OT: Suggestions and tips on looking for a used car

sportdan30 · Post by **sportdan30** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 5:03 pm

I've never bought a used car before. I've either had a car payment on a new car, or I've leased a car. So, when my wife's Volkswagon Jetta in which I inherited crapped out, suddenly I've been put in a position to either repair the car for around $1300 or purchase a used car. Because I'm was not overly enthusiastic about the Jetta in the first place, I've decided to look for a used car.

I definitely need a bigger car than the Jetta. I'm 6'3, so getting in and out of that car was like being a clown in a circus. I've pretty much narrowed my choices down to the Altima's as well as the Camry's, however the Toyotas really are a bit too pricey for my wallet. Heck, the Altima's aren't cheap either. I used to have a '96 Altima and really liked that car. Unfortunately, the mean streets of Chicago really beat it up worse than a boxer fighting Tyson in his prime. I'm definitely digging the new body style, but I realize you can't look at style alone.

I really can't afford too much, so I'd like to spend as little as possible. I was thinking somewhere in the neighborhood of $10k to $12k. It's a big balancing act of finding a used car with low miles. Seemingly, you're giving up something.

Unfortunately and fortunately the wife is having her say and she wants me to get the Altima as well. They're a bit out of my price range as well unless of course I can do some serious negotiating (which by the way I hate).

I wouldn't mind looking at other car manufacturers......perhaps Mazdas and Saturns.....

If anyone can provide their buying experiences along with their preference of car manufacturer, I'm all eyes and ears.

Thanks.

Dave · Post by **Dave** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 5:27 pm

I'm a Mazda guy, my wife digs Nissans.

So, naturally, she drives a Mazda6 and I just got an Altima for my car.

The low mileage 02 Altima 2.5S I just bought was just out of your price range, and if you don't mind a manual, you could probably find one at the right price. It is really a roomy, powerful car (for a four cylinder). The interior materials are a little chincy compared to our 6, which surprised me, and the power steering is a little over-boosted, but overall it'll be great for my mostly-highway drive.

The 6 is an awesome car, it handles really well for a FWD car, but the transmission is not well-geared for the four banger--the Altima smokes it in a straight line. But get the 6 in some sweeping corners or braking zones and it really shines. I think it is a little smaller than the Altima, too.

Not sure where the oldest (2002, maybe 03 I think) 6 values are like. The wagon is a V6 and appears to have really crappy residual value, so you might be able to get a great deal on one of those.

zoom zoom

anchester · Post by **anchester** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 5:34 pm

typically american cars depreciate much quicker than the camcords. You can get a 1 year old domestic under warranty (new malibu) for the same price as a 4 year old camcord. why not take advantage. Same can be said for off name japanese brands (hyundai and mitsu).

Dave · Post by **Dave** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 5:43 pm

anchester wrote:typically american cars depreciate much quicker than the camcords. You can get a 1 year old domestic under warranty (new malibu) for the same price as a 4 year old camcord. why not take advantage. Same can be said for off name japanese brands (hyundai and mitsu).

All depends on what you're looking for--you sure as hell won't find the steering and road feel of a Mazda6 in a Malibu. My parents have an 04 Malibu, and I would say it compares pretty well to the Altima. But I've seen too many of their other GMs fall apart after two years, so I'm not patting the General on the back just yet.

Yep, I'm part of the lost generation for GM, so take my view with a grain fo salt.

Hyundai has made some tremendous improvements over the past 5 years. The new Sonata really looks like a winner.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 5:55 pm

The only thing I can say...stay away from Pontiacs. I've had three and they've all sucked.

Nissan's current lineup has me drooling...I love virtually every car they have out right now. Next summer I'm going to be in the market for a new car and I've got my sights on 5 Nissans and a couple others.

Altima, Maxima, Murano, Frontier and Xterra. None of which top 25 base, but the ones I'm interested in are around 30,000 out the door. Couple those with the new Charger, the Tacoma Quad Cab, Jeep Cherokee (w/ the Hemi of course) and the new Lexus IS, and I've got some work to do next summer. Right now, the Charger and the Murano top my list (this assumes they come out with the Charger in a manual...I hate auto-sticks).

Dave · Post by **Dave** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 6:32 pm

dbdynsty25 wrote:The only thing I can say...stay away from Pontiacs. I've had three and they've all sucked.

DB cruising around LA in an Aztek (Asstek), that thought cracks me up

We traded in our 96 Maxima to get the Altima and were sad to see it go. But we figured it needed at least $1K in wear-and-tear repairs (exhaust system, etc.), so I hope the Altima follows suit.

Dan, be sure to run a Carfax report on everything. It really helped me narrow down which cars to seriously consider--one I really liked from a color/mileage standpoint was initially registered as a fleet vehicle. No thanks. I wanted a single-owner car, too, so it was nice to have all of that information in front of you.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 6:44 pm

What's funny about that Asstek is that I had to rent on when I went to Denver on business a while back...of course I got the Burnt orange one, lol. What's really surprising is that it drives REALLY nice. It's the ugliest thing I've ever seen, but I was impressed with how in handled and drove.

Dave · Post by **Dave** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 6:50 pm

On the bright side, it could have been the camo green Asstek.

cootdog · Post by **cootdog** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 6:55 pm

I used to think the Altimas were all that, but now that every new car buyer is choosing one, I'm a little less thrilled by them. I really like the 6s. I don't think they've been marketed aggressively enough, because they seem a little slept-on around here. The '06 Sonatas look promising, though I haven't seen one. Buying American does make a lot of sense, fiscally, but you're likely going to take a hit in terms of design, comfort, overall reliability, and -- unless you plan on driving the car into the ground -- resale value. That said, I own an American car, and would probably buy another one in the future.

Since you said you were interested in Saturns, I thought I'd share my experiences: I own (just paid off, in fact) a 2002 Saturn L200 (the L-Series is a four door sedan that Saturn has discontinued this past year). I bought it with 20,000 miles on it, a year old (looking new), for $10,900. The car had depreciated $7,000 in the previous year alone, but thankfully that's slowed since then. After I learned I was priced out of the Accords and Camrys, I looked to see what I could get for around 10, and was pleased to see a lot of standard features on this that weren't on the used imports in my range, i.e. disc anti-lock brakes, traction control, driver/passenger/side airbags, and a 60/40 folding rear seat.

I think the car looks OK -- blandly Japanese, but competent. Interior materials and ride are a definite step back from the imports. It does handle very well (engineered from an Opel design, it maintains its German heritage in that respect), and the 2.2 L Ecotec 4 is reliable and provides enough in the way of power. The polymer side panels aren't resistant to scuffs (paint is paint), but they do resist the dings that can make a new car look old real fast. Two years and 29K later, I haven't had any problems but new tires (L's are known to eat them up) and recall work that replaced the ignition module and sparkplugs.

Another plus is that Saturn always rates high in customer service, so if you get your car serviced at the dealer, expect a pleasant experience (mine have been painless).

If you're interested in an '02, you should be able to find a real good deal on one with low miles, especially if you buy from a private party (given the Blue Book value on these things).

People's experiences with Saturns vary -- trolling the forums will definitely help you make up your mind. I do know that my year L happens to be the best-regarded before the 2003 redesign (which effectively killed any interest I had in trading up, as I think the front end is now hideous).

One last thing: on any car, be sure to read the horror stories, so you or a mechanic can check out problem areas before you buy. Case in point: http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17815

F308GTB · Post by **F308GTB** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 6:58 pm

I'm all for buying used cars. Why not let someone else pay the depreciation? A 3-year old car is kind of the sweet spot for used cars. It doesn't hurt to buy American at that point since the car has depreciated so much.

Have you thought about a BMW 3-series? Great cars. When we needed another car 2 years ago, we went with a 1998 M3. The nice thing about the M3 is that the bottom value is still fairly high. Consider sports or higher end sedans that essentially allow you to borrow the car. If you were to pay $20k for an E36 M3 today, you could drive it a few years and probably sell it for $17k or so. Or go with an older Porsche and basically sell for what you pay.

Of the cars I own:

1994 Saturn SL - has somewhere between 250,000 and 300,000 miles on it. Odo crapped out at 108k. Been through 3 alternators but everything else is routine (brakes, tires, oil, etc). Bought new and it has been a tremendous purchase. I've heard the quality has dropped a bit since the 90s.

1998 BMW M3 - bought 2 years ago as a BMW Certified Preowned. The wife uses it primarily and the miles have been low. Bought at 38k miles and now it has 53k 2 years later. Great car and good quality. I'd definitely buy another BMW.

1978 Ferrari 308 GTB - not an everyday driver just a fun car. One of those cars I could turn over in a pinch and make back pretty much what I paid for it. Would buy another Ferrari just because the looks are sooo good.

F308GTB · Post by **F308GTB** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 6:59 pm

One thing I should have added - buy a manual transmission. They last longer than automatics. All our cars are manual.

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 7:01 pm

How about a 1- or 2-year-old Hyundai Sonata?

The Sonata is in the same class as the Camry and Altima, it's a nice car, it has a cheaper retail price than either of those cars so it will be cheaper used, Hyundai's quality has improved drastically in the last five years, and the car has a 10-year, 100,000-mile warranty, so it will be covered by warranty for a long, long time.

That's a WAY better warranty than Toyota or Nissan. Hyundai needed that warranty five or six years ago when its quality was dubious. But now its quality isn't that far behind either Toyota or Honda, and it still offers that great warranty.

Our last three cars have been used, 1 or 2 years old, and we've had great luck. You have to do your research, buy from a reputable dealer or have a good mechanic check out a car in a private sale, and get a Carfax lemon check on the Web by all means.

Year-old used cars are a great deal. Most still are covered by warranty, and remember that a new car loses 20 percent of its value the second it leaves the lot, with very few exceptions.

Good luck!

Take care,
PK

blueduke · Post by **blueduke** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 7:38 pm

No matter what type car you choose, make sure that (a) it's still under warranty and (b) you get a copy of the carfax report. also make sure you know what state the car came from. I wouldn't go near a used car that came from Louisiana, Mississippi, or Texas right now

Another point to ponder: if it's a foreign car you choose parts to repair it will cost more than domestic cars. Just last month I had to have an 02 sensor put in my Mazda Protege. Cost of the sensor: $159.00. Domestic part would have been about half that.

Always remember: that used car is being sold for a reason

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 7:49 pm

blueduke wrote:I wouldn't go near a used car that came from Louisiana, Mississippi, or Texas right now

That's a damn good point, seriously!

blueduke wrote:Always remember: that used car is being sold for a reason

That was fair warning maybe 10 or 15 years ago. But in these days of cheap and easy credit, a lot of cars are being traded in because either the owner wants to step up in class and doesn't give a sh*t about carrying heavy debt or is in way over their head with debt and has to get rid of the car in a hurry or risk repossession. There's also a hell of a lot more leasing going on then there was 10 or 15 years ago, with those lease cars returning to the used car market.

Not all used cars are being sold because they're sh*t.

Our last three vehicles have been rental buybacks, and we've had good luck with all of them. Sure, some people drive rentals like idiots, but the majority of people drive them responsibly. Plus maintenance programs are followed pretty closely by rental companies, as they don't want their customers breaking down on the road or driving sh*tty-looking cars.

The best thing about rental buybacks is that they're cheap. I got a 2004 Chevy Venture mini-van this February as a rental buyback with 21,000 miles. It retailed for around $20,000 or $21,000, and I got it for $15,000. Mighty fine Wagon Family Truckster so far.

Take care,
PK

bkrich83 · Post by **bkrich83** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 7:55 pm

dbdynsty25 wrote:The only thing I can say...stay away from Pontiacs. I've had three and they've all sucked.

Nissan's current lineup has me drooling...I love virtually every car they have out right now. Next summer I'm going to be in the market for a new car and I've got my sights on 5 Nissans and a couple others.

Altima, Maxima, Murano, Frontier and Xterra. None of which top 25 base, but the ones I'm interested in are around 30,000 out the door. Couple those with the new Charger, the Tacoma Quad Cab, Jeep Cherokee (w/ the Hemi of course) and the new Lexus IS, and I've got some work to do next summer. Right now, the Charger and the Murano top my list (this assumes they come out with the Charger in a manual...I hate auto-sticks).

Agreed on the Nissan's. I've owned several in my life. All have been great, reliable cars.

Currently we have an 05 350z and a 05 Xterra. Really like them both.

blueduke · Post by **blueduke** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 7:56 pm

That was fair warning maybe 10 or 15 years ago. But in these days of cheap and easy credit, a lot of cars are being traded in because either the owner wants to step up in class and doesn't give a sh*t about carrying heavy debt or is in way over their head with debt and has to get rid of the car in a hurry or risk repossession. There's also a hell of a lot more leasing going on then there was 10 or 15 years ago, with those lease cars returning to the used car market.

Point well taken.

billharris44 · Post by **billharris44** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 9:19 pm

Consumer Reports has an annual car buying issue and it has detailed repair frequency ratings for a ton of used cars. You can also get that info online by subscription at www.consumerreports.org.

sportdan30 · Post by **sportdan30** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:39 pm

Wow. Thanks for all the suggestions. Truly do appreciate it. Fortunately, I have a friend who just quit his job as a car salesman after nine years. I say fortunate because he has the username and password for a website similar to carfax.com. Case in point. I was real interested in an Altima a couple weeks back. Low mileage and right in my price range. I did a carfax on the car and found out it had a junk record. The car had been totaled and completely rebuilt.

At this point, I'm looking at all my options. Gonna check out the Saturn line and the Sonatas. Is anyone familar with the Sebrings? They seem to fall into my price range.

Gonna check out Consumer Reports tomorrow as well.

Thanks guys.

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:01 pm

sportdan30 wrote:Is anyone familar with the Sebrings?

It's a Chrysler product, which long-term reliability reports and consumer reviews have shown to have less reliability and a lower quality build than comparable cars, both foreign and domestic. My one experience with a Dodge Omni 024 back in the early 80s was awful, and friends and family who have owned Chrysler products in the last five to seven years have had some problems.

Unlike Hyundai, Chrysler still needs its 7/70 warranty to help drive sales due to the traditionally lower quality of its vehicles. That's why Iacocca -- or was it Eaton? -- started the Chrysler extended powertrain warranty many years ago: Chryslers were notoriously unreliable, and the company had to break the warranty mold to get people into the showrooms, especially as more reliable imports were starting to inundate America.

Good luck,
PK

Dave · Post by **Dave** » Tue Oct 04, 2005 7:29 am

pk500 wrote:It's a Chrysler product, which long-term reliability reports and consumer reviews have shown to have less reliability and a lower quality build than comparable cars, both foreign and domestic. My one experience with a Dodge Omni 024 back in the early 80s was awful, and friends and family who have owned Chrysler products in the last five to seven years have had some problems.

The f*cking Dodge Omni. My parents had one that ate a clutch every 3-6 months due to a ridiculously tall first gear. What a fun car to learn how to drive a stick...

PK, glad to hear you've had luck with ex-rental cars. Two memories stick in my head--getting a Town Car with 6 miles on it that we drove to Florida. Nothing like breaking in a car by driving it at 70 mph for 10 hours. The Days of Thunder rental car scene. Probably the closest to realistic that movie got

kicko · Post by **kicko** » Tue Oct 04, 2005 11:31 am

you just have to test driven them and see what hits ya...you can't just say i like that one and automaticly like it. I can suggest a ford focus good cars, cheap and similar to a jetta(might be a bad thing in your case) you can get a used one in your price range, no problem and it only has to be a few years old, basicly new

jLp vAkEr0 · Post by **jLp vAkEr0** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 6:55 pm

No one has mentioned(good or bad) about Suzuki.

I'm about to get a new Suzuki Forenza Wagon for myself.

Only a 2.0 engine, but that helps with gas milage and it's has tons of goddies.

I'm not a rubber burner so I don't need a big engine.

Considering that my last 2 cars where a 91 Chevy Lumina and a 94 Pontian Bonneville, I'm sure i'll notice the difference in power.

Doesn't really matter to me.

Does anyone know somebody with this model?

http://www.suzukiauto.com/sr_06/forenza_wagon/

I'm getting the Premium Package model in Black. Looks damn nice.

Very confy interiors.

Found a place in PR that offered it to me for $16,795. I may take the plunge this weekend.

Not a bad price considering that all places I visited or called had them over $17,995 or over.

Again, car prices down here are a joke.

sportdan30 · Post by **sportdan30** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 7:50 pm

Gonna go test drive a Hyundai Sonata this evening. Looking at either a 2002 or 2003. Sounds like a pretty nice car for the money.

Good luck Javi!

sportdan30 · Post by **sportdan30** » Thu Oct 06, 2005 1:05 pm

Well, I just can't make up my mind about the Sonata. While it is nice looking from the outside and drives pretty smoothly, the interior and overall comfort is less than desireable. I may have to test drive another one just to be sure.

It didn't help that the car smelled like someone used to smoke in it, and it was missing the antenna. Thus, a.m. radio didn't work. As insignificant as it sounds, a.m. radio is a weak point in Volkswagons. In addition, the wife was less than impressed with the interior. That of course shouldn't matter in the whole scheme of things. I'm the one who's going to be driving it the majority of the time.

Anyone had any experiences with Galants or Kia Optimas?

Thanks.

dbdynsty25 · Post by **dbdynsty25** » Thu Oct 06, 2005 1:58 pm

You just need to stick to the standard Carolla, Civic or Sentras of the world. May be a little more expensive, but there is a reason Japan still dominates the sedan market. They are a hellova lot more comfortable and they are on the cheaper end of the spectrum when it comes to used cars with high reliability ratings. Get away from the damn Kia, Suzukis, and Hyundias. There is a reason they don't have market share.