OT: Election/Politics thread, Part 6

[Smurfy]

When I read discussions on the healthcare costs that are driving Detroit to ruin I feel compelled to jump in and say

YAY FOR CANADIAN HEALTH CARE!!!

[F308GTB]

I hate to agree to this as I have always tried to do my part, buying American

Isn't doing your part buying something that keeps Americans employed? Buying foreign does that just as much as domestic. Plenty of Toyota, Honda, etc factories in the US. Heck, at one point Fiat or Alfa or someone was thinking of moving some production to the US due to the weak dollar - cheaper labor and manufacturing in the US than Italy.

It's a global economy. What's best for the American worker isn't always the same as what is best for the American company.

[wco81]

I think a lot of those foreign brands which are manufactured in the US have more foreign-made content than American cars.

That is, a lot of the parts and components are made overseas and then shipped to US factories.

[XXXIV]

I hate to agree to this as I have always tried to do my part, buying American

Isn't doing your part buying something that keeps Americans employed? Buying foreign does that just as much as domestic. Plenty of Toyota, Honda, etc factories in the US. Heck, at one point Fiat or Alfa or someone was thinking of moving some production to the US due to the weak dollar - cheaper labor and manufacturing in the US than Italy.

It's a global economy. What's best for the American worker isn't always the same as what is best for the American company.

You are 100% correct....What can I say ....I live in 1976.

[pk500]

I hate to agree to this as I have always tried to do my part, buying American

Isn't doing your part buying something that keeps Americans employed? Buying foreign does that just as much as domestic. Plenty of Toyota, Honda, etc factories in the US. Heck, at one point Fiat or Alfa or someone was thinking of moving some production to the US due to the weak dollar - cheaper labor and manufacturing in the US than Italy.

It's a global economy. What's best for the American worker isn't always the same as what is best for the American company.

You are 100% correct....What can I say ....I live in 1976.

Hey, I still have very fond memories of the 1976 Chevrolet Vega in which I learned to drive!

Take care,
PK

[Rodster]

Wasn't that GM's genius design where they used aluminum heads with a cast iron block.

And lest not forgot the Corvair which were famous for instantaneous combustion. Thankfully American have come a long way and I do my part by driving American cars. I like Ford products.

[Naples39]

A WSJ editorial on the topic;

In return for any direct government aid, the board and the management should go. Shareholders should lose their paltry remaining equity. And a government-appointed receiver -- someone hard-nosed and nonpolitical -- should have broad power to revamp GM with a viable business plan and return it to a private operation as soon as possible.

That will mean tearing up existing contracts with unions, dealers and suppliers, closing some operations and selling others, and downsizing the company. After all that, the company can float new shares, with taxpayers getting some of the benefits. The same basic rules should apply to Ford and Chrysler.

These are radical steps, and they wouldn't avoid significant job losses. But there isn't much alternative besides simply letting GM collapse, which isn't politically viable. At least a government-appointed receiver would help assure car buyers that GM will be around, in some form, to honor warranties on its vehicles. It would help minimize losses to the government's Pension Benefit Guaranty Corp.

But giving GM a blank check -- which the company and the United Auto Workers union badly want, and which Washington will be tempted to grant -- would be an enormous mistake. The company would just burn through the money and come back for more. Even more jobs would be wiped out in the end.

....

A thorough housecleaning at GM is the only way to give the company a fresh start. GM is structured for its glory days of the 1960s, when it had half the U.S. car market -- not for the first decade of this century, when it has just over 20% of the market. General Motors simply cannot support eight domestic brands (Cadillac, Buick, Pontiac, Chevrolet, GMC, Saturn, Saab and Hummer) with adequate product-development and marketing dollars. Even the good vehicles the company develops (for example, the Cadillac CTS and Chevy Malibu) get lost in the wash.

Nevertheless, the current board of directors and management have stuck stubbornly to this structure. The lone exception was a dissident director, Jerome B. York, who resigned a couple years ago. He warned that without fundamental changes the "unthinkable" might happen to GM. Well, here we are.

...

Government loan guarantees, with stringent strings attached and new management at the helm, helped save Chrysler in 1980. But it's now 2008, 35 years since the first oil shock put Japanese cars on the map in America. "Since the mid-Seventies," one Detroit manager recently told me, "I have sat through umpteen meetings describing how we had to beat the Japanese to survive. Thirty-five years later we are still trying to figure it out."

Which is why pouring taxpayer billions into the same old dysfunctional morass isn't the answer.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122628230122212449.html

[bdunn13]

Obama is doing great things for the economy and he is not even in office yet!

http://www.kansascity.com/news/politics ... 82862.html

[dougb]

Wasn't that GM's genius design where they used aluminum heads with a cast iron block.

And lest not forgot the Corvair which were famous for instantaneous combustion. Thankfully American have come a long way and I do my part by driving American cars. I like Ford products.

I can still remember my grandmother and mother reminiscing about the Edsel my grandfather bought. It was a real status symbol car, just not quite the status symbol they were banking on!

Best wishes,

Doug

[JackB1]

This week on Bill Maher they showed comparison's between McCain's consession speech and Kerry's from 4 years ago. The contrast was amazing. All the low class booing and carrying on from the Republican audience when McCain mentioned Obama and nothing but silence and respect from the Democratic crowd when Kerry conceded to Bush. And that was after Bush's first term! Quite a difference between the two parties I would say. I know a lot of you will automatically dismiss this because it was on Maher's show, but he merely played back the video from both speech's.

[RobVarak]

Reports that Obama is leaning on pint-sized future convicted felon Rod Blagojevich to appoint Valerie Jarrett as his successor in the US Senate.

The primary argument in her favor is that she is more qualified than the future family puppy would be, albeit not by much.

This would be horrifying if Illinois politics wasn't already so far into the realm of the absurd. As it is it will be funny to see the legitimately qualified Democratic politicians in Illinois march on Blago's home with torches and effigies.

PS Happy b-day to the USMC. Coincidentally, I met a former marine over the weekend. As usualy he conformed to the stereotypes...pro and con There's a special place in heaven for those jar-heads. LOL

[fsquid]

Didn't Kerry make his concession speech at 2 in the afternoon on a Wed? NOt many liquored up at that time.

[XXXIV]

This week on Bill Maher they showed comparison's between McCain's consession speech and Kerry's from 4 years ago. The contrast was amazing. All the low class booing and carrying on from the Republican audience when McCain mentioned Obama and nothing but silence and respect from the Democratic crowd when Kerry conceded to Bush. And that was after Bush's first term! Quite a difference between the two parties I would say. I know a lot of you will automatically dismiss this because it was on Maher's show, but he merely played back the video from both speech's.

I saw the speech. Was the best one of consession Id ever seen. Thanks for trying to ruin it.

I find your post embaressing. Spiteful and hateful even in victory. Thanks for showing us how much more class democrats have.

[RobVarak]

This week on Bill Maher they showed comparison's between McCain's consession speech and Kerry's from 4 years ago. The contrast was amazing. All the low class booing and carrying on from the Republican audience when McCain mentioned Obama and nothing but silence and respect from the Democratic crowd when Kerry conceded to Bush. And that was after Bush's first term! Quite a difference between the two parties I would say. I know a lot of you will automatically dismiss this because it was on Maher's show, but he merely played back the video from both speech's.

I saw the speech. Was the best one of consession Id ever seen. Thanks for trying to ruin it.

I find your post embaressing. Spiteful and hateful even in victory. Thanks for showing us how much more class democrats have.

And if the attendees at Kerry's concession were respectful and reasonable, the Left made up for it by being disrespectful spittle-spraying venom merchants for the last 8 years. Uh, I mean by being patriotic in their dissent.

[JRod]

This week on Bill Maher they showed comparison's between McCain's consession speech and Kerry's from 4 years ago. The contrast was amazing. All the low class booing and carrying on from the Republican audience when McCain mentioned Obama and nothing but silence and respect from the Democratic crowd when Kerry conceded to Bush. And that was after Bush's first term! Quite a difference between the two parties I would say. I know a lot of you will automatically dismiss this because it was on Maher's show, but he merely played back the video from both speech's.

I saw the speech. Was the best one of consession Id ever seen. Thanks for trying to ruin it.

I find your post embaressing. Spiteful and hateful even in victory. Thanks for showing us how much more class democrats have.

The point that Maher/Jack was saying is that the crowds treated the winner/loser in a different way. It had nothing to do with the actual speeches.

[JackB1]

This week on Bill Maher they showed comparison's between McCain's consession speech and Kerry's from 4 years ago. The contrast was amazing. All the low class booing and carrying on from the Republican audience when McCain mentioned Obama and nothing but silence and respect from the Democratic crowd when Kerry conceded to Bush. And that was after Bush's first term! Quite a difference between the two parties I would say. I know a lot of you will automatically dismiss this because it was on Maher's show, but he merely played back the video from both speech's.

I saw the speech. Was the best one of consession Id ever seen. Thanks for trying to ruin it.

I find your post embaressing. Spiteful and hateful even in victory. Thanks for showing us how much more class democrats have.

The point that Maher/Jack was saying is that the crowds treated the winner/loser in a different way. It had nothing to do with the actual speeches.

Exactly. How exactly was it being spiteful or hateful? Those people that were booing were the one's being hateful. I thought McCain's speech was great and showed class. Too bad the same couldn't be said for his speech audience.

[JackB1]

I saw the speech. Was the best one of consession Id ever seen. Thanks for trying to ruin it.

I find your post embaressing. Spiteful and hateful even in victory. Thanks for showing us how much more class democrats have.

My comments had zero to do with the actual speeches. They were about the audience reactions. And yes...in this instance, the Democrats showed a lot more class. Even McCain seemed upset at the way they kept booing even after he asked then to stop. Don't blame me for that.

[matthewk]

This week on Bill Maher they showed comparison's between McCain's consession speech and Kerry's from 4 years ago. The contrast was amazing. All the low class booing and carrying on from the Republican audience when McCain mentioned Obama and nothing but silence and respect from the Democratic crowd when Kerry conceded to Bush. And that was after Bush's first term! Quite a difference between the two parties I would say. I know a lot of you will automatically dismiss this because it was on Maher's show, but he merely played back the video from both speech's.

I wonder if he'll also comapre the conventions from earlier this year. During the DNC, there were no reported problems from right wing groups. During the RNC however, the so-called "peaceful & loving" left wing was busy causing trouble and damaging property.

Like this example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jq9KydhH ... re=related

Always nice to see a guy with a mask on jump on a cop.

[matthewk]

This week on Bill Maher they showed comparison's between McCain's consession speech and Kerry's from 4 years ago. The contrast was amazing. All the low class booing and carrying on from the Republican audience when McCain mentioned Obama and nothing but silence and respect from the Democratic crowd when Kerry conceded to Bush. And that was after Bush's first term! Quite a difference between the two parties I would say. I know a lot of you will automatically dismiss this because it was on Maher's show, but he merely played back the video from both speech's.

I saw the speech. Was the best one of consession Id ever seen. Thanks for trying to ruin it.

I find your post embaressing. Spiteful and hateful even in victory. Thanks for showing us how much more class democrats have.

The point that Maher/Jack was saying is that the crowds treated the winner/loser in a different way. It had nothing to do with the actual speeches.

We are all quite aware of what Jack was saying. His usual "the right is bad, the left is good". That is the only reason he brought it up. And you are correct, it had nothing to do with the speeches.

[XXXIV]

I saw the speech. Was the best one of consession Id ever seen. Thanks for trying to ruin it.

I find your post embaressing. Spiteful and hateful even in victory. Thanks for showing us how much more class democrats have.

My comments had zero to do with the actual speeches. They were about the audience reactions. And yes...in this instance, the Democrats showed a lot more class. Even McCain seemed upset at the way they kept booing even after he asked then to stop. Don't blame me for that.

Fair enough...but I can blame you for the dems are good republicans are bad bullshit...Cmon already with that garbage.

[JRod]

I saw the speech. Was the best one of consession Id ever seen. Thanks for trying to ruin it.

I find your post embaressing. Spiteful and hateful even in victory. Thanks for showing us how much more class democrats have.

The point that Maher/Jack was saying is that the crowds treated the winner/loser in a different way. It had nothing to do with the actual speeches.

We are all quite aware of what Jack was saying. His usual "the right is bad, the left is good". That is the only reason he brought it up. And you are correct, it had nothing to do with the speeches.

Again his point was the difference between Kerry's crowd in response to Pres. Bush and McCain's crowd to Pres-Elect Obama.

There's not right is wrong -- left is right -- center in cream-filled BS. The video shows the difference.

Opposition, or resentment to Obama's Presidency was building in McCain's events. SOME supporter's of McCain/Palin will hate anything Obama does. Much the same way extreme liberals hated Bush before 9/11 and Iraq.

But the difference is that there's a racial/religious tinge to the outrage. Hillary started it. She opened the attacks on Obama being a Muslim, hating America. However there's a difference between attacking Obama and perpetuating hate toward Obama. Before he's elected the tone of the final weeks have created a hatred of Obama before he's even in office.

That's the difference of the video clips.

[Jackdog]

This week on Bill Maher they showed comparison's between McCain's consession speech and Kerry's from 4 years ago. The contrast was amazing. All the low class booing and carrying on from the Republican audience when McCain mentioned Obama and nothing but silence and respect from the Democratic crowd when Kerry conceded to Bush. And that was after Bush's first term! Quite a difference between the two parties I would say. I know a lot of you will automatically dismiss this because it was on Maher's show, but he merely played back the video from both speech's.

Not really. A few people booing doesn't represent the whole party. That's like saying Sean Penn and Madonna are indicative of all the Democratic party. Look man,your man won. Why beat a dead horse? Did you read any classless posts from those of us that didn't vote for Obama? Did Siam's post represent your party? Please don't paint people with such broad brushes. It makes you look like an elitist.

[Jackdog]

Again his point was the difference between Kerry's crowd in response to Pres. Bush and McCain's crowd to Pres-Elect Obama.

There's not right is wrong -- left is right -- center in cream-filled BS. The video shows the difference.

Opposition, or resentment to Obama's Presidency was building in McCain's events. SOME supporter's of McCain/Palin will hate anything Obama does. Much the same way extreme liberals hated Bush before 9/11 and Iraq.

But the difference is that there's a racial/religious tinge to the outrage. Hillary started it. She opened the attacks on Obama being a Muslim, hating America. However there's a difference between attacking Obama and perpetuating hate toward Obama. Before he's elected the tone of the final weeks have created a hatred of Obama before he's even in office.

That's the difference of the video clips.

This post is cream filled bullshit. Why don't you read his full post?

This week on Bill Maher they showed comparison's between McCain's consession speech and Kerry's from 4 years ago. The contrast was amazing. All the low class booing and carrying on from the Republican audience when McCain mentioned Obama and nothing but silence and respect from the Democratic crowd when Kerry conceded to Bush. And that was after Bush's first term! Quite a difference between the two parties I would say. I know a lot of you will automatically dismiss this because it was on Maher's show, but he merely played back the video from both speech's.

His point was to paint all members of the Republican party in a negitive light. Everyone in that audience wasn't booing or showing disrespect. Yet he makes a point of saying "Republican audience"and"Quite a difference between the two parties". Some of us know exactly what he ment. If you don't I'm not really surprised.

[JRod]

Again his point was the difference between Kerry's crowd in response to Pres. Bush and McCain's crowd to Pres-Elect Obama.

There's not right is wrong -- left is right -- center in cream-filled BS. The video shows the difference.

Opposition, or resentment to Obama's Presidency was building in McCain's events. SOME supporter's of McCain/Palin will hate anything Obama does. Much the same way extreme liberals hated Bush before 9/11 and Iraq.

But the difference is that there's a racial/religious tinge to the outrage. Hillary started it. She opened the attacks on Obama being a Muslim, hating America. However there's a difference between attacking Obama and perpetuating hate toward Obama. Before he's elected the tone of the final weeks have created a hatred of Obama before he's even in office.

That's the difference of the video clips.

This post is cream filled bullshit. Why don't you read his full post?

This week on Bill Maher they showed comparison's between McCain's consession speech and Kerry's from 4 years ago. The contrast was amazing. All the low class booing and carrying on from the Republican audience when McCain mentioned Obama and nothing but silence and respect from the Democratic crowd when Kerry conceded to Bush. And that was after Bush's first term! Quite a difference between the two parties I would say. I know a lot of you will automatically dismiss this because it was on Maher's show, but he merely played back the video from both speech's.

His point was to paint all members of the Republican party in a negitive light. Everyone in that audience wasn't booing or showing disrespect. Yet he makes a point of saying "Republican audience"and"Quite a difference between the two parties". Some of us know exactly what he ment. If you don't I'm not really surprised.

I moved off of Jack's post and more to Maher's video.

[Teal]

And yes...in this instance, the Democrats showed a lot more class.

Only because they won. Remember all the 'rioting in the streets' bull that they were warning of if Obama lost? Put the shoe on the other foot, Jack. Same result.