I understand how people can think MVP is more fun...it definitely is more instantly satisfying. But realism wise, it really puzzles me how you could make the same claim. But it's just my opinion afterall.
Badgun wrote:So despite the problems with MVP, it still plays a much better, much more realistic game of baseball...
Absolutely without a doubt...WRONG.
How can you say I'm wrong? It's my opinion...you can say you disagree, but I'm not wrong.
If you want to dig a little deeper here, we can do that.
1. Have you seen a passed ball or wild pitch in ASB?
2. Have you seen offline or bad throws in ASB?
3. Have you seen a dropped fly ball in ASB?
4. Have you seen bunt pop flies for outs?
5. Have you seen balls hit back at the pitcher that bounced off of him?
I could go on and on, but MVP has all of these things and I see them on a regular basis, not just once in a blue moon. They add a lot to the immersion factor as well as to the strategy of a baseball game. MVP is far from perfect, but I still say that it provides more of a real baseball experience than this dog that Acclaim calls a baseball game. Yes, I've seen bad AI in MVP and I'm well aware of the the lack of walks and steals, but it's still a damn fun game to play.
db, we all knew you didn't like MVP right out of the box so it's no surprise that you would say I'm WRONG, but I give you two weeks and you'll be s***ting on ASB as well.
I have seen all of those things except for #5 in ASB in the first 5 games of my franchise.
ASB is not a great game...but it's decent. The franchise mode alone will probably keep it in my collection. I like MLB better 'on the field' and I like ASB better 'off the field', so I'll probably keep both pending ESPN in a couple weeks. MVP doesn't work better than either ASB or MLB, that's all there is to it.
Saw something hilarious and sad today, playing at Retro Dodger Stadium. I hit in into deep center field, and it bounced against the wall and caught in that little alcove, you know the one. Anyway, the center fielder approached the ball on a straight line, but the part of the wall that juts out into center field was blocking his path. He stopped, knelt down, and apparently summoned up his powers of telekinesis. The ball started rolling towards him, through the corner of the wall, and into his glove. It's clear that the way they've fixed magical vacuum catches, is to make the magical vacuum effect even more pronounced. That doesn't really bother me though. If the ball didn't change direction on certain catches, I know they'd be caught anyway. The ball would just magically disappear two feet to the player's left, like the last couple of years.
There's only two things that keep me from really getting into this game, the lack of responsiveness from fielders, and the fact that no camera gives you a good enough view of where the ball is headed. There's usually a slow reveal, or pan up, while I'm left hoping that I made my jump in the right direction.
The throw issue is a real drag. How could they play test the last four versions of this game and convince themselves that the button response time was quick enough? I feel like like I'm on a cellphone, telling these guys what to do... "Can you hear me now? Yeah? Then THROW THE GOD DAMN BALL!"
Ahem.
Meanwhile, I'm looking at all the cutesy, often self-aggrandizing billboards they've filled their stadiums with (i.e. All-Star, King of Baseball Games, or Real Gamers Play All-Star) and I pray that they didn't allocate precious development time away from playability and into useless, off-base claptrap. I mean, if one of the billboards said "All-Star Baseball, Pretty Good But Sorry About The Slow Response Time" I'd find that funny, but instead I'm doubly frustrated by their apparent blindness to certain game problems AND their willingness to toot their own horn. The two go hand in hand.
I suppose it comes down to the engine they've been milking for the past four years. They just can't seem to speed it up, or smooth it out, or something. And I know it's expensive to tear down and start over, a la MVP. But even in the ESPN demo, unimpressive as I found it, they did seem to address player speed and the response time of throws.
Oh, and fielder cam sucks. How am I supposed to jump for balls at the wall when you can't see the ball to time it?
Badgun wrote:So despite the problems with MVP, it still plays a much better, much more realistic game of baseball...
Absolutely without a doubt...WRONG.
How can you say I'm wrong? It's my opinion...you can say you disagree, but I'm not wrong.
Oh sweet Ivan DeJesus. So we've now reached the point in this MVP vs. ASB war that we're arguing if he can say you're wrong vs. he disagrees? In that case, you never stated "IMO", you stated it as a fact. DB is entitled to his opinion as well, which is that you are wrong.
All I know at this point is that none of the games so far has a clear advantage. They've all teased me with more features, more animations, and little things, but they all missed some glaring issues as well.
MAYBE MVP plays a better gmae of basebal, but how can you say that it is "much better" and "much more realistic" when Bonds can't outhit Renteria in a HR contest? Sorry for continuously bringin this up, but that's a big motsa ball hanging out there. Add to that the walks, steals, pintch hit IA, etc.. and there is no way it is far superior to any of the other games.
I've been back and forth with MVP, ASB, and even going back to WSB2K3 until ESPN comes out. I erally WANT one of these games to jump up and say "Hey, here I am. play me!", but so far no one has stepped up to the plate (pun intended).
NoJoke wrote:Over at OS there is talk of a roster editing problem. Does anyone know what this is?
Joe
I have no problems editing rosters. I did find it odd that you can't edit the rosters for exhibition play, just for franchise. The complete opposite of MLB...at least it's the good way. You can created and modify for Ex. games, but you can't trade players...really weird. Once you start a franchise you've got all the control in the world. I'm a big fan of that...who cares about exhibition rosters.
I broke down and purchased it this morning for $30 at Gamestop.
I am in the minority, but I love fielder cam...I just wish they had an option to not have it in play while batting.
I wish this game had MLB's zone hitting, I would be in heaven.
I playe a pick up game at the school yard. man are the fiedls sweet. The collision detection is amazing.
I still dont feel rewarded with any type of hitting. I just hope to hit the ball hard somewhere...It feels the same on a slow roller as a hard shot in the gap...unlike MLB.
Pitching is much harder without the help....and fun.
I can see myself playing this and MLB extensively..unlike MVP.
I can't wait to try it out on Live...fielder cam and all.
I have no problems editing rosters. I did find it odd that you can't edit the rosters for exhibition play, just for franchise. The complete opposite of MLB...at least it's the good way. You can created and modify for Ex. games, but you can't trade players...really weird. Once you start a franchise you've got all the control in the world. I'm a big fan of that...who cares about exhibition rosters.[/quote]
Does this prevent you from downloading updated rosters using an Action Replay to use in your Franchise?
Badgun wrote:So despite the problems with MVP, it still plays a much better, much more realistic game of baseball...
Absolutely without a doubt...WRONG.
How can you say I'm wrong? It's my opinion...you can say you disagree, but I'm not wrong.
If you want to dig a little deeper here, we can do that.
1. Have you seen a passed ball or wild pitch in ASB?
2. Have you seen offline or bad throws in ASB?
3. Have you seen a dropped fly ball in ASB?
4. Have you seen bunt pop flies for outs?
5. Have you seen balls hit back at the pitcher that bounced off of him?
I could go on and on, but MVP has all of these things and I see them on a regular basis, not just once in a blue moon. They add a lot to the immersion factor as well as to the strategy of a baseball game. MVP is far from perfect, but I still say that it provides more of a real baseball experience than this dog that Acclaim calls a baseball game. Yes, I've seen bad AI in MVP and I'm well aware of the the lack of walks and steals, but it's still a damn fun game to play.
db, we all knew you didn't like MVP right out of the box so it's no surprise that you would say I'm WRONG, but I give you two weeks and you'll be s***ting on ASB as well.
I am not a big ASB fan, but I have seen everything you put on that list in the short time I've had ASB.
I haven't heard any talk about anyone updating the rosters via AR. This is the first time in a long time that I can remember that no one is working on the rosters.
sportdan30 wrote:I haven't heard any talk about anyone updating the rosters via AR. This is the first time in a long time that I can remember that no one is working on the rosters.
according to developoers, there should be a roster update sometime during the first week of the season.
A wierd thing about the Acclaim 2d cursor is that timing seems to have no effect on whether you pull the ball. If you hit the ball with the inside of the cursor you pull it, in the center you hit to center and if you hit it with the outside of the cursor you hit it the other way. That is fundementally wierd.
The gameplay does grow on you once you get the nuances of the game but I really feel like I am trying to fit a square peg in a circle hole when I play it. There are alot of things about it that make you wince.
It is really starting to depress me that there will be no new version of High Heat this year. Although I was looking for one of the other games to replace it last year I ended up back in it grips in the end. With a few minor slider adjustments HH2004 plays an almost perfect game of baseball. IMO it is one of the most underated titles, even within the HH community. I have a feeling that this year will be more of the same - I'll try them all and end up resurrecting HH. It is really a shame that we won't be treated to a new version of the best video game baseball series that has ever been made.
I will try to make this my last post in this thread as I know people here enjoy the game and I will respect them and not post any more negative things. That said, I played for a couple more hours this evening and I just do not like the game at all. In fact, I would list this game as one of the worst I have ever played. I have nitpicked games in the past, but I also have found positive things in games such as Inside Pitch and Live 2004 that other people panned. I just cannot say many nice things about ASB. If this game was representative of the majority of games out there I would pull a "Siam" and retire from gaming.
The control is poor, the camera angles on defense suck, the zone hitting is broken, there are many many graphical errors that *do* effect gameplay (tonight alone in one of my games I had a ball that was way out of play curve and land in the left fielders glove and then I had a poor throw from the outfield bounce off the mound and take almost a right turn to the cutoff man), the AI is overrated, and the pitches are the most unrealistic I have seen in a baseball game. That doesn't even take into consideration what I would consider nitpicks that drive me crazy as well, such as fielders covering the wrong bases and first baseman that don't even come close to putting their foot on first base.
OK. I am done now. I owe MVP as huge apology though. If they can patch the lefty power bug I will buy it for PC. I feel guilty for slamming these baseball games, but let it stand for the record...I do like games! I don't think I've ever said any negative things about games that deliver like Inside Drive, Live, ESPN Football, Madden, NCAA, Links, NHL 2004, Project Gotham Racing, CM4, Winning Eleven, etc.
Why doesn't everyone quit saying this game is better or that game. The reality is all baseball games suck this year. Oh maybe this one does this right or this one does that right but when it comes down to it they all suck.
In fact no baseball game has yet managed to capture the sport, unless you want to sim through a franchise in manage only mode but these are VIDEO games, which to me means we play them with VIDEO. To interact with the other VIDEO elements going on.
I think it's pathetic that programers don't put that aspect of it first and then work around that.
MVP might be fun, but it's not baseball. ASB might have an awsome franchise mode, but the gameplay sucks. If you think these things are not true than your just sticking up for "your" game (IMO ).
The fact is we are still waiting for a game that does it right.
Suck is a strong word. I think MVP approaches suckiness. But ASB and MLB are good, not great baseball games. I think most of us finds at least one of these games to be good. However, I agree, compared to football where you have Madden or ESPN Football, the choices aren't as strong.
It looks like if you want great baseball games, you have to import either Konami's or Namco's new Japanese baseball games that came out this week. I like ASB and MLB, but I hope Konami and Namco uses these solid, near WE7 level in quality, baseball engines one day with MLB licenses.
By the way, I don't understand this nycmanowar character at OS who keeps posting that ASB is too easy for him with the hardest settings. Does anyone agree with him? Last year's game was too easy, especially pitching wise, but this year I'm getting killed on Legend, I think I need to go back to All star.
Parker wrote:By the way, I don't understand this nycmanowar character at OS who keeps posting that ASB is too easy for him with the hardest settings. Does anyone agree with him? Last year's game was too easy, especially pitching wise, but this year I'm getting killed on Legend, I think I need to go back to All star.
That guys full of S*it! I am also getting waxed on Legend. I am talking about being down by 5 or 6 runs by the 3rd inning. He's on crack.
Snate, have you tried MLB05? It is definitley the game for HHeat players.
The zone hitting/pitch guessing is very reminiscent of HH. It played a very "pure" game of baseball. More so than any other viseo baseball game out now, IMO. If you haven't tried it, you owe it to yourself to check it out.
>>>>It is really starting to depress me that there will be no new version of High Heat this year. Although I was looking for one of the other games to replace it last year I ended up back in it grips in the end. With a few minor slider adjustments HH2004 plays an almost perfect game of baseball. IMO it is one of the most underated titles, even within the HH community. I have a feeling that this year will be more of the same - I'll try them all and end up resurrecting HH. It is really a shame that we won't be treated to a new version of the best video game baseball series that has ever been made.[/quote]
After throwing MLB 05 back in, I'm seriously considering dropping ASB. For all the roster management things it does right...the on the field isn't as good as MLB. Both are flawed, in fact all the games are flawed big time, but MLB is the most fun at this point.
I'm gonna pick up HH 2004 for the PC tomorrow because I think that is going to give me my true SIM experience...MLB will just be my good times game.
ASB is cool...not nearly as bad as everyone makes it out to be, but it seems like it's less complete than it was last year which is too bad because I like the sim properties of the game.
dbdynsty25 wrote:After throwing MLB 05 back in, I'm seriously considering dropping ASB. For all the roster management things it does right...the on the field isn't as good as MLB. Both are flawed, in fact all the games are flawed big time, but MLB is the most fun at this point.
I'm gonna pick up HH 2004 for the PC tomorrow because I think that is going to give me my true SIM experience...MLB will just be my good times game.
ASB is cool...not nearly as bad as everyone makes it out to be, but it seems like it's less complete than it was last year which is too bad because I like the sim properties of the game.
Yeah, that's exactly what I was thinking. I really liked last year's version. I really dug the franchise mode and I played it for about two months, but in the end, I could not hit with the cursor so I got rid of it.
This year's version just did not feel as good as last year's, not to mention they still didn't have a hitting option for me.
db, you're not the first person that said they felt that last year's version was better...I've seen several people post that over at OS.
Yeah, I keep switching the games out...MLB and ASB...MLB is a much more complete game in terms of animations and lack of bugs...
Like I said previously...if ASB was the only game around I could live with it, but it's not, so I'm gonna play MLB until ESPN comes out and then make another decision between the two.
I don't know though...I'm a big fan of ASB and I guess when I said that last years felt more complete, the OS guys were saying the same thing. I guess I was right in assuming that.
Exactly Piggy...ASB is cool, there are a lot of things to like, but MLB is just a well packaged game (except for the damn rosters...man, what a way to ruin a nice game).
).
