Madden 10 - Will they prove us wrong?

XXXIV · Post by **XXXIV** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 7:56 pm

Broken gameplay? In february?

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 2:10 pm

XXXIV wrote:Broken gameplay? In february?

Per Mike Florio from Profootball.com

MADDEN JINX TO BE IMPOSED LATER IN THE YEAR?

Typically, our decisions regarding the stories that we share in this space are driven by a fairly simple question — is it something that we’d be interested in if we were in the audience?

When it comes to stories about the depressingly stagnant Madden video game franchise and the ridiculous notion that a jinx applies to the person who appears on the cover of the game, we’re not interested.

But based upon the comments we’ve seen posted on the subject, plenty of you are.

And so we’ll make an exception to our normal rule and point out that SportsBusiness Journal reports (via Sporting News Today) that Electronic Arts might not announce the player who will be on the cover of the 2010 edition of the game during the weekend of the 2009 draft.

Frankly, the EA folks would be wiser to devote some of the money spent on the cover athlete and the broader marketing efforts to improving the game. It’s simply not as good as it used to be, and more and more people are figuring that out.

Thanks Mike !

http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/02/ ... -the-year/

johnvon314 · Post by **johnvon314** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 2:39 pm

Rodster wrote: Frankly, the EA folks would be wiser to devote some of the money spent on the cover athlete and the broader marketing efforts to improving the game. It’s simply not as good as it used to be, and more and more people are figuring that out.

Maybe the sheeple are finally wising up due to their lighter wallets!

John

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Mon Feb 23, 2009 9:12 pm

http://insideblog.easports.com/archive/ ... ition.aspx

QB changes

Brando70 · Post by **Brando70** » Mon Feb 23, 2009 9:22 pm

Danimal wrote:http://insideblog.easports.com/archive/ ... ition.aspx

QB changes

The execution of all of this will remain to be seen, but I like how the developers are being much more honest about Madden's shortcomings. They seem to at least be trying to make the game more realistic.

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Mon Feb 23, 2009 11:17 pm

Brando70 wrote:
Danimal wrote:http://insideblog.easports.com/archive/ ... ition.aspx

QB changes
The execution of all of this will remain to be seen, but I like how the developers are being much more honest about Madden's shortcomings. They seem to at least be trying to make the game more realistic.

One thing I will give Ian and Phil credit for is they have always been willing to sit through hundreds of 2k5 video/picture comparisons at OS, see the areas where 2k5 was more realistic and admit to the shortcomings. It is not easy having people slamming your work all day. You could not pay me to work a job where the anonymous internet is allowed to critique me 24/7.

Thanks for the link Dan.

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Mon Feb 23, 2009 11:37 pm

Brando70 wrote:The execution of all of this will remain to be seen,

Which is the one scary part, they can add all of this but decided to tweak it because it is too hard for the casual fan. I know I'll be happy if I see a variety of incomplete passes, I know the madden tourney player won't.

They had a thread the other day about wanting to remove the lead block feature because it was too effective and only rewarded the glitcher / cheeser whatever you want to call those guys and I think last time I checked the vote was 257 to remove to 4 to keep.

So right now it is cautious optimism, I'm almost afraid to see what the ticket features are because things could go south quick.

Brando70 · Post by **Brando70** » Tue Feb 24, 2009 12:00 am

But if they at least have a way to get that realistic gameplay, it would be a big step in the right direction. For years, Madden's sliders have been frustrating because things like QB Accuracy seemed to have little input on the game.

The one thing that I am hopeful about is that 09 had a way to get really crappy CPU completions. When I tried the dummy profile sliders, the QB accuracy slider really worked. I used that slider method and saw the CPU quarterbacks really struggle, to the point where I had to bump the accuracy back up. That's a sign that the game already has the potential to have more realistic incompletions.

I would never hold my breath for EA to deliver on promised features, but they have come through in the past for franchises that seemed moribund (Triple Play into MVP, the rebirth of Live, FIFA). Maybe Madden is finally due.

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 3:16 pm

http://insideblog.easports.com/archive/ ... ction.aspx

WR/DB Improvements.

The old DB coach in me just busted a nut. Those animations at this point look a little bit rough, but all I can say is about f***in time!

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 3:53 pm

Danimal wrote:http://insideblog.easports.com/archive/ ... ction.aspx

WR/DB Improvements.

The old DB coach in me just busted a nut. Those animations at this point look a little bit rough, but all I can say is about f***in time!

Nice

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 4:19 pm

Nice to see WR/DB interaction, hopefully OL/DL follows suit. I really just wanted to post the first comment to that blog.

warrior310
said March 02, 2009

I HAVE A LONG LIST OF THINGS I WANT IN MADDEN 10. YOU GUYS SHOULD HAVE EVERY CURRENT HELMET AND FACEMASK THAT IS USED TODAY, YOU GUY SHOULD PUT IN THESE NEW HELMETS:THE SCHUTT ION 4D AND SCHUTT AIR XP ASLO YOU GUYS SHOULD INCLUDE THE RIDDELL REVOLUTION SPEED HELMET.INCLUDE DIFFERENT JERSEY CUTS LIKE TIGHT,LOOSE,AND MEDIUM, MAKE THE SLEEVELESS JERESIES LOOK REALER AND TIGHT FITTING.HAVE NAME BRAND EQUIPMENT LIKE REEBOK,NIKE,AND UNDER ARMOUR.TO BE SPECIFIC PUT NAME BRAND HELMETS,GLOVES,CLEATS,WRISTBANDS,VISORS.ETC.... HAVE SHORT SLEEVE AND MEDIUM UNDER ARMOUR SHIRTS.INCLUDE HAND WARMERS WHEN ITS COLD.HAVE A OPTION WHERE YOU CAN DECIDE TO PUT A SKULLCAP ON A PLAYER, HAVE DIFFERENT SELECTIONS OF CHINSTRAPS. PUT IN BACKPLATES AND RIB PROTECTERS.FOR FRANCHISE MODE THE CPU TEAMS SHOULD BE ABLE TO RELOCATE THEIR TEAMS DURING THE ACTUALL GAME YOU SHOULD SEE THE SCORES OF OTHER GAMES.WHEN YOU ARE DONE WITH A FRANCHISE GAME AND SIM THE REST OF THE WEEK YOU SHOULD SEE THE HIGHLIGHTS OF ALL OF THE GAMES IN THAT WEEK.YOU SHOULD PUT BACK THE TONY BRUNO SHOW THAT YOU PUT IN MADDEN 07 FOR PS2 AND THE NEWSPAPER. FOR THE PROBOWL IN FRANCHISE MODE PLEASE LET THE PLAYERS HAVE THEIE TEAM'S HELMET AND ON THE JERSIES PUT THE TEAMS LOGO ON IT EVEN IF ITS A MADE UP TEAM [WITH MY FAKE TEAM IN MADDEN 09 IT PUT A DARK VISOR ON THE HELMET BUT IT CAME OUT SILVER]. YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO MAKE PLAYERS LOOSE WEIGHT OR GAIN IF THEY'RE TOO BIG OR TO LITTLE BY THAT I MEAN SET UP A TRAINING SESSION FOR ALL YOUR PLAYERS.YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO SET THE HOME AND AWAY JERSEY IN FRANCHISE EXAMPLE: PRIMARALLY MY HOME JERSEY IS BLUE NOW I CAN SET IT TO BE AN AWAY JERSEY AND MAKE ANOTHER JERESY THE HOME.YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO SCHEDULE YOUR GAMES OVERSEAS LIKE THE CHARGERS AND SAINTS DID IN THE 08-09 NFL SEASON.YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO MAKE A NEW STADIUM FOR YOUR TEAM ANYTIME BUT YOU SHOULD HAVE TO WAIT A SEASON TILL ITS COMPLETE. INCLUDE TRAINING CAMP IN MADDEN AND INCLUDE INJURIES DURING PRACTICE IN FRANCHISE MODE. DURING THHE FREE AGENT WIRE SHOW THE PLAYER'S TOP THREE CONSIDERATION AND THEIR INTEREST SIGNING WITH THE TEAM. IN THE NFL DRAFT THE PLAYER SHE HAVE COMPUTERISED FACES LIKE THEY DID IN PREVIOUS MADDENS BUT MAKE THEM LOOK REALER. HAVE MORE JERSEY STYLES WHEN CREATING A TEAM AND HAVE A MASSIVE AMOUNT OF TEAM LOGOS AND INCLUDE ALFABETS IN SCRIPT AND PRINT. WHEN CREATING A STADIUM HAVE MORE BUILDING STYLE.YOU GUYS SHOULD PUT IN A LARGER SELECTION OF CITIES TO RELOCATE TO.PUT THE REFS BACK ON FIELD AND IF THE REFS ARE IN A PLAYER'S WAY THEY SHOULD BE ABLE TO GIVE THE REF A LITTLE NUDGE TO ADD SOME REALISM.WHEN PLAYERS GET POPPED THERE HELMETS SHOULD FLY OFF AND SHOW THEM PUTTING THE HELMET BACK ON. WHEN A PLAYER GETS HURT HAVE THE STAFF SPRINTING ON THE FIELD TO HELP THE HURT PLAYER.PUT IN REVERSE PLAYS.YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO CREATE YOUR OWN PLAYS IN FRANCHISE MODE AND IX IT UP WITH AN EXISTING PLAYBOOK.MAKE THE PEOPLE ON THE SIDELINE AND AUDIENCE LOOK REALER.WHEN IT IS SNOWING MAKE THE WHOLE INTIRE FIELD COVERED WIT HUGE PILES OF SNOW.WHEN ITS RAINING HARD WITH NATURAL GRASS THE FIELD SHOULD BE TOTALLY MESSED UP,WHEN A PLAYER GETS TACKLED DIRT AND GRASS SHOULD BE STUCK ON THEM FROM HEAD TO TOE.WHEN A TEAM MAKES A GREAT PLAY SHOW THE FANS CELEBRATING. WHEN A PLAYER GETS ROUGHED UP OR ARMED TACKLED LET THE JERSEY GET TUCKED OUT AND SLOPPY.THATS IT FOR MY IDEAS RIGHT NOW AND TO LOOK AT THOSE HELMETS I MENTIONED BEFORE GO TO SCHUTTSPORTS.COM AND RIDDELL.COM

you see how nba live 09 has you update your roster everyday its called live365 you guys should make something like that to keep us with the perfect roster everyday.In franchise mode when you scout a rookie please let us actually get to practice with the player to unlock his ratings.You guys should let us be able to put our own music in the game, it should be played in the menu,and you should be able to put it in stadiums and have a music editor to cut out parts of the song.They have the music in stadium feature in ncca football 09 but not the editing part.you guy should add a couple weapons such as smart wr,elusive qb to evoid being sacked,smart d lineman and o lineman,and have a speed de. include every defense you guy have 4-3,3-4,cover 2,4-6, but not 5-2,6-1,and etc... during gameplay show the coaches and other staff you guy should have a coach for every position insted of just having o coodinator,d coodinator,and special teams. when you try to boost a kicker/punter[s] rating they should be kicking the ball instead of lifting weights and have more training options.include practice mode for franchise and have them wearing a practice jersey.when drafting rookies dont make the players with rediculous muscles like i drafted a qb,and his muscles were crazy looking like he can play defense.you should be able to change a players hairstyle.please put in cheerleaders and a half and post game show. you should put back [franchise mode] scouting a team like if your playing the vikings exaduate the fact that you have to stop adrian peterson.put back option plays.before a game starts show the players stretching and getting hyped up before the action starts.make more touchdown dances and when you score do not put those blue zones on the field because it looks fake just let us press any button and then they start dancing and what not.in franchise mode put in more sponsers to help the organization gain money.make the roster capacity up to 65.least but not least have a pre game presentation showing the starting roster whos injured,and the keys to victory for both teams.one more thing have more presentators and not the same ones every week and for sundaynight games put john madden and al micheals in there . i really cant stand chris collingsworths voice no disrespect madden take him out!

IN FRANCHISE MODE THE COMPUTER SHOULD BE ALBE TO OFFER TRADES WITH THE USER AND THE CPU . FRANCHISE MODE SHOULDN'T HAVE A LIMIT IN YEARS BECAUSE IN 36 SEASONS IT SAID TO ME THAT THE FRANCHISE MODE IS COMPLETE AND I REALLY DIDN'T LIKE THAT SO MAKE IT UNLIMITED. YOU ALL SHOULD PUT BACK THOSE EUROPEAN TEAMS AND YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO TAKE PLAYERS FROM THOSE TEAMS IF YOUR INTERESTED.WHEN CREATING A PLAYER YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO CHOOSE A FACE THEN THE HAIR INSTEAD OF BOTH AT ONCE.IN THE SUPERBOWL IN FRANCHISE MODE IT SHOULD BE PLAYED IN ALL STADIUMS INSTEAD OF JUST THE CARDS,BUCS,FINS,AND FALCONS STADIUM.I NOTICE WITH THE PROBOWL THAT NO MATTER WHAT YEAR IT IS THE FIELD ALWAYS SAYS PRO BOWL 2009 CHANGE THAT UP.YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO SET THE LEVEL OF THE WEATHER BECAUSE IN OLDER MADDENS YOU CAN SET THE LEVEL OF SNOW USING A BAR BRING THAT BACK PLEASE AND PUT FOG BACK IN THE GAME.PUT WIND SOCKS ON THE FIELD GOAL POST AND THE NET SHOULD STAY UP ALL THROUHOUT THE GAME AND WHEN ITS WINDY MAKE THE NET SHAKE.HAVE ALL THROWBACK JERSEYS AND ALTERNATIVE UNIFORMS. NOT TO BE DISRESPECTFUL MADDEN BUT I THINK YOU SHOULD STEAL SOME GAMEPLAY IDEAS FROM "ESPN FOOTBALL" THE GAME.JUST SOME IDEAS NOT MANY.YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO FORCE PLAYERS TO RETIRE IN FRANCHISE MODE LIKE BRET FARVE. WHEN YOU MAKE A TEAM FOR FRANCHISE MODE YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE TO DELETE A TEAM JUST ADD THAT TEAM TO A CONFERENCE.HAVE MORE INJURIES DURING THE GAME . SHOW THE QB LOOKING AROUND BEFORE THE PLAY STARTS THEN MAKE AJUSTMENTS.

.

ADD HEAD TO HEAD COLLISIONS TO THE GAME AND MAKE UNESSESSARY ROUGHNESS PENALTIES.

ADD THE CLIPS FOR THE VISORS BUT DONT MAKE THEM BIG LIKE THE ONES IN NCCA 09.

IN FRANCHISE IF YOU HAVE A INJURED PLAYER YOU SHOULD HAVE AN OPTION TO ASK HIM DO YOU WANT TO PLAY EVEN IF HE IS OUT FOR WEEKS. PUT AN OPTION TO MAKE HIM TRAIN AND WHAT NOT NO MATTER HOW SERIOUS THE INJURY IS CAUSE IN 09 THE PLAYER HAS TO BE OUT FOR 6 WEEKS MAX IN ORDER TO TRAIN. THE INJURIES SHOULD CARRY OUT THROUGH THE OFFSEASON.WHEN PLAYERS GET OLDER MAKE THEIR RATINGS DROP.IF YOU WANT TO MAKE TRADES FOR DRAFT PICKS YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO CHOOSE RATHER IF YOU WANT A CURRENT YEAR PICK OR A 2010 PICK AND SO ON.

YOU GUYS SHOULD ADD NETWORKS LIKE ESPN,CBS,NBC,FOX...... AND WHEN YOU PLAY THE GAME SHOW IT LIKE WE SEE IT ON TV I MEAN SHOW IT IN THE SAME FORMAT AS THOSE CHANNELS BUT STILL GIVE US THE TRADITIONAL CAMERA ANGLE. ADD THE COMMENTATERS FROM THOSE PLACES TOO INSTEAD OF HAVING 2 OF THE SAME PEOPLE EVERY GAME.

YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO PICK YOUR PRE SEASON MATCH UPS IN FRANCHISE. YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO CREATE RIVALIES TOO.

ADD IMPACT BLOCKS BECAUSE ON THE KICKOFFS NO ONE IS GETTING HIT HARD AND LAYED OUT MAKE THE BLOCKING MORE REALISTIC TOO. ONE MORE WEAPON YOU SHOULD ADD IS IMPACT BLOCKER WHICH IS GOOD FOR FULLBACKS.YOU SEE HINES WARD THE WR WHEN THEY PLAYED THE BENGALS HE HAD THREW A BLOCK AT KEITH RIVERS THE LB AND BROKE HIS JAW ALL THAT WAS FROM AN IMPACT BLOCK SO ADD IT.

when doing the substatutions you should have the whole team like if i want to put JAKE LONG FROM THE DOLPHINS IN FOR CHAD AS QB AND TEDD GINN AS RUNNING BACK AND SO ON, I CAN DO THAT.

YOU GUYS SHOULD ADD A WEAPON CALLED A PULL BLOCKER THOSES BLOCKERS WOULD BE IDEAL FOR TOSSES,SCREENS, HB COUNTERS ETC... THOSE KIND OF BLOCKERS WOULD BE FAST ENOUGH TO GET AROUND A CORNER AND BLOCK AN OUTSIDE MAN.

WHEN CREATING A TEAM YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO MAKE AS MANY ALTERANTIVE UNIFORMS AS YOU WANT AND THEY SHOULD HAVE YOU CREATE A PRACTICE JERSEY.

THANKS EA AND PLEASE TRY TO ADD ALL MY IDEAS.

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 12:41 am

http://www.operationsports.com/forums/m ... e-vid.html

Just another video, trying to replicate a Jerry Rice video, It's close but not perfect.

I know everyone has their own pet peeve(s) about the game DB / WR play has always been mine (was a CB in HS and college and coached DB's in High school for 7 years) so I'm super pumped to see this at least got worked on, now my fingers are crossed it turns out well.

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Mon Mar 09, 2009 5:56 pm

Creating 'Sim-Style' Gameplay in Madden NFL 10

http://insideblog.easports.com/archive/ ... fl-10.aspx

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:43 pm

Game Speed slider, about fraking time.

Pretty good stuff if you ask me, gotta keep reminding myself that a video is worth a thousand blog posts. Considering the football die hards around here I would think there would be more talk about these blogs.

What's it take bad news for some of you guys to post

XXXIV · Post by **XXXIV** » Mon Mar 09, 2009 7:09 pm

Danimal wrote: What's it take bad news for some of you guys to post

....Yes!

Im one of the dopes who liked last years EA FB games so this is all looking good to me so far.

sportdan30 · Post by **sportdan30** » Mon Mar 09, 2009 8:05 pm

I think I'd enjoy the game a heck of a lot more if the presentation was significantly better. I actually enjoyed the game play alright, but was bored to tears because every game basically felt the same.

Rodster · Post by **Rodster** » Mon Mar 09, 2009 8:20 pm

sportdan30 wrote:I think I'd enjoy the game a heck of a lot more if the presentation was significantly better. I actually enjoyed the game play alright, but was bored to tears because every game basically felt the same.

Ditto !

fletcher21 · Post by **fletcher21** » Mon Mar 09, 2009 9:18 pm

Playing Madden for $ against friends makes it a lot more fun

GTHobbes · Post by **GTHobbes** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:24 am

Danimal wrote: Pretty good stuff if you ask me, gotta keep reminding myself that a video is worth a thousand blog posts. Considering the football die hards around here I would think there would be more talk about these blogs.

What's it take bad news for some of you guys to post

The one thing that keeps occurring to me as I read through Ian's blogs is...wow, the last developers really had things screwed up. I mean, I knew all about the missing refs, the horrible OL/DL interaction, the one stinking camera angle, etc., but I never really paid attention to the bullet passes, the fullback dive problems, etc. until I read Ian say how messed up they were. Given that he's fixing these problems, I've got every confidence in the world that he's going to deliver a great product this year. I can't wait until August, and it's been a LONG time since I've said that in relation to Madden.

Post by **Jared** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 10:41 am

I was thinking the same thing. I'm excited that these changes are being made, and am hoping that all these things can be implemented without also having major flaws/imbalances in gameplay (as I'm afraid it will be difficult to make all these changes without messing something up big). And I'm also wondering why the previous designers were so crappy. It seems like they must have had a different focus, though I have no idea what that focus was. (Maybe getting as many icons on the screen at once?)

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 2:36 pm

Jared wrote:I was thinking the same thing. I'm excited that these changes are being made, and am hoping that all these things can be implemented without also having major flaws/imbalances in gameplay (as I'm afraid it will be difficult to make all these changes without messing something up big). And I'm also wondering why the previous designers were so crappy. It seems like they must have had a different focus, though I have no idea what that focus was. (Maybe getting as many icons on the screen at once?)

Keep in mind that Ian and some of the other guys were on those previous teams, just in different positions. The big reason for all off this is quite simply the cost of the NFL license. You have to counter that by reducing costs somewhere and it is pretty obvious in the quality of 06 to 09 that was development time and personnel working on the game.

What might have changed is just a guess but I think it is two fold. To extend the NFL license I have to imagine the quality of the game came up at some point, Secondly the sales figures have been dropping of their secon biggest sports license.

JRod · Post by **JRod** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 3:11 pm

bdoughty wrote:
Jared wrote:I was thinking the same thing. I'm excited that these changes are being made, and am hoping that all these things can be implemented without also having major flaws/imbalances in gameplay (as I'm afraid it will be difficult to make all these changes without messing something up big). And I'm also wondering why the previous designers were so crappy. It seems like they must have had a different focus, though I have no idea what that focus was. (Maybe getting as many icons on the screen at once?)
Keep in mind that Ian and some of the other guys were on those previous teams, just in different positions. The big reason for all off this is quite simply the cost of the NFL license. You have to counter that by reducing costs somewhere and it is pretty obvious in the quality of 06 to 09 that was development time and personnel working on the game.

What might have changed is just a guess but I think it is two fold. To extend the NFL license I have to imagine the quality of the game came up at some point, Secondly the sales figures have been dropping of their secon biggest sports license.

Ya but that can't be the whole reason. I think Ian really cares about this series. I also think he gets it, or atleast EA figured out that sales were slipping and the reason why was Madden was bad. The formula that they missed out on was that great sports game sell, WE caught FIFA years ago then FIFA blow WE away the last two years. The Show 09 is a system seller in some respects. NHL while arcadey is more sim than not. NBA 2k also a seller.

The market told them that Madden-nation Madden was not the direction the consumer wanted and it took them quiet a few years to figure that out.

Though I think that's their weakspot, at the end of the day, please m-nation or please football enthusiasts.

Danimal · Post by **Danimal** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 3:24 pm

bdoughty wrote:Keep in mind that Ian and some of the other guys were on those previous teams, just in different positions.

That's kind of casting a broad brush isn't it?

I know that I've been on some teams where my ideas were not listened to and I had little to no voice in the final product. Now I am in a position of making those calls and I try and listen to all my team members ideas.

I'm saying just because you're on a team doesn't mean you really have a say.

bdoughty · Post by **bdoughty** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 4:10 pm

Danimal wrote:
bdoughty wrote:Keep in mind that Ian and some of the other guys were on those previous teams, just in different positions.
That's kind of casting a broad brush isn't it?

I know that I've been on some teams where my ideas were not listened to and I had little to no voice in the final product. Now I am in a position of making those calls and I try and listen to all my team members ideas.

I'm saying just because you're on a team doesn't mean you really have a say.

Okay? I think you are missing the point. I was referring to Jared's comment on major flaws/imbalance in gameplay and why the previous designers were so crappy (his words not mine). Ian was part of the team, therefore was part of the problem in regards to game quality in this regard. This had nothing to do with having ideas or a say in the product. I would agree that those decisions are usually decided on by the "powers that be." Of course the "powers that be" are generally not the guys coding in all those bugs/glitches/broken gameplay.

wco81 · Post by **wco81** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 4:48 pm

We've heard this song and dance before. They've failed to deliver many times, after hyping gimmicks like vision and half-baked implementations like lead blocking.

Probably a good thing that people are wary and in a "prove it" frame of mind in response to the usual Tiburon hype machine.