OT: 2008 Elections

[Jackdog]

That being said, the mere fact that Obama has made it this far shows that the crazy card carrying racists are few and far between. There's still plenty of racism, among all people, but not as much pure hatred.

No doubt.

[Brando70]

I hate getting involved in these threads but i'll just add something.

It is completely different to vote for someone because they are similar to you, for a black person to vote for the first black candidate to have a legitimate shot at becoming president, then it is to specifically NOT vote for someone just because they are different than you. Everyone's got some racist tendencies, but some people are just flat out racist.

A lot of the black voters who are supporting Obama have voted many times for white candidates, including for Bill Clinton. I doubt the guy who said he didn't want to put a black in the white house has ever considered voting for a black guy before, in any election. Of course I don't know that for sure, it's just wild guess.

That being said, the mere fact that Obama has made it this far shows that the crazy card carrying racists are few and far between. There's still plenty of racism, among all people, but not as much pure hatred.

I agree. If Obama was a staunch conservative, a lot of black voters probably would not vote for him. Allen Keyes is a good example there -- he didn't get large groups of black voters flocking to him just because he's black. In the case of Clinton vs. Obama, their platforms are so similar, I could see how Obama's race tips African Americans toward him, the same way Clinton's gender influences female voters. And the way McCain pulls in <i>Matlock</i> fans

Voting for someone solely because of their gender or race is idiotic, but I don't see anything wrong with it being an influence on your decision, especially when your race or gender has traditionally been locked out of political power. Even with all the strides we've made (and the primaries really do show those strides), women and minorities hold a disproportionately small percentage of elected offices at the federal level. I can see why voters from those groups would be excited to elect Clinton or Obama, especially if they already agree with most of their platforms.

[XXXIV]

I dont see any problem with blacks voting for Obama.

I dont think of it as being racial as much as being ethnic.

I was actively involved in the Dukakis campaign back in 88 and Im not ashamed that his being Greek was a bit of a factor. Besides I have never liked bush. I like the clean shaved.

Like Brando said its not like a vote for Keyes...

[Jackdog]

Obama dips into God's well to snag votes from the church going folks in Kentucky. The funny thing is he gets a pass from the same media that blasted Huckabee for being a religious zealot. What a double standard.

[JRod]

... but I don't see anything wrong with it being an influence on your decision, especially when your race or gender has traditionally been locked out of political power. Even with all the strides we've made (and the primaries really do show those strides), women and minorities hold a disproportionately small percentage of elected offices at the federal level. I can see why voters from those groups would be excited to elect Clinton or Obama, especially if they already agree with most of their platforms.

So if you are locked out of power, it's okay to vote your own kind, just like those that locked you out of power.

I know we are trying to put a good spin on it but let's face a few facts here. Why does Hillary have so many women supporting here. Is it because she's a women; and women just want a woman president and this is their way to get justice. Or is it because many women feel that she can sympathize with women's issues but also agree with her politics/platform.

I would like to think it's the latter, but that would require a huge number of supporters have a good grasp of the platforms for the two candidates. Sadly, I bet if you ask any supporter why he or she is voting for Obama or Hillary, they could give you three or four basic bullet points. But I bet they wouldn't have a clue beyond that. That means people's support isn't as involved as you propose.

[Smurfy]

Why did Obama bother to run? I mean Jesse Jackson has way more experience with these leadership campaigns and we know he would have gotten the same votes because he too is a Black male.

But seriously, I don't agree with voting based on race/ethnicity in the long-term. It's just that right now people need to get over the psychological barriers of having someone different in power. Once they see it's not the end of the world maybe people will give them equal consideration with the White male candidates. Obama seems to have a charismatic advantage that most other Black candidates didn't have.

Then again, if I were American I'd be voting for the Christian Lebanese guy with the Hispanic running mate. That is, unless we can find a 5 foot 2 inch balding and overweight South Asian atheist to represent my ghetto group.

[Jackdog]

Then again, if I were American I'd be voting for the Christian Lebanese guy with the Hispanic running mate. That is, unless we can find a 5 foot 2 inch balding and overweight South Asian atheist to represent my ghetto group.

[Jared]

Obama dips into God's well to snag votes from the church going folks in Kentucky. The funny thing is he gets a pass from the same media that blasted Huckabee for being a religious zealot. What a double standard.

Umm...Huckabee hasn't had rumors flying for months now that he's a Muslim. It's totally fine that Obama's a Christian, and it makes sense that he's advertising it considering the rumors.

[JackB1]

Obama dips into God's well to snag votes from the church going folks in Kentucky. The funny thing is he gets a pass from the same media that blasted Huckabee for being a religious zealot. What a double standard.

Umm...Huckabee hasn't had rumors flying for months now that he's a Muslim. It's totally fine that Obama's a Christian, and it makes sense that he's advertising it considering the rumors.

True. He didn't start doing this until he was almost "forced" into it to prove his Christianity. Many people still think he's a Muslim. Personally I could care less if he was a Muslin, Jew, Christian or whatever.

[Jackdog]

Obama dips into God's well to snag votes from the church going folks in Kentucky. The funny thing is he gets a pass from the same media that blasted Huckabee for being a religious zealot. What a double standard.

Umm...Huckabee hasn't had rumors flying for months now that he's a Muslim. It's totally fine that Obama's a Christian, and it makes sense that he's advertising it considering the rumors.

I agree. It fine that he's a Christian. But it would also be fine with me if he wasn't.

I don't agree that he's trying to quell rumors. Why now? This election has been endless. The Rev Wright comments made headlines for what? 4 weeks. Obama has always made it clear that he was a Christian. Are you telling me he just decided to pick Kentucky to hammer home the "God's Work" message? I don't think so brother.

He's been struggling with white Christain voters. So he's put the Flag pin back on and dropped to his knees in the name of the lord. He's playing politics. He added Faith to his Hope and Change message. Kinda disappointing.

He's a mainstream media darling. He can do no wrong. It's a double standard IMO. You know as well as I do if he was a conservative Republican,he would be getting blasted for this.

[Jared]

If he were struggling with white Christian voters, he wouldn't be about to wrap up the nomination (since America and (believe it or not) the Democratic Party is full of white Christian voters). He's struggling in Appalachia, but I think there are lots of white Christians in the midwest, west, northeast, and everywhere else he's won.

Obama's been mailing flyer saying he's been a committed Christian for months now, starting in South Carolina. In fact, that flyer looks like the same flyer you've linked to in Kentucky. The article goes on to say that it's a specific pushback against Obama/Muslim rumors. Are you saying it's "playing politics" to defend against rumors? (And again...there's nothing wrong with anyone, Republican or Democrat, professing their faith.)

And if he were the mainstream media darling, then irrelevant things like the flag pin and Rev. Wright wouldn't be getting the headlines that they do. I could easily argue that the double standard works the other way, with the press treating McCain with kid gloves.

[Teal]

That's because no matter who gets elected, we're FUBAR-why worry about McCain? He'll dig his own grave soon enough.

Thinking of jumping on the Libertarian bandwagon more everyday...

[XXXIV]

I could easily argue that the double standard works the other way, with the press treating McCain with kid gloves.

That will end when the wicked witch's never ending campaign dies...its so hard to kill pure evil.

The assholes in the press are her minions...when the b*tch goes away they will find a new target.

[Jackdog]

If he were struggling with white Christian voters, he wouldn't be about to wrap up the nomination (since America and (believe it or not) the Democratic Party is full of white Christian voters). He's struggling in Appalachia, but I think there are lots of white Christians in the midwest, west, northeast, and everywhere else he's won.

Obama's been mailing flyer saying he's been a committed Christian for months now, starting in South Carolina. In fact, that flyer looks like the same flyer you've linked to in Kentucky. The article goes on to say that it's a specific pushback against Obama/Muslim rumors. Are you saying it's "playing politics" to defend against rumors? (And again...there's nothing wrong with anyone, Republican or Democrat, professing their faith.)

And if he were the mainstream media darling, then irrelevant things like the flag pin and Rev. Wright wouldn't be getting the headlines that they do. I could easily argue that the double standard works the other way, with the press treating McCain with kid gloves.

Who said I was talking about the Democratic elections? He's got the nomination all but wrapped up. I am talking about the Presidential Election.
This is a pitch to win over independent/moderate Evangelicals. A lot has been made about how Obama hasn’t done as well with Catholics compared to Clinton. But let’s remember one thing,Obama has a story to tell about how Jesus came into his life. You can bet we will be hearing more details about it on the stump in the fall. He's playing big stakes politics now. That's why he added "Faith" along with "Hope" and "Change" It is what it is. Smart.

As far as the double standard goes. Remember Mike Huckabee’s supposed subliminal cross in his Christmas campaign ad? You might not have cared but the media and left wing bloggers did. http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/20 ... s-message/
http://montanaheadlines.blogspot.com/20 ... enius.html

There's more but you get my drift. Where's the outrage from the media? They worship the holy Sack of Barack, and live to admire his sacred package.

[Jackdog]

That's because no matter who gets elected, we're FUBAR-why worry about McCain? He'll dig his own grave soon enough.

Thinking of jumping on the Libertarian bandwagon more everyday...

Yep. He'll have a "Senior moment" and compare Al Jazeera to Al Jarreau.

Hop on board brother. I've been a Libertarian for 4 years now. I like Barr or Root as our Presidential Candidates.

[pk500]

That's because no matter who gets elected, we're FUBAR-why worry about McCain? He'll dig his own grave soon enough.

Thinking of jumping on the Libertarian bandwagon more everyday...

Atta boy! Bob Barr in 2008!

http://www.bobbarr2008.com/issues/

I've pulled the lever for the Libertarian candidate with pride in the last three presidential elections. The late, great Harry Browne in 1996 and 2000, Michael Badnarik in 2004.

Take care,
PK

[JackB1]

That's because no matter who gets elected, we're

Thinking of jumping on the Libertarian bandwagon more everyday...

Would you be saying that if you were confident the Rebublican's would win again? It's funny how you are jumping ship now that it looks as though a Dem will win.

[Jared]

Who said I was talking about the Democratic elections? He's got the nomination all but wrapped up. I am talking about the Presidential Election.
This is a pitch to win over independent/moderate Evangelicals. A lot has been made about how Obama hasn’t done as well with Catholics compared to Clinton. But let’s remember one thing,Obama has a story to tell about how Jesus came into his life. You can bet we will be hearing more details about it on the stump in the fall. He's playing big stakes politics now. That's why he added "Faith" along with "Hope" and "Change" It is what it is. Smart.

As far as the double standard goes. Remember Mike Huckabee’s supposed subliminal cross in his Christmas campaign ad? You might not have cared but the media and left wing bloggers did. http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/20 ... s-message/
http://montanaheadlines.blogspot.com/20 ... enius.html

There's more but you get my drift. Where's the outrage from the media? They worship the holy Sack of Barack, and live to admire his sacred package.

Ha...Sack of Barack.

Anyways, the difference with Huckabee is that the Huckabee story was about a subliminal message, not an overt one. If Obama starts putting subliminal messages in his ads, I'd expect the press to jump all over it.

And as for Obama, he's been talking about faith since the beginning of the campaign. In fact, he gave a big speech a long time ago on that (link if you're interested). Just because you haven't noticed him talking about his faith doesn't mean he hasn't been.

[Teal]

That's because no matter who gets elected, we're

Thinking of jumping on the Libertarian bandwagon more everyday...

Would you be saying that if you were confident the Rebublican's would win again? It's funny how you are jumping ship now that it looks as though a Dem will win.

Yep, I would, because the Republicans, like the democrats, are fielding s*** this time around=and I don't believe for a minute that Obama will win anything, once people figure out he's not the messiah...

[Jackdog]

Who said I was talking about the Democratic elections? He's got the nomination all but wrapped up. I am talking about the Presidential Election.
This is a pitch to win over independent/moderate Evangelicals. A lot has been made about how Obama hasn’t done as well with Catholics compared to Clinton. But let’s remember one thing,Obama has a story to tell about how Jesus came into his life. You can bet we will be hearing more details about it on the stump in the fall. He's playing big stakes politics now. That's why he added "Faith" along with "Hope" and "Change" It is what it is. Smart.

As far as the double standard goes. Remember Mike Huckabee’s supposed subliminal cross in his Christmas campaign ad? You might not have cared but the media and left wing bloggers did. http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/20 ... s-message/
http://montanaheadlines.blogspot.com/20 ... enius.html

There's more but you get my drift. Where's the outrage from the media? They worship the holy Sack of Barack, and live to admire his sacred package.

Ha...Sack of Barack.

Anyways, the difference with Huckabee is that the Huckabee story was about a subliminal message, not an overt one. If Obama starts putting subliminal messages in his ads, I'd expect the press to jump all over it.

And as for Obama, he's been talking about faith since the beginning of the campaign. In fact, he gave a big speech a long time ago on that (link if you're interested). Just because you haven't noticed him talking about his faith doesn't mean he hasn't been.

Thanks for the link. That was an interesting read.

[Jackdog]

Yep, I would, because the Republicans, like the democrats, are fielding s*** this time around=and I don't believe for a minute that Obama will win anything, once people figure out he's not the messiah...

Reality is setting in for ya brother. Welcome! We need more people to get the message that big goverment means a big pain in your wallet. The election process is nothing more than a dog and pony show for the candidates with the most money. That ties them to special interest groups and the like. Our goverment is broke and we can't count on it to fix itself. Not with the current knuckleheads and the system they set up.

If the Libertarian Party is ever going to get a strong foothold with the American people,it would be now. People are sick and tired of the same bullshit. "Hope" and "Change" will mean something other than political rhetoric if a true Libertarian ever becomes President. That would mean the Senate and House would change as well. Be nice to see it in my lifetime.

[JackB1]

Yep, I would, because the Republicans, like the democrats, are fielding s*** this time around=and I don't believe for a minute that Obama will win anything, once people figure out he's not the messiah...

Nobody is claiming he is the "messiah". He wants to get some respect back for the USA with the rest of the world and I don't see anything wrong with that. Even Bush's pal, King Abdullah buddy told him to get lost when he went over there crying about oil prices. We need to learn to stand on our own again as a country. It's scary how dependant we have become on the Arabs, China, etc.

[Teal]

We need to learn to stand on our own again as a country. It's scary how defendant we have become on the Arabs, China, etc.

Well, Obama isn't going to teach us how, because he doesn't know how. Hell, I've yet to hear a speech of his that has any real substance to it, just popular fluff about change...change to what? More of the same baloney, that's what. And McCain and Hillary are the same. They'll say anything to get elected. It's all about power, and not about governing. I'll agree that we are far too dependent on foreign everything these days, though. But I don't see any of these friggin' candidates doing anything but pandering for votes, putting their finger in the air, testing the wind, and riding the strongest gust of hot air they find.

You know what? Yeah...it's time. The republicans have no solutions, the democrats have no solutions, the process is broken as hell, and has become nothing more than a popularity contest, and it's time for another party to be recognized as a legitimate and worthy contender to the nonsense I see.

So without further delay...

[wco81]

Why would a Congress made up of Democrats and Republicans accommodate a Libertarian?

Not to mention other branches of the govt, including most of the executive branch?

Did Ventura get a lot of things changed in MN or get a lot of cooperation from the pols up there?

Libertarian candidate may be able to draw a protest vote but won't be anything but symbolic.

If they really want some kind of clout, they should aim for a few seats in the Senate, so that they can swing majorities with either party and cut deals.

[Jackdog]

Yep, I would, because the Republicans, like the democrats, are fielding s*** this time around=and I don't believe for a minute that Obama will win anything, once people figure out he's not the messiah...

Nobody is claiming he is the "messiah". He wants to get some respect back for the USA with the rest of the world and I don't see anything wrong with that. Even Bush's pal, King Abdullah buddy told him to get lost when he went over there crying about oil prices. We need to learn to stand on our own again as a country. It's scary how defendant we have become on the Arabs, China, etc.

Then he needs to press to drill for oil here at home. He has said he won't do that so we will continue to be dependent on other countries that do. We will get no respect as long as we have to keep asking others for what they have. We have what we need. Our politicians need to stop kissing special interest ass and taking their money and go get it.

This was printed in 05.
http://www.deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,12 ... 03,00.html