First Look At Fifa 09

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Rodster
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Post by Rodster »

seanmac31 wrote:
Rodster wrote:
Zlax45 wrote:I am also torn on this
Me too. PES 2009 seems much improved over last year and FIFA 09 seems to be much like FIFA 08 with tweaks.
Yeah, I couldn't turn down PES for $40 at Amazon, but I'll trade in a few and grab FIFA as well. Basically, it just means I'm passing on NBA 2K9 until it's about half price on ebay.
I may get the PC version of PES 2009 when it comes out. The community usually puts out nice option files for the game so it's really easy to mod. I may get FIFA 09 for the PC and that also is a game that's supported by the community as well.

I'll probably go with NBA 2K9 for the PC because of the framerate issues with the console versions. I decided to pickup a new copy of NBA 2K8 for the 360 from ebay for $15 just to hold me over till next year.
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Post by pk500 »

Zlax45 wrote:I am also torn on this
Add me to that list, too.

FIFA 09 clearly is the best FIFA game yet for the PC. Looks pretty and actually plays realistic soccer. Good ball physics, good game speed, finally true differentiation between good and bad teams, AI defenders give proper amounts of space depending on where you're located on the pitch, etc.

But like in past FIFA games, the AI doesn't use the width of the field well at all. I see very few crosses from the wings, as the AI will continue to hammer down the middle of the park, looking for openings. Sometimes the AI will swing the ball to the wing with one pass and then hit a return pass down the middle.

PES 2009 for the PC is more improved than most review sites are crediting. I think most reviewers really want FIFA to be as good or better than PES to keep Konami on its toes. And this FIFA is closer to PES than ever.

But I don't think it's quite there yet.

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Follow-up: With more action, I'm seeing more of the stuff that I didn't like from recent editions of PES. The game still moves too fast, and while defenders aren't maniacal like in the past, they still man-mark way too aggressively in spots where they normally wouldn't. When you have strikers marking in their offensive end like the best defenders in the world, it's not quite right. Plus the AI members of your offense don't go on runs without your prompting -- give-and-go, for example -- enough. That's one area where FIFA is VASTLY improved, the off-the-ball movement.
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Post by Jimmydeicide »

I don't think i'm getting pes this year as the cpu interference with user controls is worse than ever seems i'm only controlling the player half the time.
So after playing the Fifa demo some more id like to ask if the full game plays the same as the demo. The demo seems really good and with the team tactics thread in full swing at OS it sounds like it could have some real depth this year.
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Post by JRod »

Jimmydeicide wrote:I don't think i'm getting pes this year as the cpu interference with user controls is worse than ever seems i'm only controlling the player half the time.
So after playing the Fifa demo some more id like to ask if the full game plays the same as the demo. The demo seems really good and with the team tactics thread in full swing at OS it sounds like it could have some real depth this year.
Feels better Jimmy!
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Post by Jimmydeicide »

JRod wrote:
Jimmydeicide wrote:I don't think i'm getting pes this year as the cpu interference with user controls is worse than ever seems i'm only controlling the player half the time.
So after playing the Fifa demo some more id like to ask if the full game plays the same as the demo. The demo seems really good and with the team tactics thread in full swing at OS it sounds like it could have some real depth this year.
Feels better Jimmy!
Ok thanks JRod Fifa it is. Gonna go break the kids piggy banks.
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Post by pk500 »

I'm chiming in from the PC side, but I'm choosing FIFA over PES for the first time ever this year.

Both games have flaws, but FIFA's are less galling to me. Plus FIFA 09 feels like a different game than FIFA 08, while PES 2009 feels like a tiny derivation of the game I've played for the last six years.

The jump from FIFA 08 to FIFA 09 on the PC is every bit as significant as that from MVP 2004 to MVP 2005 on the consoles. EA really got footie right this year.

Take care,
PK
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Post by Zeppo »

Im rapidly nearing the point where I'll be fed up with this game.

I guess a big part of our success in OTP last year was due to the fact that we had a team and were playing against motley groups of randoms. With the Club thing now, we don't have that advantage, and our total lack of any consistent success is really wearing me down.

Another issue is this whole 'are we 85s or not?' thing. I would say it's hard to believe that EA would screw that up so badly after making such a big deal of it pre-release, but we all know how silly that would sound. Still, it is a big problem for me, and I wish they would just abandon the whole idea and make it consistent.

But mostly, it's the same old FIFA control problems that are driving me up a wall. It seems to me that there is much greater latency in club games than in the private games we played the first few nights, and this latency seems to exacerbate the sluggish controls. It's not just the sluggishness, really, it's more of a philosophy of player control. The game will let you change the direction of the pass at the last moment, say if you are tracking down a distant ball, but it will always make you shoot or pass if that's the FIRST button you press; you can't change your mind at the last moment, and this really bugs the he'll out of me. You have to hit the pass or shoot button early to get into and fight for position on a header for example, but you can't change how you want to hit the ball at the last instant without the crazy multi-finger cancel and then re-input. So frustrating, and so completely antithetical to the real game that it just makes me scream for PES.

I wish I could figure out why we can't score. We defend pretty damn well, now that we've adjusted to the changes, but we just can't score. Some games well have close to or above 60-40 possession advantage, but they get some cheap garbage goal thanks to a 'I meant to clear it, but that pass button was a tackle attempt I made before the ball came to me and I was hammering the shoot button' type of turnovers. And then we keep passing the ball around, playing keep away, but can't do anything in the final third. Frustrating to say the least.
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Post by wco81 »

Do they have a different camera with Club games as opposed to unranked OTP games?

IOW, is it like NHL 09 where Club and Ranked games use the BAP camera and unranked OTP games gives you the more traditional top-down camera?

Maybe the lag is related to the different camera.
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Post by Naples39 »

wco81 wrote:Do they have a different camera with Club games as opposed to unranked OTP games?

IOW, is it like NHL 09 where Club and Ranked games use the BAP camera and unranked OTP games gives you the more traditional top-down camera?

Maybe the lag is related to the different camera.
I play ranked OTP and club games in NHL 09 all the time, and have never used the BAP camera. I always use the traditional top-down camera.

I'm still torn on FIFA 09 and PES this year. FIFA has a ton of features and teams, and the single-player game (where I spend most of my time) is solid. I didn't care for 08's single player game at all.

I'm not going to be able to resist getting PES soon, but for the first time I really feel conflicted about which game to go with permanently. I won't have two soccer games sitting on my shelf all season.
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Post by Zeppo »

You can choose to use any camera in any mode. We all use the normal 'tele' cam, though I've adjusted mine to be a little wider and a little lower so I can see the linesmen a little better. It's less the camera than it is the multiplayer.

Speaking of, the constant problems of getting into games in club mode doesn't help my enthusiasm, either.
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Post by wco81 »

There must be something I'm missing because in ranked or club games on the PS3, the camera option is disabled.

Unless you can change after the game has started.

But I also don't like using fictional players.
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Post by RobVarak »

Zeppo wrote:Im rapidly nearing the point where I'll be fed up with this game.

I guess a big part of our success in OTP last year was due to the fact that we had a team and were playing against motley groups of randoms. With the Club thing now, we don't have that advantage, and our total lack of any consistent success is really wearing me down.

Another issue is this whole 'are we 85s or not?' thing. I would say it's hard to believe that EA would screw that up so badly after making such a big deal of it pre-release, but we all know how silly that would sound. Still, it is a big problem for me, and I wish they would just abandon the whole idea and make it consistent.

But mostly, it's the same old FIFA control problems that are driving me up a wall. It seems to me that there is much greater latency in club games than in the private games we played the first few nights, and this latency seems to exacerbate the sluggish controls. It's not just the sluggishness, really, it's more of a philosophy of player control. The game will let you change the direction of the pass at the last moment, say if you are tracking down a distant ball, but it will always make you shoot or pass if that's the FIRST button you press; you can't change your mind at the last moment, and this really bugs the he'll out of me. You have to hit the pass or shoot button early to get into and fight for position on a header for example, but you can't change how you want to hit the ball at the last instant without the crazy multi-finger cancel and then re-input. So frustrating, and so completely antithetical to the real game that it just makes me scream for PES.

I wish I could figure out why we can't score. We defend pretty damn well, now that we've adjusted to the changes, but we just can't score. Some games well have close to or above 60-40 possession advantage, but they get some cheap garbage goal thanks to a 'I meant to clear it, but that pass button was a tackle attempt I made before the ball came to me and I was hammering the shoot button' type of turnovers. And then we keep passing the ball around, playing keep away, but can't do anything in the final third. Frustrating to say the least.
I'm with you on the frustration. In fact during the game after you left last night I suggested that we scrap the club and just go back to playing OTP. Personally it has nothing to do with the controls though.

At the risk of oversimplifying, we just don't convert on our chances. As you said, we're holding our own on defense and we knock it around ok. But as I've said about 100 times, we're allergic to the penalty area. We don't finish, we make one pass too many, we don't make the extra pass, we shoot wildly, we shoot right at the keeper...you name it and we screw it up. Last year if we got the ball in scoring position, we scored more often than not. Not so this year.

I'm not just blaming the locked players here either. We are all deficient in the final 1/3. I think a lot of it comes from our trying to play to conventionally. The teams that score freely agaist us are adept at ball handling to take us out of position or evading our tackling and jostling. We do virtually none of that. As I said last night we play like a 1950's Soviet team: machine-like with no individual creativity. We try the same things over and over and we get nowhere. Again, I'm as guilty of this as anyone.

I think we need to apply ourselves to playing with more flair. We need to be willing and able to undress a CB 1v1. We need to really work on our finishing touch and avoid giving the ball away to the GK by dribbling it in too close to the goal line etc.

I think we'll improve, but it is frustrating. We were something like 40-22-70 the other day and we've lost something like 15 out of our last 20 I think.
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Post by Zeppo »

When the game just came out, I tried like hell to get a handle on the most basic and simple L-trigger + R-stick moves, but I just can't get any of it to work online. As this is one of the most glaring areas where the game is lacking in comparison to Pro Evo, where you can wrong-foot a guy just by using simple touches without any need for 'special' moves, it frustrates me much more than other problems in the game.

The Club game lag combined with the basic lack of response to the L-trigger moves just makes it way, way too hard for me to even try to bear guys 1v1. I'd much rather play a simple one-two to beat defenders, but we don't seem to be able to do those a all.

I'd love to have a night where we just play 2 on 2 together sometime, or some kind of private games, as a change of pace.

Also, I got used to Arg, and if I could get some of the Milan strat files I'd like them, but to paraphrase the late George Allen, every time I play Man U something inside me dies a little. Maybe just my liver, but somethinginsude dies.
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Post by Leadfoot5 »

Guys - Is there fun to be had in this game from a soccer non-aficionado? I don't know the players or teams from the US or around the world, let alone all of the rules, except from what I learned watching my kids play... I know nothing about "tactics" or formations or why they are even important...

The last soccer game I really got into for any length of time was this one:
hxxp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvS8rtc46bg

I'm just looking for another fun Me vs. the CPU sports title, and since I can't stand the NBA, I was thinking of giving this one a look... All of the comments about how much fun the game is this year has piqued my interest. Thanks!
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Post by pk500 »

Zep:

Maybe I REALLY suck at PES, but I'm finding the exact opposite in regards to special moves with FIFA 09 for the PC.

It always seemed with PES that I needed to memorize a ton of special moves even to do basic feints, jinks and step-overs, while it feels so much more intuitive with a few quick flicks of my right stick in FIFA 09.

I'm really digging FIFA 09 for the PC. I'm finding that CPU teams are using the width of the field as I clog the center of the pitch more effectively.

FIFA 09 for the PC isn't perfect, but it has that same fun, organic, unscripted feel as my favorite EA PC gaming series, Rugby 06 and 08. I'm getting a wide variety of results and goal types, and I'm FINALLY seeing distinct differences in team skill levels and player abilities in an EA soccer game.

Take care,
PK
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Post by RobVarak »

Zeppo wrote:
Also, I got used to Arg, and if I could get some of the Milan strat files I'd like them, but to paraphrase the late George Allen, every time I play Man U something inside me dies a little. Maybe just my liver, but somethinginsude dies.
I took care of that right quick last night. We're Barca for now, but I'm thinking of going to back to Argentina or trying Spain out for a bit.

Forensic is a ManU fan, and he puts in yeoman's work so we should throw him a bone now and then. :) Not for long, but every now and then LOL
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Post by Naples39 »

pk500 wrote:Zep:

Maybe I REALLY suck at PES, but I'm finding the exact opposite in regards to special moves with FIFA 09 for the PC.

It always seemed with PES that I needed to memorize a ton of special moves even to do basic feints, jinks and step-overs, while it feels so much more intuitive with a few quick flicks of my right stick in FIFA 09.
I have bought every USA PES release since 2003, and play the games on the top difficulty levels. To this day I don't know how to do a faint or stepover in PES. I just dribble with the stick. It's all in the timing and momentum.

I definitely can't do that in FIFA 09, but I'm new at the game so I'm withholding judgment.
Last edited by Naples39 on Thu Nov 06, 2008 4:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by JRod »

Naples39 wrote:
pk500 wrote:Zep:

Maybe I REALLY suck at PES, but I'm finding the exact opposite in regards to special moves with FIFA 09 for the PC.

It always seemed with PES that I needed to memorize a ton of special moves even to do basic feints, jinks and step-overs, while it feels so much more intuitive with a few quick flicks of my right stick in FIFA 09.
I have bought every USA PES release since 2003, and play the games on the top difficulty levels. To this day I don't know how to do a faint or stepover in PES. I just dribble with the stick. It's all in the timing and momentum.

I can't definitely can't do that in FIFA 09, but I'm new at the game so I'm withholding judgment.
I do zero special moves in FIFA and I find that it's hard for me to lose. I play FIFA the same was as PES. Now online, like Rob and Zep are talking, it's pretty different. But offline you don't need to do any special moves.
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Post by Zeppo »

But Jrod, do you best guys 1 v 1 in FIFA? Or just pass around them? In PES, it's as simple as holding the turbo with no L-stick input, waiting for the defender to get too close or try a stab at a tackle, and then pushing the L-stick to get by him. No special moves or feints or anything to get past people 1 v 1, just timing and changing pace and direction. Half the time when running with the ball, all you have to do is change direction 90 degrees or so and you can go right by the defender if your timing and spacing is correct.

With FIFA, at least online, it seems impossible to me to beat anyone 1 v 1 without using at least some simple L-stick + R-stick special move, which if you pull it off (the key being the 'hold the L-stick in any direction' to cap off the move) you seem to almost magically go through the defender and be past him.

It's a case where in PES, once you get the hang of it, you can beat the guy and create advantages or carve out space for a cross or a shot just by dribbling with basic controls and using good timng, whereas in FIFA you're forced to pull out one of the canned moves to get by defenders in most cases.

It should be noted that online, I've been beaten a few times 1 v 1 by guys who can time the moves perfectly, whereas I myself can't seem to get them to go half the time,much less early enough to get past the guy. So it's all doable, I just can't seem to find the secret. And the arena is useless to me to practice because the orientation of the camera doesn't match what I use in game. Arena is great for free-kick practice, though.
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Post by Zeppo »

By L-stick + R-stick I mean L-trigger + R-stick.
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Post by JRod »

Zeppo,

I do the same thing I do in PES. Triangles and give and goes. Now to beat the keep is pretty hard. If I can turn him the wrong way, it's a goal.

To be players on the dribble, I use the exact same method I did in PES. I do the slow stutters then speed right past him. Once the defender is drawn in, I sprint past him. I think that's pretty realistic. Slow players aren't able to do this and I think that's realistic. That's the only special move I do, because I can't memorize the Street Fighter combos in games these days.
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Post by fanatic »

Quick question...

Is there a champions league style tournament within Manager mode? I'm playing as Spurs and in my first year - not sure whether or not I need to worry about being in a qualifying spot for Europe.

Thanks!
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Post by JRod »

fanatic wrote:Quick question...

Is there a champions league style tournament within Manager mode? I'm playing as Spurs and in my first year - not sure whether or not I need to worry about being in a qualifying spot for Europe.

Thanks!
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Post by fanatic »

JRod wrote:
fanatic wrote:Quick question...

Is there a champions league style tournament within Manager mode? I'm playing as Spurs and in my first year - not sure whether or not I need to worry about being in a qualifying spot for Europe.

Thanks!
Ya shows up in the 2nd year of your MM.
Nice...thanks.
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Post by ScoopBrady »

I haven't put in nearly as much time with this game as I would like but was able to pop it in and play a couple of games last night. I had 2 nil-nil draws with Vicenza in some Serie B action. I downloaded the Italian Commentary with Giuseppe Bergomi and Fabio Caressa for the second game for authenticity and it was cool as hell. That was a cool little idea EA had releasing those. Too bad the Andy Townsend and Clive Tyldesley one isn't free. Still, a pretty cool idea if you ask me(which you didn't).
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