OT: 2008 Elections/Politics thread, Part 2

[matthewk]

As a matter of fact, yes, I have been to Alaska. It is a way of keeping the wolf population down, but to keep the caribou and moose populations up, for you know what? More hunting! Wolves are a natural predator that weed out the sick and the weak and does it the way nature intended. I did a lot more research on the subject that apparently you have. They call it "population control" because it's the only way that this barbaric hunting method is allowed by law. If you dig a little under the surface, you will find out the truth behind this dirty little secret in Alaska. This stuff is going on. It's not made up by me or anyone else with an "agenda". The wolf population is getting so small, they don't even know their current numbers. They estimate around 5 to 10,000 wolves to over 200,000 moose. The grizzlies and black bear population has much more impact on the moose. You move to Alaska, you have to deal with the moose, bears, wolves and whatever was there first.

Busted. In your initial post on this you said "I just heard about this". You did a lot more research? In what, the past 30 minutes? I live in an area where we do a similar thing for deer, so I think I have some idea of the reasons outside of the link I provided. I didn't need Google to prove anything for myself. The link was for your benefit, not mine.

You're talking so far out you ass you don't even know which end is up.

And who said it was "ok to abort a fetus"? Are you insane?

Your messiah Obama says it's ok. You've got his logo as your avatar, so (crazy me) I assume you support him. Besides, you're so concerned for the well being of race horses and wolves that I figured you'd feel the same way about unborn children.

And you are asking if I'm the one that's insane.

[greggsand]

i was watching football like a good american, so I missed the "scare tactic video" they rolled. Good times! Nothing like exploiting the dead!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REO_ou11OJI

Pk, what does shooting wolves in your suburb & flying planes over miles of forest to shoot wolves have to do with each other? interesting story though..

Man, those matt & teal dudes love calling barack a messiah. you guys are scaring me.

[Jackdog]

I'm not wealthy, but I do recall the Bush tax cuts helping me.

Do you recall the thread where he was jonesing for his stimulus check?

Even with that extra $1200, we are still earning less than we did 8 years ago.

Speak for yourself. My wife and I have earned a great deal of money in the last 8 years. We have worked hard for our money and we enjoyed the tax cuts. So much we donated our stimulus check to a worthy cause.

[Feanor]

Is that an Iran-hostage clip at the start? Dear oh dear, they really have no shame.

[Feanor]

Speak for yourself. My wife and I have earned a great deal of money in the last 8 years. We have worked hard for our money and we enjoyed the tax cuts. So much we donated our stimulus check to a worthy cause.

Maybe he's talking about the median American household whose inflation adjusted income has actually fallen over the last eight years.

[matthewk]

Man, those matt & teal dudes love calling barack a messiah. you guys are scaring me.

I do that in fun. I don't really think he's Jesus, just a disciple

[JackB1]

I just heard about this and it made me sick to my stomach. I know most of you won't care about this, but it is very disturbing if you care at all about the humane treatment of animals.

Sara Palin has supported the barbaric "sport" of aerial wolf hunting. This is not a sport at all. Read this article and watch the video. I dont know if she partakes in this, but the fact that she allows it to go on is enough for me. She even placed a $150 bounty for every wolf that was killed. Read the article and watch the video and you may wonder if this woman is indeed "pro life".

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/glenn-hur ... 23388.html

For the last few summers, there were packs of coyotes in the farm field behind me that would roam all night, attacking pets, livestock, deer and other small animals. You could hear them singing as they swarmed around prey.

My kids also couldn't do things like camp out in the backyard or chase fireflies at night because those f*ckers were just 20 yards away from the edge of our property at times. They even crossed the cornfield and entered our property during the winter, foraging for food. I saw the tracks. I used to like to take walks in the plowed cornfield under the full moon in the winter with a cigar.

The coyotes have been much less active this summer. I heard around the neighborhood that one of the local farmers took out the alpha male of the pack with a shotgun or rifle, which then disperses the pack.

If I ever found out which farmer did that, I would buy him a beer and shake his hand. I don't give a sh*t if he killed that coyote from the air, standing up or laying on his belly. Ding-dong, those f*cking coyotes are almost gone.

It's one thing to sit in a suburban tract and complain about cruelty to wild animals. It's another thing to have those wild animals encroach more and more into your space and threaten your pets and loved ones to give you some perspective.

Take care,
PK

Paul, that's different. These wolves are not threatening the general population of Alaska or their families. These hunters are flying planes into remote mountains of Northern Alaska and seeking out these wolves for thrill killing under the guise of population control. It's cruelty to animals, plain and simple. I am against all unprovoked cruelty to animals. Defending your family or children against possible harm is another story and perfectly understandable.

The other thing is why are these wild animals encroaching more and more into our space? It's because they are looking for food because we have taken away their natural prey supply and building closer to their hunting grounds.

BTW..we have coyotes here too. They usually run the other way when they see people. They are often found dead in the streets after getting hit by cars.

[Jackdog]

Maybe he's talking about the median American household whose inflation adjusted income has actually fallen over the last eight years.

You know that,but I think he was using that broad brush he paints all his political posts with.

[pk500]

i was watching football like a good american, so I missed the "scare tactic video" they rolled. Good times! Nothing like exploiting the dead!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REO_ou11OJI

Yeah, that was really bad taste. Using images of 9/11 for political gain is about the worse thing you can do, and that's the ONLY reason that video was aired. It was a convention, for Christ's sake, not a memorial service.

Next time the Republicans can just cut to the chase and have that Camel-laden voice that narrated the video exhault: "Want to die at the hands of a towelhead? Vote for Obama. Want to maintain Fortress America? Vote for John MOTHERF*CKING McCain."

That said, Olbermann was WAY out of bounds for castigating the Republicans for airing the video while serving as the host of MSNBC's GOP convention coverage. No wonder Chris Matthews is so pissed off at Olbermann; a partisan stooge like that has no business sitting in an anchor's chair, which is supposed to be a perch of trustworthy impartiality, even on cable.

Pk, what does shooting wolves in your suburb & flying planes over miles of forest to shoot wolves have to do with each other? interesting story though..

I don't live in the 'burbs. I live in the sticks.

It has everything to do with a common reason between the farmer capping the alpha male coyote in the cornfield behind me and aerial hunting of wolves in Alaska -- predator control.

Take care,
PK

[pk500]

The other thing is why are these wild animals encroaching more and more
into our space? It's because they are looking for food because we have taken away their natural prey supply and building closer to their hunting grounds.

I call bullsh*t.

I think two houses have been built on my road in the last 20 years. Plus it's a country road, with houses only on each side. No subdivisions or tracts.

The coyotes are encroaching more and more into our yard because there are more of them. N.Y. Department of Environmental Conservation studies have shown that the numbers of coyotes is on the rise in upstate N.Y..

Take care,
PK

[JackB1]

Speak for yourself. My wife and I have earned a great deal of money in the last 8 years. We have worked hard for our money and we enjoyed the tax cuts. So much we donated our stimulus check to a worthy cause.

I was. By "we" I was referring to me and my wife. Our paychecks have not increased at the rate of inflation plus the value of our investments and house have dramatically decreased as well.

Glad to hear you guys are doing well.

BTW...we work hard also

[JackB1]

The other thing is why are these wild animals encroaching more and more
into our space? It's because they are looking for food because we have taken away their natural prey supply and building closer to their hunting grounds.

I call bullsh*t.

I think two houses have been built on my road in the last 20 years. Plus it's a country road, with houses only on each side. No subdivisions or tracts.

The coyotes are encroaching more and more into our yard because there are more of them. N.Y. Department of Environmental Conservation studies have shown that the numbers of coyotes is on the rise in upstate N.Y..

Take care,
PK

That may be the case. I was generalizing. Again...protecting your family and kids is fine with me.

[Jackdog]

Paul, that's different. These wolves are not threatening the general population of Alaska or their families. These hunters are flying planes into remote mountains of Northern Alaska and seeking out these wolves for
thrill killing under the guise of population control. It's cruelty to animals, plain and simple. I am against all unprovoked cruelty to animals. Defending your family or children against possible harm is another story and perfectly understandable.

The other thing is why are these wild animals encroaching more and more
into our space? It's because they are looking for food because we have taken away their natural prey supply and building closer to their hunting grounds.

This isn't just an Alaska thing man. Why do you insists on sticking to that state? Is it because of political reasons? Where's the grief for the Democratic led state of Wyoming killed coyotes?

http://www.trib.com/articles/2008/08/01 ... 030485.txt

Coyotes have for years been the No. 1 target of USDA Wildlife Services agents in Wyoming, with annual kills in the range of 6,000 to 7,000.

County predator management boards hire the federal agents to take out predators in the hope of protecting livestock. And now with the new infusion of state funding, the boards are also required to spend some of the dollars to enhance local wildlife populations.

"We're hopeful (the increased coyote take) will translate into a reduction in losses of livestock," Krischke said. "But we're also hoping we will see some increases in deer, antelope and bighorn sheep."

Wildlife Services added about 20 people to its statewide force following the funding increase, and now 40 to 45 in-the-field agents are working in Wyoming, Krischke said.

Of the nearly 11,000 coyotes destroyed by the agents in fiscal year 2007, nearly 7,500 were shot from airplanes, according to the USDA statistics released last week.

Another 1,480 were killed by firearms on the ground. The next most common method used was neck snares, with which agents killed 871 coyotes.

Fewer sheep losses

You pinned this on Palin but you've yet to mention the other states they do this in out west. Why?

Anyhow,don't answer that. I know the answer. My last thought on this is simple. They are considered preditors and until that changes it is what it is.

[greggsand]

i was watching football like a good american, so I missed the "scare tactic video" they rolled. Good times! Nothing like exploiting the dead!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REO_ou11OJI

Yeah, that was really bad taste. Using images of 9/11 for political gain is about the worse thing you can do, and that's the ONLY reason that video was aired. It was a convention, for Christ's sake, not a memorial service.

Next time the Republicans can just cut to the chase and have that Camel-laden voice that narrated the video exhault: "Want to die at the hands of a towelhead? Vote for Obama. Want to maintain Fortress America? Vote for John MOTHERF*CKING McCain."

Don't forget the McCain video that literally WROTE OFF 136 deaths on that aircraft because McCain survived. It said 136 men died, but McCain survived because "perhaps he had more to do"... Like those other dudes didn't. Talk about "the chosen one"...

[Jackdog]

Speak for yourself. My wife and I have earned a great deal of money in the last 8 years. We have worked hard for our money and we enjoyed the tax cuts. So much we donated our stimulus check to a worthy cause.

I was. By "we" I was referring to me and my wife. Our paychecks have not increased at the rate of inflation plus the value of our investments and house have dramatically decreased as well.

Glad to hear you guys are doing well.

BTW...we work hard also

I am sure you do. Thanks and good luck. I hope you both have a better year.

[JackB1]

Man, those matt & teal dudes love calling barack a messiah. you guys are scaring me.

I do that in fun. I don't really think he's Jesus, just a disciple

More republican scare tactics. Don't forget that Karl Rove's protege is running McCain's campaign. It worked before...why not again?

[JackB1]

Your messiah Obama says it's ok. You've got his logo as your avatar, so (crazy me) I assume you support him. Besides, you're so concerned for the well being of race horses and wolves that I figured you'd feel the same way about unborn children.

And you are asking if I'm the one that's insane.

Yes, I support him. You got that one right! Good for you! There's hope

So now everyone that supports Obama is for the killing of unborn children? That's rich. Can you look outside your little black and white world for just a minute with me?

You can be "Pro Choice" and be against abortion at the same time.

Just like I can be against the war, but support the troops at the same time.

Still with me? Good.

Now, I will try and explain this to you again in a way that maybe you will understand:

(Read this part slowly) I AM PERSONALLY AGAINST ABORTION.
I don't think it's up to me (or the gov't) to decide what's best for everyone else. Everyone has their own morals, situations and has to deal with these things on their own level.

[Teal]

I totally agree. I think they are equally qualified to be Vice-President.

Joe Biden agrees. Flip the ticket!

A brilliant point, sir!

[Teal]

Man, those matt & teal dudes love calling barack a messiah. you guys are scaring me.

I do that in fun. I don't really think he's Jesus, just a disciple

I don't give him that much credit...

[matthewk]

Man, those matt & teal dudes love calling barack a messiah. you guys are scaring me.

I do that in fun. I don't really think he's Jesus, just a disciple

More republican scare tactics. Don't forget that Karl Rove's protege is running McCain's campaign. It worked before...why not again?

I didn't realize that Teal & I were working for the McCain campaign now.

[matthewk]

Your messiah Obama says it's ok. You've got his logo as your avatar, so (crazy me) I assume you support him. Besides, you're so concerned for the well being of race horses and wolves that I figured you'd feel the same way about unborn children.

And you are asking if I'm the one that's insane.

Yes, I support him. You got that one right! Good for you! There's hope

So now everyone that supports Obama is for the killing of unborn children? That's rich. Can you look outside your little black and white world for just a minute with me?

You can be "Pro Choice" and be against abortion at the same time.

Just like I can be against the war, but support the troops at the same time.

Still with me? Good.

Now, I will try and explain this to you again in a way that maybe you will understand:

(Read this part slowly) I AM PERSONALLY AGAINST ABORTION.
I don't think it's up to me (or the gov't) to decide what's best for everyone else. Everyone has their own morals, situations and has to deal with these things on their own level.

Duh, I don't get it. I'm just a stupid Republican that sees everything in black and white.

I find it amazing that you can be so concerned for the welfare of animals, but not for human beings. You're contradicting yourself there, and that I really do not understand.

[matthewk]

Speak for yourself. My wife and I have earned a great deal of money in the last 8 years. We have worked hard for our money and we enjoyed the tax cuts. So much we donated our stimulus check to a worthy cause.

I was. By "we" I was referring to me and my wife. Our paychecks have not increased at the rate of inflation plus the value of our investments and house have dramatically decreased as well.

Glad to hear you guys are doing well.

BTW...we work hard also

I am sure you do. Thanks and good luck. I hope you both have a better year.

My pay was frozen for 4 years between 2001-2004. In fact, my take home actually went down becasue of additional medical payments. Then I was told my job was being eliminated. During that time I was resentful of those better off and I voted for Kerry in the election because I was fed up with Bush.

I was able to find another job, and a better one at that. I'm maknig more than I ever have before. However, 4 years later I am looking at the potential of our entire IT department being outsourced. Here we go again. The difference is that this time I'm not really bitter (still a bit ticked off), or trying to blame a single man in the government for my situation.

Being through this twice has taught me a lot. Businesses do what is best for them to make money. Sometimes that sucks for us (the normal working folk), but it is the reality. I do not want more unemployment or welfare, I want a job. I want to earn my keep and have the opportunity to earn more if I do a good job. Taxing businesses will only accellerate their outsourcing of jobs to China, India, or wherever they think they can get the same work done cheaper. Sure I think a lot of CEOs (and athletes) make way to much $$$. But that's the way it is right now. Taxing them may make me feel good that we're sticknig it to them, but that won't help me in the long run.

For the record, there are things I like about Bush, but I am not a supporter of his. He has screwed up quite a bit, but he's also taken some unfair shots. IMO the tax cuts are a good thing for me, even if they help out those richer than me as well.

[Jackdog]

I was able to find another job, and a better one at that. I'm maknig more than I ever have before. However, 4 years later I am looking at the potential of our entire IT department being outsourced. Here we go again. The difference is that this time I'm not really bitter (still a bit ticked off), or trying to blame a single man in the government for my situation.

Damn Matt I hate to hear that. I hope it doesn't happen.

Being through this twice has taught me a lot. Businesses do what is best for them to make money. Sometimes that sucks for us (the normal working folk), but it is the reality. I do not want more unemployment or welfare, I want a job. I want to earn my keep and have the opportunity to earn more if I do a good job. Taxing businesses will only accellerate their outsourcing of jobs to China, India, or wherever they think they can get the same work done cheaper.

No doubt. Great point. I can't understand why people that call for raising taxes on big businesses don't grasp the fact it's not going to hurt the businesses. They just raise prices for their product and pass it on to the working class. $hit rolls downhill. I live in the middle of that hill. I'll take any tax cuts that come my way. One of the biggest reasons I am not voting for Obama is simple. I think he will cost me money. All of his promises are going to cost a shitload of cash to bring about. I like the guy as a person. But I don't want his hands in my wallet.

[Leebo33]

Duh, I don't get it. I'm just a stupid Republican that sees everything in black and white.

Matt, I'll fix that for you

Duh, I don't get it. I'm just a stupid Republican that sees everything in white.

[RobVarak]

One of the biggest reasons I am not voting for Obama is simple. I think he will cost me money.

How selfish of you to try to deprive us all of the Leader that we need for your own financial gain!

Apparently the GOP scare tactics of making you afraid of his name and his race are working on you. He keeps talking about it, so it must be happening.