NFL2K# issues that bother me

JJdog · Post by **JJdog** » Sat Aug 24, 2002 1:20 am

1. Drops. I have not had one game where I didn´t have double digits in drops. I had one game where Chad Lewis had 7 drops alone. I wouldn´t have a big a problem with it if it applied to the CPU teams but it doesn´t seem to. It also not due to the ratings. I´ve used wide receivers with 90 ratings who drop more than CPU teams with no receiver rated over 70 something.
 
 2. No Sacks. I´ve played almost a entire season (using the Eagles)and have not gotten 1 sack. I´ve used other teams as well with the same result. Again this is not the case for the CPU. They have Defensive lineman fly 5 yards or more to get a sack or hit the QB before he can it off. AMOF, if you watch the replays of some of the hits as the ball is being released there is no contact. The defender is sometimes a good yard or 2 away.
 
 3. Defensive backs with more hops and hangtime than Michael Jordan or David Thompson ever had. Again seems like a CPU advantage.
 
 4. Camera view sucks for passing. If your WR´s run any slants or outs, you´re just guessing that your open cause you can´t see them. The Pass Play zoom out zoom´s out to far. It makes it hard to see those Olympic diver defensive lineman coming at you.
 
 5. Weird stats. Example, I played a game where McNabb was 9 for 21 passing. But when you look at the receiving stats they had a total of 14 drops!!!! I also had games where it said that a CPU WR had 10 drops during the game and had only 2 on his franchise stats after game. I don´t know maybe a bobble is considered a drop during the game.
 
 I´ve got more issues but I´m tired of typing. By the way I have Madden 2003 for X-Box as well and that has things that piss me off as well. To tell the truth, I think all these companys put to much cheap crap in the games that you don´t control to make the games appear to be competitive.

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Sat Aug 24, 2002 11:43 am

JJ:
 
 Itemized deductions:
 
 >>>1. Drops. I have not had one game where I didn´t have double digits in drops. I had one game where Chad Lewis had 7 drops alone. I wouldn´t have a big a problem with it if it applied to the CPU teams but it doesn´t seem to. It also not due to the ratings. I´ve used wide receivers with 90 ratings who drop more than CPU teams with no receiver rated over 70 something.<<<
 
 I´ve played games in monsoons with fewer than six drops total. Are you running a lot of hook and comeback patterns? If so, are you throwing just as the receiver turns? If your receiver is stationary, waiting for the ball to arrive, he will get popped, just like in the NFL. The key is to hit receivers in stride. Plus you can always make slider adjustments. But I haven´t needed to make any, and I´m seeing realistic numbers of drops.
 
 >>>2. No Sacks. I´ve played almost a entire season (using the Eagles)and have not gotten 1 sack. I´ve used other teams as well with the same result. Again this is not the case for the CPU. They have Defensive lineman fly 5 yards or more to get a sack or hit the QB before he can it off. AMOF, if you watch the replays of some of the hits as the ball is being released there is no contact. The defender is sometimes a good yard or 2 away.<<<
 
 Sacks are tough. But here are a few suggestions. First, blitz more often. Second, take control of a defensive lineman and shift the line before the snap. Then use the triggers and the Y button (Xbox) to activate a special move by the defensive lineman. You´ll get through and put pressure on the QB and get some sacks. Sacks are not earned by divine right -- you need to run the correct defensive package and work at it. On the offensive side of the ball, roll out your QB when he´s under pressure. That will help avoid sacks. Also run shorter patterns and three-step-drop plays. That will get the ball in the air faster.
 
 >>>3. Defensive backs with more hops and hangtime than Michael Jordan or David Thompson ever had. Again seems like a CPU advantage.<<<
 
 Not seeing this at all. If anything, I think my computer-controlled DB´s are better than the CPU team´s backs.
 
 >>>4. Camera view sucks for passing. If your WR´s run any slants or outs, you´re just guessing that your open cause you can´t see them. The Pass Play zoom out zoom´s out to far. It makes it hard to see those Olympic diver defensive lineman coming at you.<<<
 
 Agreed. It is tough. But Olympic diver defensive linemen? Funny line -- but not true.
 
 >>>5. Weird stats. Example, I played a game where McNabb was 9 for 21 passing. But when you look at the receiving stats they had a total of 14 drops!!!! I also had games where it said that a CPU WR had 10 drops during the game and had only 2 on his franchise stats after game. I don´t know maybe a bobble is considered a drop during the game.<<<
 
 Haven´t paid much attention to this. Sorry.
 
 In summary, NFL 2K3 is the most challenging console football game I´ve played. Anyone weaned on Madden will find this game to be a b*tch.
 
 The only football game I´ve played that was close to this difficult was NFL 2K1 on the upper two skill levels. But I thought the CPU was tough there because of what felt like cheap AI. NFL 2K3 is tough because you have to think and adapt on almost every play, not because of cheap AI.
 
 Take care,
 PK

JJdog · Post by **JJdog** » Sat Aug 24, 2002 2:15 pm

>>I´ve played games in monsoons with fewer than six drops total. Are you running a lot of hook and comeback patterns? If so, are you throwing just as the receiver turns? If your receiver is stationary, waiting for the ball to arrive, he will get popped, just like in the NFL. The key is to hit receivers in stride. Plus you can always make slider adjustments. But I haven´t needed to make any, and I´m seeing realistic numbers of drops.
 
 I never use hook or comeback patterns. 90% of the time I use either crossing, post or slant patterns. Most of the drops are when hitting receiver in stride. But it seems if they can´t take at least one step after they catch it they drop it if they get touched. And I´m talking single coverage. There are plenty of times when it just hits the guys in the hands while open and they drop it. Alot of times it just appears that the game just decides that you are not going to catch it period. No one can deny that this has been a problem with every 2K game.
 
 >>> Sacks are tough. But here are a few suggestions. First, blitz more often. Second, take control of a defensive lineman and shift the line before the snap. Then use the triggers and the Y button (Xbox) to activate a special move by the defensive lineman. You´ll get through and put pr...
 
 All of that is cool but if the ratings are true for the players I shouldn´t have to even control the lineman if I don´t want to to a get a sack. My team should be able to get at least 1 over the course of a season. I even tried a experiment where I traded for the leading sacker half way through the season. I didn´t control him at all and he didn´t get one for me. And some of those games were against some seriously out matched (according to the ratings) offensive lines. I watch alot of the replays and CPU doesn´t have any where near as much difficulty getting pressure on me even when the ratings are in my favor.
 
 >>>Not seeing this at all. If anything, I think my computer-controlled DB´s are better than the CPU team´s backs.
 
 I´ve seen quite a few instances were the DB was over 5 yards in front of the WR. Totally beaten by the receiver Leap well before the ball was in the area. Hang in the air longer than humanly possible and tip or intercept it. And before you say it , yes the ball was lobbed.
 
 >>> But Olympic diver defensive linemen? Funny line -- but not true
 
 The replays from my games say it is so. I suggest you take a look at some, especially when you aren´t sacked but the contact affects the flight of the ball.
 
 >>>In summary, NFL 2K3 is the most challenging console football game I´ve played. Anyone weaned on Madden will find this game to be a b*tch. The only football game I´ve played that was close to this difficult was NFL 2K1 on the upper two skill levels. But I thought the CPU was tough there because of what felt like cheap AI. NFL 2K3 is tough because you have to think and adapt on almost every play, not because of cheap AI.
 
 The only thing that I´ve been weaned on is cheap crappy AI programing. I´ve played every (and I do mean every from Tecmo to Front Page to every Sega and EA and then some) football game there is and none them can make a game that is COMPETITIVE without being cheap. Notice I did not say difficult. Even with the drops and no sacks, I haven´t lost a game on the PRO setting. But it still pisses me off the number of 3rd down holding calls or drop passes or CPU teams becoming superhuman out of nowhere and my players forgetting how to play. Ratings that seem to have some but not lot of bearing on the game (I check the ratings of the opposing players before and during every game) play. I also shouldn´t have to adjust sliders to get a good game of football it´s the game companies job to make a good game not me. If they spent half as much time as they on graphics candy(for example, who cares about seeing the players faces in the helmets) we´d have some serious games.
 
 I´m hoping that what I perceive as cheapness is evened out on the online playing. Some games still have some of it when playing head to head but I haven´t been able to get me 15 year old son to play me in NFL2K3 yet so I can´t tell anything about this one. He ´s a Madden guy and hates the NFL2K series ever since the first one. He´s even played me( he got dogged by the way) in the new NFL fever but won´t play 2K3. I should be able to let you know something soon since I got accepted for the Microsoft Online Beta program.
 
 Hope I didn´t come on to strong and don´t take any of my comments personally. Opinions are like assholes, everybodys got one : ) . To tell the truth I´d really like to know what some of the actual NFL players really think of these games. Ones not paid paid by the game companies that is. That would be interesting.
 
 Jeff

pk500 · Post by **pk500** » Sat Aug 24, 2002 2:50 pm

Jeff:
 
 Interesting post. Not too strong at all, and I don´t take any of this stuff personally.
 
 Keep both barrels blazing! <IMG SRC="images/forum/icons/icon_smile.gif">
 
 Again, I´ve seen such a variety of criticisms of NFL 2K3 on the Net -- too many drops, not too many drops; hard to run, easy to run; hard to pass, easy to pass; slow framerate, just fine, etc. -- that I think many of the issues are user-related. I know I complained about many of the above issues until I became accustomed to the game or realized the majority of the problem was me, not the game.
 
 No game is perfect, but NFL 2K3 is the best console football game I´ve played in quite a few years.
 
 Love them or not, sliders are here to stay in games. I like them because they allow you to tailor the style of game to your liking and also ensure a competitive balance even though some consider that "cheating."
 
 Name me the last sports sim with perfect AI out of the box, with no sliders needed. I can think of two: Colin McRae Rally 2.0 for the PSX and F355 for the Dreamcast. I would need to think long and hard for any others.
 
 Take care,
 PK

Templehorn · Post by **Templehorn** » Sat Aug 24, 2002 5:50 pm

Practice catching to releive drops. I had a lot of drops in the beginning when I got the game but now I may only have 1 or 2 a game. Remember to catch the ball, not have the cpu do it as in other games which you may be accustomed to. Control the reciever and catch the ball.
 
 
 ´Alot of times it just appears that the game just decides that you are not going to catch it period´
 
 No that is madden you are talking about. In 2k3, almost everything is based on the player skill, so go to practice mode and practice catching the ball. If you stick with this game, in 1 week you won´t even remember complaining about dropped passes.
 
 
 ´Some games still have some of it when playing head to head but I haven´t been able to get me 15 year old son to play me in NFL2K3 yet so I can´t tell anything about this one.´
 
 Well this game is more in depth than madden and if you kid likes madden then that may be the perfect game for him. In 2k3, you can´t just throw 20-30 yard passes all the time or have time to do qb 20 step dropbacks. You got to remember 2k3 is a thinking man´s football game, more of a diehard football/coach kind of game, where madden is more causual. If you enjoy pick up and play, go with madden, but if you want to be challanged, nfl2k3 will offer you a challange. [ This message was edited by: Templehorn on 24-08-2002 14:56 ]