pk500 wrote:Right. And you took what you perceived as a stupid comment by JackB1 and extended it to everyone in here who doesn't like rap. JackB1 doesn't like rap, so therefore all WASP's in here over 30 don't like it, either.
Your generalizing reply was just as ignorant as Jack's first post, if not more, because you're perpetuating the stereotype. So yes, I'm calling you on it.
The problem is, I'm not generalizing. You just don't like the fact that I'm right. This board is full of 30-something white guys who don't like rap. It's not necessarily even a bad thing. But that is what it is.
What, do you have alzheimer's or something? Don't you realize we do this thread every few months on this board?
No, it's not like groundhogs day...you f*ckers make it that way with your pointless threadjacks. Rap sucks...so what. I like it...some dont. Big f*ckin' deal.
dbdynsty25 wrote:No, it's not like groundhogs day...you f*ckers make it that way with your pointless threadjacks. Rap sucks...so what. I like it...some dont. Big f*ckin' deal.
Amen. Good perspective. The final word on this debate, as far as I'm concerned.
Plus I'm more than willing to perpetuate Kaz's mythical superiority complex by letting this portion of the thread die.
Back to the Beasties!
Take care,
PK
"You know why I love boxers? I love them because they face fear. And they face it alone." - Nick Charles
"First on the throttle, last on the brakes." - @MotoGP Twitter signature
dbdynsty25 wrote:No, it's not like groundhogs day...you f*ckers make it that way with your pointless threadjacks. Rap sucks...so what. I like it...some dont. Big f*ckin' deal.
Amen. Good perspective. The final word on this debate, as far as I'm concerned.
Take care,
PK
Very well. I'll save my retorts for the rap sucks thread for November...
Back to the Beastie Boys, I was actually a bit disappointed with the newest album. The only tracks I liked were "An Open Letter to NYC", "Time to Build", and "The Brouhaha". But maybe it will grow on me. I remember being worried when reading previews that the Beastie Boys were going to try and make a hip-hop album, but I don't know why people said that. It seems like a typical Beastie Boys album to me, meaning not fitting cleanly into one genre.
"Whatever, I don't know why you even play yourself to that degree,
you laugh at me?" - Del
Beastie Boys is on my list of best concerts ever as well. I saw them back in the day, but they killed it even back then.
"scratching records don't really qualify as "instruments".
Was it Jack who said this?!?!? Im one of those "scratch" dj's, and to say the turntable is not an instrument is wrong. So Im not a musician because my choice of "instruments" is the turntable?!?!?
Anyhow, Im not going to argue, but to each their own. My choice of instrument has brought me and my group, national championships, numerous internationial accolades, "work", numerous world championship berths, the chance to travel the world, and to perform alongside and share the same stage as other 'musicians' as Nelly Furtado, Doug E Fresh, Slum Village, the Alkaholiks... I could go on... Not bad for someone who doesnt play a real "instrument".
one,
d.
He should watch the documentary "Scratch"...then tell me two turn tables and a mixer isn't an instrument. My little brother is currently getting paid solid money for his abilities on the "instrument". He makes remixes for a record company. I guarentee he has spent more hours perfecting his craft than a large majority of "instrument playing" musicians. Its a true artform. I love the fact that I grew up in the 80's when rap took off. Back then, around where I grew up, you were persecuted if you liked rap. Now its THE music genre. I guess I was a trend setter in my suburban/rural area
The new album really went back to the Paul's Boutique days. You're right though, definitely not a genre defining album because it is so broad. I actually think this is their 2nd best album to PB. A definite plus in my book as PB is my favorite of all the Beastie's albums.
They are a little more outspoken to the world, politics, and stuff like that which kind of stands out. I'm sure it's because the guys are actually in their late 30's and they actually care about those types of things now, when back in the 80's, they cared about fighting for their right to party. A noticeable shift, but it still makes for a damn good album, lyrically and musically.
"Last disc I bought was Ultramagnetic MC's: Critical Beatdown. One of the top 10 HipHop albums of all time. My brother got me Eric B and Rakim's greatest hits this past Christmas...awesome. When I was in High School I went to about 4-5 rap concerts at the Spectrum in Philly. Public Enemy, Kid n Play, Big Daddy Kane, Run DMC, Digital Underground (technically I saw 2 Pac in concert because he was a dancer for D.U>) and a host of others. Man, those were the days. Outside of almost getting killed at the concerts they were highly entertaining. "
OH-KAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. I come out of the same "Golden Era" of rap. EPMD, KRS-ONE, Big Daddy Kane, Rakim, Slick Rick... Damn when you said UltraMagnetic, I damn near fell on the floor! I find myself listening to more rap from 1986-95. That's damn near the only thing in my CD player. Was listening to De La Soul's Stakes is High the other day, damn, the good old days
Waddupcouzin wrote:"Last disc I bought was Ultramagnetic MC's: Critical Beatdown. One of the top 10 HipHop albums of all time. My brother got me Eric B and Rakim's greatest hits this past Christmas...awesome. When I was in High School I went to about 4-5 rap concerts at the Spectrum in Philly. Public Enemy, Kid n Play, Big Daddy Kane, Run DMC, Digital Underground (technically I saw 2 Pac in concert because he was a dancer for D.U>) and a host of others. Man, those were the days. Outside of almost getting killed at the concerts they were highly entertaining. "
OH-KAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. I come out of the same "Golden Era" of rap. EPMD, KRS-ONE, Big Daddy Kane, Rakim, Slick Rick... Damn when you said UltraMagnetic, I damn near fell on the floor! I find myself listening to more rap from 1986-95. That's damn near the only thing in my CD player. Was listening to De La Soul's Stakes is High the other day, damn, the good old days
Damn those were the days. Thanks for the flashback fella's
Waddupcouzin wrote:"Last disc I bought was Ultramagnetic MC's: Critical Beatdown. One of the top 10 HipHop albums of all time. My brother got me Eric B and Rakim's greatest hits this past Christmas...awesome. When I was in High School I went to about 4-5 rap concerts at the Spectrum in Philly. Public Enemy, Kid n Play, Big Daddy Kane, Run DMC, Digital Underground (technically I saw 2 Pac in concert because he was a dancer for D.U>) and a host of others. Man, those were the days. Outside of almost getting killed at the concerts they were highly entertaining. "
OH-KAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. I come out of the same "Golden Era" of rap. EPMD, KRS-ONE, Big Daddy Kane, Rakim, Slick Rick... Damn when you said UltraMagnetic, I damn near fell on the floor! I find myself listening to more rap from 1986-95. That's damn near the only thing in my CD player. Was listening to De La Soul's Stakes is High the other day, damn, the good old days
My brother was at Big Daddy Kane's birthday party in Philly last week. His first album was dope (mid 80's rap expression for the old white guys here Me being one of them). Boogie Down Productions is priceless in my book. Their first 2 albums just were classic. I'll never forget when I found out about Scott La Rock's death. People like talking about 2 Pac's death...well Scott La Rocks death was huge back then. De La Soul still kills. I downloaded Ring Ring Ring the other day. The Jungle Bros. first album kicked ass. How bout this one...I've been bangin' the Black Sheep's "Wolf In Sheeps Clothing" in my car for a few days now. I love it. I'm from outside of Philly so I have a soft spot for Philly rap acts. Schooly D, Tuff Crew (their "Back to Wrek Shop" Album is in my top 3 all time), Krown Rulers, 3 Times Dope, Steady B are all favs of mine. I remember listening to Chubb Rocks's "Treat me Right" the whole week we were in the College WS back in '91. Everytime I hear it it makes me think of that week. That and a song called "Peach Fuzz" by KMD. Man, I'm old school
Anglo-Saxon - technically not...as far as I can trace, my family name came over with the Normans in about 1150. Please note, that does NOT make me French.
Protestant - nope, I'm an atheist.
And rap is still shite.
"The players come from all over the world, the money from deep underneath the Persian Gulf, but, as another, older City poster campaign put it, this is their city. They may now exist in the global spotlight, but they intend to keep it that way."
Man, being a rap/hip-hop fan is rough. I think it's right up there in genres of music that you have to immediately defend upon letting another person know that you're a fan of it (well, if you're 19 years old and up at least). Unfortunately guys like Lil' Jon aren't helping the situation too much for guys like me, db, etc. Kanye West is probably one of the best examples of a highly accessible rap act because he talks more about "Everyman" stuff much more than the average rapper (his CD is called The College Dropout which is a good start).
I must admit that the quality of good rap albums has declined as of late, especially if you don't have a good internet connection and you also don't have the time to dig through all of the junk to find the quality.
Lately I've been playing a lot of Common, The Roots' Tipping Point, Outkast, Talib Kweli, The Pharcyde, Death Cab for Cutie, the Shins, the Notwist, Sigur Ros, and The Postal Service. I find diversity is key or I'll ultimately get too bored of any one musical genre.
BTW PK, have you listened to Sigur Ros' Ba Ba Ti Ki Di Do? It's good stuff if you haven't and damn do I ever hate having to type that title.
"Kanye West is probably one of the best examples of a highly accessible rap act because he talks more about "Everyman" stuff much more than the average rapper "
Thing is, for me, it's not about what they say that makes me like/dislike it. The music itself, regardless of the actual lyrics, has to grab me first, then I'll consider what they are saying. Of the RAP I've listened to up until now, I never get to the point of caring about the lyrics, as I simply don't like the actual music.
Every now and then I revisit the genre, trying to see if I can get into it (always trying to expand) but as of yet I have not been able to.
James_E wrote:"Kanye West is probably one of the best examples of a highly accessible rap act because he talks more about "Everyman" stuff much more than the average rapper "
Thing is, for me, it's not about what they say that makes me like/dislike it. The music itself, regardless of the actual lyrics, has to grab me first, then I'll consider what they are saying. Of the RAP I've listened to up until now, I never get to the point of caring about the lyrics, as I simply don't like the actual music.
Every now and then I revisit the genre, trying to see if I can get into it (always trying to expand) but as of yet I have not been able to.
Ah, I see... The Roots would probably be the natural point to start with if you like traditional instruments. Although I'm sure that you can get your groove on with 50 Cent's "In The Club" quite easily, as I'm sure that's what you're looking for.
I'm as white as Wonder Bread, and I lean toward guitar solos over turntable scratches, but even I've gotten into a couple hip hop acts. I really like DJ Shadow's work, and I also just bought The Streets "A Grand Don't Come for Free," which is fantastic. Granted, both of those guys are white, but I appreciate what they're doing as for as composing new music out of previous samples. DJ Shadow's "Endtroducing" is particularly brilliant, one of my favorite CDs.
A lot of rap music is crap, but a lot of music in general is crap. I don't think the poop-to-gold ratio is worse for rap than other genres of music.
The funny thing here is that people say different types of music are sh*t all the time (country music is sh*t, 90’s pop is sh*t, boy bands are sh*t), but the arguments and aggression only seem to happen when someone says that Rap music is sh*t. It seems like people really feel like they have to defend their love of rap music. I am NOT talking about just here at DSP, this is a more general statement from MY experience, but is it showing up here. It is just an interesting observation.
I am a musician. I play the ‘gee-tar’, sing and write a ton of music. I grew up on rock & metal. I also like rap music. Is that okay?
At this point my rap collection consists of a few Outkast CD’s, a couple Wu Tang Clan, N.W.A, Public Enemy and Eminem CD’s, all the Beastie Boys CD’s, and maybe one or two others. I know it is pretty mainstream stuff, but to me it is very entertaining.
Not exactly sure what I am trying to say here…just thought I should chime in.
I think more people have to defend rap because it's attacked the most...by far. It's simple threads like this one: I liked a concert, but half the people that responded to my post didn't inquire about the concert, they just went on to say that rap music sucks. It's the contant annoying criticizm that has ticked off the hardcore or casual rap fan over the years and it's just never ending.
I bet if you look at the Billboard charts, Rap will consist of around half of the top 100. Can you say that about any other genre? Where are all the other people who listen to rap to put the albums up on that list? I have a feeling a lot of people that would normally defend it, stay quiet because of the social implications of being a 'rap fan', whatever those may be.
It's because all those other genres have "musicians" playing instruments to make music. Maybe the star only sings but there is a band behind that star that practiced for years to play what they do.
Talking fast and rhyming over a CD playing is not what I call talent or music.
I would not consider myself a rap music fan but then again I wouldn't consider myself a fan of any type of music outright. I'm just a fan of music. I can find something to like in every genre of music out there. I've been in bands that play different types of music and I even collaborated with a local rap group here and wrote the hook to one of their songs and laid down the vocals for the hook myself.
The reason rap music gets such a hard rap (pun intended) is because of the image that is portrayed and the lifestyle they describe and glorify. This is obviously not every rap group, but most of the mainstream rap artists do. That sh!t doesn't bother me at all but the same thing happened with rock n roll back in the day.
It's just music guys, who gives a f*#k if somebody doesn't like it? Does it really bother you that much that some white guy who's pushing 40 doesn't like it? Does it bother you that some black guy who's pushing 40 doesn't like it? Rap music is like any other kind of music, not everybody is going to like it.
By the way, Blackie and the boys rule. Any band that comes up with a song called Animal (I F#$k like a Beast) you've gotta love. Or do you?
I am a patient boy.
I wait, I wait, I wait, I wait.
My time is water down a drain.
Apparently you haven't read this whole thread LS...
The Roots and the Beasties are the biggest and best examples of rappers who actually play a lot of their music. Rarely do you find a track from one of them two that hasn't been produced by themselves playing the instruments. Blanket rap statements are idiotic. Welcome to the JackB Club.
laurenskye wrote:It's because all those other genres have "musicians" playing instruments to make music. Maybe the star only sings but there is a band behind that star that practiced for years to play what they do.
Talking fast and rhyming over a CD playing is not what I call talent or music.
My opinion.
So acapella is not music then since it there are no instruments being played? You are certainly entitled to your opinion, just as everybody is. It's simply some opinions are more predictable on this board than others. There are are of course rap groups that have live music being played behind them. But just some plain old good rapping over a beat whether it be a human beat box, a drum machine, or what have can you still can qualify as good music imo. I can't believe this thread won't die. What a silly argument. If you aren't convinced that rap is "music" then you never will be so what's the point of "discussing" it.
http://www.whas11.com/sharedcontent/VideoPlayer/videoPlayer.php?vidId=49293&catId=49
---Lend a ***** a pencil--- Context?
Talking is not a musician
pushing buttons on a drum machine is not a musician
Writing lyrics down for you or someone else to use is not a musician
Singing is musical
playing an instrument is musical
On License To Ill they give credit to a guitar player. Maybe they learned to play later in their carreer. If they do play then I would consider that part music.
You're right, it was a blanket statment, because the world rap to me means talking over "music", whether that "music" is a band or a cd or a drum machine or a beat boxer.
But what if the 'music' that they are talking over is made by them with real life instruments like drums and gee-tars and pianos and sh*t? Is that still not music in your mind? There is a crapload of music out there that doesn't use any type of voice or singing at all. Is that not considered music in your book as well?
I can definitely say that the Beasties took up the music about the time Pauls Boutique came out because that's when they started using instrumentals and whatnot. Their first albums was void of real instrument play compared to everything after.
Ring Ring Ring the other day. The Jungle Bros. first album kicked ass. How bout this one...I've been bangin' the Black Sheep's "Wolf In Sheeps Clothing" in my car for a few days now. I love it. I'm from outside of Philly so I have a soft spot for Philly rap acts. Schooly D, Tuff Crew (their "Back to Wrek Shop" Album is in my top 3 all time), Krown Rulers, 3 Times Dope, Steady B are all favs of mine. I remember listening to Chubb Rocks's "Treat me Right" the whole week we were in the College WS back in '91. Everytime I hear it it makes me think of that week. That and a song called "Peach Fuzz" by KMD. Man, I'm old school 
