How much money is there in F1 anyways?

[wco81]

Or maybe that $100 million fine to McLaren isn't typical?

How much can a team win in a season?

[Rodster]

For any independent team like Williams or Spyker that would be a dagger to the heart. Ferrari, McLaren, BMW, Renault, Toyota are not in this position because they are manufactures funded by the factory and they sell automobiles.

To put in perspective, F1 helps Ferrari, McLaren, Mercedes Benz, BMW sell their flagship cars. So to answer your question theirs lots of money in F1. I think I read that Ferrari spends in the neighborhood of 400-500 million per year for their F1 team. But guess what they made that back when Michael Schumacher was winning championships and dominating Formula One. It's a nice feather in the cap when a company is trying to sell you a $250,000-750,000 street legal race car.

[F308GTB]

To put in perspective, F1 helps Ferrari, McLaren, Mercedes Benz, BMW sell their flagship cars. So to answer your question theirs lots of money in F1. I think I read that Ferrari spends in the neighborhood of 400-500 million per year for their F1 team. But guess what they made that back when Michael Schumacher was winning championships and dominating Formula One. It's a nice feather in the cap when a company is trying to sell you a $250,000-750,000 street legal race car.

I would not say that Ferrari is in F1 to sell their flagship cars. While their racing heritage is solid, a Ferrari would sell whether they were in F1 or not. They had some lean years in F1 and still sold through the roof.

Ferrari sales are more about history. As a Ferrari owner, I share a common view with other owners that we get more excitement about the history and beauty of the street cars. Yes we care about F1, but it's more about the cars.

[pk500]

It's the largest fine in sports history, according to the BBC World Service.

A top team like McLaren will have an annual budget of around $400 million, so that fine is 25 percent of the team's budget.

There is staggering money in F1.

Take care,
PK

[pk500]

From autosport.com:

>>>>>

McLaren may not have to pay all $100m

By Alan Baldwin Friday, September 14th 2007, 11:14 GMT

McLaren may ultimately have to pay substantially less than the record $100 million fine imposed on the team in a Formula One spying controversy.

"Firstly, effectively, we will still have as an offset the revenue from the points earned to date. That will effectively half the size of the cheque we have to sign, if we ultimately accept this fine," McLaren boss Ron Dennis told a news conference on Thursday.

"But as you can see if you read our accounts, we turn over roughly $450-500 million USD a year, and we are debt-free, so obviously we are a very strong company with phenomenal growth.

"I jokingly asked [Mercedes motorsport director] Norbert [Haug] if he was going to chip in half, but we haven't really come to a conclusion on that negotiation."

A report by Formula Money, which monitors the sport's financial health, said on Friday a sum of $31 million could be closer to the mark.

The International Automobile Federation said after a hearing in Paris on Thursday that McLaren would lose all their constructors' points for the 2007 season and also incur a $100 million fine for having Ferrari data in their possession.

However, it said in a statement that the sum would be "less the FOM (Formula One Management) income lost as a result of the points deduction."

McLaren are still considering whether to appeal.

The team, 23 points clear of Ferrari after last weekend's Italian Grand Prix with four races remaining, could have expected $68.9 million in prize money for winning the championship, according to Formula Money.

That lost revenue would still be a considerable blow to McLaren, who as well as being one of the most successful teams are also one of the wealthiest and best funded, but one they could absorb better than most.

Paddock insiders estimate that annual budgets in Formula One range from around $50-60 million for the likes of tail-enders Spyker to well in excess of $400 million for the likes of Ferrari, Toyota and McLaren.

The British-based team are debt free, despite spending a significant sum on an award-winning new factory, with Dennis saying at the start of the year they were financially fitter than at any time in their history.

According to Formula Money, McLaren Racing turned over 113.3 million pounds ($228.7 million) in 2005, making a profit after tax of 4.9 million.

As well as being supported by major companies, with Vodafone the title backer and Spanish banking group Santander a leading sponsor, McLaren are 40 percent owned by DaimlerChrysler's Mercedes.

McLaren said in January that Mumtalakat Holding Company, wholy owned by the Kingdom of Bahrain, was taking a 30 percent stake. That leaves Dennis and Saudi partner Mansour Ojjeh with 15 percent each.

McLaren have also struck gold in British rookie Lewis Hamilton, leading the championship in his debut season and as the first black driver in the sport a major asset for sponsors.

With a winning car, McLaren can expect to be back among the leaders next year.

Questions left unanswered by Thursday's hearing concerned the fine, what the FIA would do with it and what would happen to the withheld prize money normally distributed by Bernie Ecclestone's FOM.

It had also yet to be confirmed whether the teams lifted up the championship ranking by McLaren's lack of points would receive a greater share of the prize pot.

The paddock is based on a strict hierarchy, with teams' hospitality units lined up in the order that they finished the previous championship.

That means the most successful enjoy the prime positions of prominence while the tail-enders are cast into the furthest corners. McLaren will be at the bottom of the heap next year.

"It will be interesting to see how they fit their transporter into the far end of the paddock next year," commented one team boss at the Belgian Grand Prix on Friday.

<<<<<

Take care,
PK

[GB_Simo]

I would not say that Ferrari is in F1 to sell their flagship cars. While their racing heritage is solid, a Ferrari would sell whether they were in F1 or not.

I agree there, though given that Ferrari put paddle shifts and whatnot in their cars these days it might be a boon to have people feeling that their road car is derived from Formula One technology, even if it's a far slower shift than the seamless ones F1 have these days.

For so long when Enzo was at the helm, Ferrari sold their flagship cars to fund F1...

Edit: Link removed, since PK copy/pasted the entire thing while I was typing. Carry on, nothing to see here.

[pk500]

Ferrari is unique from every other automobile manufacturer involved in F1 for one reason: It started as a racing company before it built passenger cars.

The Scuderia was formed in 1929 as a race car manufacturer. It didn't start building production passenger cars until 1946, four years before the start of the World Championship as we know it today.

It's the exact opposite with Toyota, Honda, BMW, Renault and Mercedes.

Racing is the lifeblood of Ferrari. The Prancing Horse always will race, regardless of the success of its passenger car sales. The other major manufacturers will come and go depending on how the suits in marketing say racing affects the bottom line.

That never will happen at Ferrari. The suits at Maranello are racers.

Take care,
PK

[Rodster]

I would not say that Ferrari is in F1 to sell their flagship cars.

Racing is the lifeblood of Ferrari. The Prancing Horse always will race, regardless of the success of its passenger car sales. The other major manufacturers will come and go depending on how the suits in marketing say racing affects the bottom line.

That never will happen at Ferrari. The suits at Maranello are racers.

Take care,
PK

Yeah I should have said it better. No Ferrari is not in F1 just to sell their cars. As PK said they would race anyway. It just helps the buyer of their cars to connect them as a company who's cars are born to race. I hope that came across a little better.

[wco81]

So TV ratings and ticket sales must be pretty good?

Do you have to subscribe to a pay service to watch F1 in Europe?

I've seen plenty of football matches including ones months old televised but never seen an F1 race on non-premium channels.

[pk500]

So TV ratings and ticket sales must be pretty good?

Only the World Cup (soccer) and the Olympics have higher TV ratings worldwide among sports.

Do you have to subscribe to a pay service to watch F1 in Europe?

I don't believe so. Most European nations have F1 races on network TV. Correct me if I'm wrong, Adam. ITV is network, right?

I've seen plenty of football matches including ones months old televised but never seen an F1 race on non-premium channels.

CBS shows four of the 17 F1 races on network in the U.S. The rest are on Speed, a premium channel.

Take care,
PK

[Neckthai]

By CBS, PK meant FOX... CBS had them in years past. FOX showed four GPs in HD this year.

[GB_Simo]

Do you have to subscribe to a pay service to watch F1 in Europe?

I don't believe so. Most European nations have F1 races on network TV. Correct me if I'm wrong, Adam. ITV is network, right?

Correct. ITV is free-to-air, and while they sometimes show qualifying on one of their digital offshoots (ITV4 while the Rugby World Cup is on, for example), they're also free provided you buy yourself a Freeview receiver for about £20 or so. Bernie tried the F1 Digital PPV service in 2002, but it wasn't cheap and with a perfectly good free-to-air alternative, hardly anyone bothered to purchase it.

[pk500]

By CBS, PK meant FOX... CBS had them in years past. FOX showed four GPs in HD this year.

Correct you are! Thanks.

Take care,
PK

[fsquid]

"It will be interesting to see how they fit their transporter into the far end of the paddock next year," commented one team boss at the Belgian Grand Prix on Friday.

Can someone put that into American for me or German?

[sfz_T-car]

"It will be interesting to see how they fit their transporter into the far end of the paddock next year," commented one team boss at the Belgian Grand Prix on Friday.

Can someone put that into American for me or German?

There's a pecking order for garage & pit space that's based around placement in the Constructors' Championship. McLaren is behind Spyker now. That's probably a bigger issue at some tracks than others.

It's not like Juventus getting relegated to Serie B but it's an inconvenience for a team accustomed to being on the top of the food chain.

[pk500]

It's not like Juventus getting relegated to Serie B but it's an inconvenience for a team accustomed to being on the top of the food chain.

Especially when their mobile infield hospitality complex and team offices are a three-story building! It takes a crew of 20 nearly 45 hours to assemble it, then another 45 hours to dismantle it at each European-based F1 race.

A few pics of the McLaren hospitality unit in this gallery:

http://www.usgpindy.com/photo/gallery.p ... 2007-07-11

Take care,
PK

[GB_Simo]

Presumably, then, if McLaren aren't in this constructors championship any more, they'll receive nothing towards their travel expenses next year? The ruling must then guarantee Spyker and Toro Rosso receive a contribution towards expenses as part of a top-10 finish in the championship, must it not?

[fiore22]

By CBS, PK meant FOX... CBS had them in years past. FOX showed four GPs in HD this year.

And they looked beautiful in HD. Have been waiting for F1 in HD forever. Wish there were more!!!! As long as my Bob and Steve don't go anywhere!