears. Maybe this is also a bit of user error along with the DE rush stuff.

Bill_Abner · Post by **Bill_Abner** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:53 am

Danimal wrote:Ok again Spooky and I got disconnected. This time it was in the 3rd quarter and I was up 10-7.

Dan, FYI, it says that the Jets lost connection, not you.

Sully · Post by **Sully** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 12:13 pm

Bill_Abner wrote:
Danimal wrote:Ok again Spooky and I got disconnected. This time it was in the 3rd quarter and I was up 10-7.
Dan, FYI, it says that the Jets lost connection, not you.

Same for me. The game would drop me and disconnect my opponent.
I think it has something to do with his opponent not being able to maintain a connection.

laurenskye · Post by **laurenskye** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 12:43 pm

Badgun, I know what you mean, I have always used a DL. But using a DT you may be exploiting a huge glitch and not even know it.

Just try this experiment:

pick a defense with 4 DL.
choose Twist as your DL play.
spread your line.
control a DT and when the play starts run straight into the backfield untouched (if it is a pass play).

XXXIV · Post by **XXXIV** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 12:52 pm

Dlineman that arent controlled get to the qb without being touched.
Its flawed AI.
The game decides presnap that a Dlineman is going to get in.
Taking away the manual Dlineman will limit sacks but it will not solve the unblocked Dlineman problem.
It has nothing to do with the voo doo secret glitch fantasy.

Edit:LOL....Here I go again...my hypocracy knows no bounds....... Again whatever is fine..lets just move on.

I aint winning this thing anyway.....I just wanna play....

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 1:26 pm

Bill_Abner wrote:
Danimal wrote:Ok again Spooky and I got disconnected. This time it was in the 3rd quarter and I was up 10-7.
Dan, FYI, it says that the Jets lost connection, not you.

Oh, I know it was spooky who dropped. Actually he dropped last night when we tried to start the game, but thank god it didn't register. He logged back in and we go into the 3rd quarter and he dropped again. I was still in the lobby and he was offline so I know it was him.

I'm just saying that I will not have the time to replay it, I sent him and e-mail about it he didn't respond.

Anyway my point is I can't replay it again. He can have the win, or you can flip a coin. Whatever he wants to do.

Bill_Abner · Post by **Bill_Abner** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 1:31 pm

Danimal wrote:
Bill_Abner wrote:
Danimal wrote:Ok again Spooky and I got disconnected. This time it was in the 3rd quarter and I was up 10-7.
Dan, FYI, it says that the Jets lost connection, not you.
Oh, I know it was spooky who dropped. Actually he dropped last night when we tried to start the game, but thank god it didn't register. He logged back in and we go into the 3rd quarter and he dropped again. I was still in the lobby and he was offline so I know it was him.

I'm just saying that I will not have the time to replay it, I sent him and e-mail about it he didn't respond.

Anyway my point is I can't replay it again. He can have the win, or you can flip a coin. Whatever he wants to do.

I'll flip a coin when the deadline ends.

Bill_Abner · Post by **Bill_Abner** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 1:34 pm

And right now we have 12 saying No DL and 7 saying to keep it as is. Unless it ends up being an overwhelming majorty I'm probably not going to add the rule. I can definately see both sides of this.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 1:42 pm

Yeah 7 and 12 is definitely not enough to justify adding the rule.