OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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Very tough loss for Federer. Third time he's lost to Novak in majors after having two match points and third time he's lost to the Serb in the final of Wimbledon. Fed was arguably the better player throughout and Nole admitted in his press conference "I was on the back foot for most of the match" (minute 4.27)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AziIXcmE9Xg&t=761s

But kudos to Djokovic. The fact that he's had this success against Fed in such tough situations on numerous occasions is testimony to his incredible capacities both as a tennis player and as a competitor.

A truly great battle worthy of the venue, the occasion and two incredible players and athletes.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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rhymes450 wrote:Very tough loss for Federer. Third time he's lost to Novak in majors after having two match points and third time he's lost to the Serb in the final of Wimbledon. Fed was arguably the better player throughout and Nole admitted in his press conference "I was on the back foot for most of the match" (minute 4.27)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AziIXcmE9Xg&t=761s

But kudos to Djokovic. The fact that he's had this success against Fed in such tough situations on numerous occasions is testimony to his incredible capacities both as a tennis player and as a competitor.

A truly great battle worthy of the venue, the occasion and two incredible players and athletes.
Yeah, I thought Federer was the better player during key points of the match. I mean I kept telling myself how is it possible that Nole is ahead two sets to one without being able to break the Swiss serve not even once. During the longer rallies, Federer was dictating the points.

To me it came to mental strength. Sounds cliche, but as you mention with his recent winning record against him, he just digged deeply inside him when he was in trouble. Two match points against him, never gave up. I mean Federer just couldn’t close the match for whatever reason but he played so well in this finals.

A damn shame it had to go to a tiebreaker with all the emotions and drama of the match, without it, it was Federer raising the trophy. But we all have that doubt crawling deep inside us when you know the opponent has your number, you start doubting, you’re not as aggressive, you make unforced errors. If you play the sport, you know what I am talking about.

As long as the match was, it was more mental than physical in my opinion for these two great players. Fantastic finals.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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Was listening to the Slate podcast and they had on a reporter who says the better Djoko plays, the less he's liked.

For all his success, he doesn't have the same level of adulation that Federer and Nadal have.

Djoko has been defiant to the crowd at times or taunting them. Seems to stir up resentment in him that the Western European crowds haven't accepted him as deeply as the other great players of the era.

Some of it is cultural, I'm sure there is something among Serbs about not being as accepted or feeling judged by Western Europeans, with the Bosnian and Kosovo conflicts relatively fresh in the memory of Europeans.

So maybe it takes a massive chip on the shoulder for him to want to beat favored sons Federer and Nadal.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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I don't think it's so much that people don't like Djokovic as the fact that Federer and Nadal are the subjects of what might even be described as disproportional adulation. The fact that Djokovic and, to a lesser extent, Murray arrived on the scene after Roger and Rafa's intense rivalry was already deep-rooted is perhaps another factor. Many hardcore and casual fans had already taken sides in the Roger/Rafa debate and perhaps there wasn't a lot of room left in their hearts for a third party. Maybe the fans even see him as an intruder in what would otherwise be the greatest rivalry in the history of the game by quite a margin. Even when Murray was bidding to become the first Briton to win a major for yonks on his "home turf" in the Wimbledon final in 2012, he probably wasn't the crowd favorite against Roger.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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There's also a big difference in on court demeanor.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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wco81 wrote:There's also a big difference in on court demeanor.
Yeah, maybe. Not something I really perceive. Maybe it's not that important to me, but I see all of them going about the job in a very serious way, with the odd negative and positive emotional manifestations, but nothing out of the ordinary. Somebody said to me the other day that they'd never seen Roger break a racquet. I have...then again, maybe I watch too much tennis :D

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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A few early observations at the US Open. It’s been a bit of a struggle for R. Federer advancing. You look at his draw and you say he should cruise easily to the quarters, yet he’s struggling a bit. He lost last week in Cinci in the quarters to a very promising Russian player in Rublev who already upset Tsitsipas yesterday.

A lot of unforced errors coupled with a struggling first serve are the reasons he lost already two sets, he may need more match play after Wimbledon, as the other two main opponents Nadal and Djokovic are just in cruise control so far.

Watching Tsitsipas cramp vs Rublev yesterday was painful to watch. Unable to call for medical help, he did try to extend the match to five sets but this young Russian player got game and along Medvedev is the next young promising Russian generation to come.

Serena looked lethal vs Sharapova and if health is not an issue she will be a threat still at 38 years of age.

Coco Gauff is a promising young player to watch, smart, able to change tactics on the run and just 15 years old.

And finally a few words on Kyrgios. This mad man is one of the most talented players out there. He makes tennis look easy at times. Yet his lack of focus is what keeps bringing him down. Fined 113K last week for his outbursts in Cinci, didn’t seem to change his attitude last night vs Johnson. Whether is maturity or lack of, he took a few shots at the umpire unnecessarily when he was just cruising in his match, and runs the risk of just being suspended by the tour by calling them corrupt. Money is not an issue for him so obviously a lengthy suspension is the next step.

He makes the likes of Nastase, McEnroe, Connors look like angels.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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10spro wrote:A few early observations at the US Open. It’s been a bit of a struggle for R. Federer advancing. You look at his draw and you say he should cruise easily to the quarters, yet he’s struggling a bit. He lost last week in Cinci in the quarters to a very promising Russian player in Rublev who already upset Tsitsipas yesterday.

A lot of unforced errors coupled with a struggling first serve are the reasons he lost already two sets, he may need more match play after Wimbledon, as the other two main opponents Nadal and Djokovic are just in cruise control so far.

Watching Tsitsipas cramp vs Rublev yesterday was painful to watch. Unable to call for medical help, he did try to extend the match to five sets but this young Russian player got game and along Medvedev is the next young promising Russian generation to come.

Serena looked lethal vs Sharapova and if health is not an issue she will be a threat still at 38 years of age.

Coco Gauff is a promising young player to watch, smart, able to change tactics on the run and just 15 years old.

And finally a few words on Kyrgios. This mad man is one of the most talented players out there. He makes tennis look easy at times. Yet his lack of focus is what keeps bringing him down. Fined 113K last week for his outbursts in Cinci, didn’t seem to change his attitude last night vs Johnson. Whether is maturity or lack of, he took a few shots at the umpire unnecessarily when he was just cruising in his match, and runs the risk of just being suspended by the tour by calling them corrupt. Money is not an issue for him so obviously a lengthy suspension is the next step.

He makes the likes of Nastase, McEnroe, Connors look like angels.
Haven't checked out the draw much 10s, but it's been a tough first round for many on the men's side. Tough watching Tsitsipas cramping against Rublev, but you're right...this Russian has game and we'd have heard a lot more about him in the last year or so if he hadn't been suffering from injury.

Totally knocked out by Shapovalov's destruction of Felix Auger-Aliassime. Awesome performance and Felix showed a lot of maturity in the press conference by acknowledging it. He'll be back for sure.

Hard to believe that Felix, Tsitsipas and Roberto-Agut are out in round one, not to mention Querrey and Tsonga.

Nadal (regularly serving at around about 125 mph) and Djokovic have looked impressive. Wonder a bit about Federer, who hasn't impressed but he's in round 3 now so we'll see what happens.

Coco Gauff did very well to turn that match around.

Rain today :( but shaping up to be a great tournament

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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I was quite surprised at how easily Shapo disposed of Alliasime, Rhymes. To be honest Shapo has been struggling this summer losing in fact in the Canadian open to AA in straight sets. The 19 years youngster has a great future in Canada and will soon be the face of the nation along Shapo and Bianca on the women’s side especially with Raonic constant nagging injuries. Did not expect to be straight sets, it was a coin toss for me but Denis played out of his mind really.

Still on the Canadian content don’t forget the big 5 set upset from V. Pospisil on Kachanov who’s a top ten.

It’ll be interesting to see how much this shoulder injury will bug Nole the next couple of matches. It’s the only thing that would prevent a Nadal finals in my opinion.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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It’ll be interesting to see how much this shoulder injury will bug Nole the next couple of matches. It’s the only thing that would prevent a Nadal finals in my opinion.
Seems like it didn't affect him much against Kudla, but Wawrinka could prove an even bigger obstacle. He's had a fair bit of success against Novak in Grand Slam events.

Roger looked sublime against Danny Evans, who complained, with some justification IMO, about the scheduling of the match.

Goffin and Carreño Busta, who probably deserved at least a set, gave an exhibition of high-quality stroke production, before the Belgian triumphed to set up a match with Federer. I guess the organisers will have the happy dilemma of deciding whether Federer-Goffin or Djokovic-Wawrinka should be the night match on Ashe.

The night session tonight promises big things, with Osaka v Gauff and Kygrios v Rublev. Two potential blockbusters, starting at 01:30 in the morning here in Madrid :( . A dilemma for me right there :?

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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We won't know to what extent the injury affected Roger but all credit to G.Dimitrov in defeating the great Swiss. With Djoko out also due to injury, the tournament has opened up for Nadal who must first take care of one the hottest players this summer in D. Medvedev.

Whether it’s due to a coach change, new fitness, I have never seen Dimitrov move so well in the court. At times it was like watching a replica of Federer, his game is smooth, effortless and has that beautiful one handed backhand too. Perhaps, it’s his mental state, even after losing the third set you could tell that he was going to push Roger tonight. That split he did after a lengthy rally passing Federer at the net was a beauty to watch.

Now, it’s the hard part for the Bulgarian. He would tend to falter after winning a couple of tough matches, he’s in the semis now, if he moves the way he did tonight, he can be in the finals.

Great match.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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Yep, Roger looked a step off the pace, even earlier on in the match, but Dimitrov played very well. He looks in great shape physically and I think that's going to give him an important edge against Medvedev, who's played a lot of tennis (very successfully) recently and at one point looked as if he might not finish the match against Wawrinka.

You'd expect Rafa to be a reasonably hot favorite now, though Schwartzman is a fabulous player, perhaps hindered by his small stature, and you never know. Berrettini looks to be the main danger in a potential semi.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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It’s been a good year internationally for the Canucks. Raptors represented ‘We the North’ and after a thrilling finals vs Serena, Bianca is the new Canadian darling in beating the veteran in straight sets. Only 19 years old, matched Serena’s strokes with ease in fact outhitting her and pinning her deep in the baseline.

Down 1-5 in the second set, Williams starting coming back with the help of the crowd but unfazed, Andreescu continued to serve well and took the final set 7-5.

It wasn’t that Serena played badly, perhaps her first serve was her weakness tonight but Bianca got the game that will win her many more GS championships.

‘She the North’. 8)

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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Serena was hitting bullets in the previous two rounds.

I didn't see the final. Was she unable to hit as many winners or maybe unforced errors?

Or did the Canadian manage to outhit her?

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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wco81 wrote:Serena was hitting bullets in the previous two rounds.

I didn't see the final. Was she unable to hit as many winners or maybe unforced errors?

Or did the Canadian manage to outhit her?
Serena didn’t play badly. If there was something that she could have done better was locating better her first serves which was under 50%. Those bullets that you mention were matched stroke for stroke, in fact many times Bianca kept her deep enough where Serena just couldn’t keep up.

And not many players can do that to Serena these days. But what impressed me most about Bianca is her mentality. She got power, she got a good defensive game where she can transition accordingly. Not many players can handle Serena’s powerful serves, but Bianca was just returning them for winners with the same power and accuracy.

Damn impressive, and only 19. She got a great future ahead.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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Guess there must be some question marks about how Serena is going into Grand Slam finals. I only started watching from the second game of the second set but she looked nervy and erratic, no doubt due also to the merits of Andreescu. I think the statistics say Serena's lost her last four finals. I can remember Osaka last year at this event, where she lost her cool, to say the least, Halep at Wimbledon, where she was well beaten, and now Bianca, who I haven't seen a lot of but she's obviously set for a great career. Had she converted the match point at 5-1, it would have been a trouncing and I can't help feeling that that must be at least partially due to Serena either having an off day or maybe failing to cope with the pressure of equalling and surpassing the record number of GS singles titles.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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What a marathon in the men’s finals between Nadal and Medvedev, one of the better five setters in a GS championshipsin recent memory.

The match had it all, lots of drama, outstanding shot makings, penalty points against Rafa and a vibrant crowd that wanted the match to just go the distance.

It didn’t look good for the Russian after two and a half and what an effort Medvedev did to stretch it to five when the best tennis was being played. I think the match took about five hours and these two guys started hitting winners out of nowhere after the three hours mark.

Credit to Medvedev for changing his tactics in the third set, mixing power with drop shots, even a few serve and volleys that caught Nadal by surprise. Aces were coming at the right time and in the longer rallies he was outhitting Nadal which is not easy to do. Even down 2-5 in the fifth, it didn’t look like a certain win for Nadal.

In the end it probably came to unforced errors and a stronger mental state from the Spaniard. Along Djoko he ruled the GS titles this season and who would have thought, he’s just a GS short of Federer’s all time record.

Very rarely you see a full house stay for the trophy ceremony, the crowd was just electric and appreciative of their efforts after witnessing a fantastic championship match.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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I’d be livid the way Nadal was going to the towel after every point, making Medvedev wait to start his serve.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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wco81 wrote:I’d be livid the way Nadal was going to the towel after every point, making Medvedev wait to start his serve.
He was booed several times when he was either trying to get more air after the long rallies or simply destruct the good momentum the Russian was having. A veteran move, he was penalized for it, I don’t like it, every single serve was right on the 30 second rule after the third set when things got tight for him.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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Two amazing men's finals in a row. First Wimbledon and now this. I guess the most amazing thing about this one is that it seemed all over when Rafa broke first in the third, only to lose his serve and open the door to what was almost the greatest comeback in recent history. Incredible guts by Medvedev, considering the mileage he's put up in the last couple of months. And kudos to Rafa for somehow finding a way in the fifth. If Medvedev had won either of the break points he had in the second or tenth game of that set, I think Rafa was going to be in big trouble. Can't remember ever seeing him pushed to the limits of his physical capacity to the degree he was in this final. Amazing match to finish a tournament. The big winners in the global picture for me were Rafa (obviously), Medvedev (almost equally obviously), Berrettini and Rublev, with special mention for Schwartzmann, Monfils, Dimitrov and Shapovalov. Fed produced some great performances but quarters in a GS is never going to be a satisfactory result for him, especially now that Rafa is breathing down his neck in the Grand Slam titles race. I won't talk about the big losers but some of the so-called next gen stars didn't live up to expectations.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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The tiebreak in the fifth set between John Millman and the great Federer was for the ages. Down 8-4, I thought The Aussie had all the momentum to close the match, he did beat the Swiss man before at the US Open, has heavy strokes and you could tell that Federer was never comfortable on the court.

Tsitsipas is out losing to Raonic, as that brackets opens up a bit for Roger on the possible semis with Djokovic.

Epic tiebreaker.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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10spro wrote:The tiebreak in the fifth set between John Millman and the great Federer was for the ages. Down 8-4, I thought The Aussie had all the momentum to close the match, he did beat the Swiss man before at the US Open, has heavy strokes and you could tell that Federer was never comfortable on the court.

Tsitsipas is out losing to Raonic, as that brackets opens up a bit for Roger on the possible semis with Djokovic.

Epic tiebreaker.
Yep, Roger looks favorite to make that semi now, even though he seemed out of sorts for long spells against Millman. Fognini has had some brilliant moments but it's hard to see him or any of the other three players in that section stopping Fed.

Raonic is always dangerous and he did look very good against Tsitsipas, but I don't see either him, Cilic or Schwartzman stopping Novak en route to the semis.

Another epic super-tiebreaker for Kygrios to set up the much-awaited "grudge" match against Nadal, and with Thiem, Monfils, Medvedev, Wawrinka, Rublev and Zverev making up the field in the top half, it's tough to predict a quarter-final lineup, not to mind possible semis.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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It looked for a time like Serena was going to smash all the majors titles record but she will be 40 next year and she's missing chances to add to her career titles lately.

Health and drive may stall her pursuit. Maybe she just beats it and goes to other pursuits.

She's certainly outperformed all her contemporaries.

But Margaret Court seems to be the GOAT, with her 24-5 record in 14 years vs. Serena's 23-10 record in majors finals over a span of 19 years.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_G ... is_records

Maybe the field in women's tennis wasn't that competitive in the '60s and early '70s as it is now. Certainly it's a more global sport, with more international competitors and people being trained better overall.

Still she racked up an impressive record.

Serena should eclipse the record of 24 major titles but it's going to take 20 years of being at the top of the sport.

Meanwhile, Federer and Nadal are already the top two in majors titles, with Djoko coming on fast. The last 10-20 years that these 3 players have dominated are probably the most competitive period in the men's game. Or actually, maybe they're the least competitive, since 3 men have dominated the majors titles for these years.

Looks like Laver and Emerson slugged it out in the '60s. Emerson with a very impressive winning percentage of 12-3 in just 7 years!

But it's odd, his last major title was in 1967 yet Wiki says he played until 1983, playing doubles, WTT and so on. Maybe he just had a short peak or some better competition came along and he couldn't return to the top. They don't show him too much when showing highlights of all time greats.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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The only reason Federer is NOT overwhelmingly voted as the GOAT, is because realistically, Nadal and Djoko can still reach that peak in terms of surpassing him in GS titles especially the Serbian. But with each passing year your body is going to feel all the pounding and heavy shots that are being played in today's tennis. Nadal ended being number 1 in 2019 although I felt that Djoko was the slightly more consistent player. It's not easy playing top tennis once you're in your 30's, the training that it takes to be top ten in the world, yet these three dudes have consistently pushed the envelope.

As for Serena, I think she's done. She's still got the power but lacks in consistency, both mentally and preparation. For the Americans, it's time to focus more on Coco Gauff who at 15 years only got some serious game.

Kachanov-Kyrgios match was outstanding, just don’t know about Nike’s latest fashion though. The Aussie looked like a clown with those flashy shorts and the Russian was wearing nurse pyjamas.

Kyrgios has all the tools to beat the top three, if only he took the game more seriously.

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Re: OT: Pro Tennis Thread

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10spro wrote:
Kachanov-Kyrgios match was outstanding, just don’t know about Nike’s latest fashion though. The Aussie looked like a clown with those flashy shorts and the Russian was wearing nurse pyjamas.

Kyrgios has all the tools to beat the top three, if only he took the game more seriously.
Haha, agree on all points, especially regarding the gear Nike have thrust upon their contracted players :roll:

Kygrios has great talent but winning even one grand slam tournament means putting it together over seven five-set matches and expending as little energy as possible so that you make it to the latter stages with your body as intact as possible. Kygrios has dropped the ball in that sense. He was two sets and a break up in the third against both Simon and Kachanov and had to pull out all the stops to get past them in the end, in four and five sets, respectively. Nadal has won his three matches in straight sets. Kygrios is a good bit younger than Nadal but it'll be interesting to see how they're both looking physically two hours into a match that's probably going to be a grueller. That said, Medvedev went through hell and high water in New York last year and almost came from two sets down to win the title. Be interesting to see how it pans out.

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