XBox One AND PS4 Discussion

[Wilk5280]

I know some of you see this as MS cowering to the loud minority, but that certainly can't be the case. There is absolutely no reason they would do a 180 when it comes to their DRM and 24 hour check-in policies if metrics didn't show it was hurting their business monetarily. Maybe it's an overreaction by them, but they came out of E3 looking like crap. A lot of that isn't even because of their policies, but more-so a credit to their poor communication and arrogant attitude toward them.

Instead of showing the positives of these features, their answer to valid concerns is "we have a 360 for that" and other snarky comments along those lines. Even if their intent wasn't to be arrogant they came across that way and perception is reality.

I don't see how gamers lose here by MS pulling these out. If you want digital distribution it's there for you. If you want physical media, the ability to loan and sell your games that's there for you now, too. I don't see how anyone can think MS doing this is a bad thing for gamers.

I will say that it makes them appear that they have no clue how to handle the success they've earned this current generation. But then again, looking back through gaming history what company has?

[dbdynsty25]

I know some of you see this as MS cowering to the loud minority, but that certainly can't be the case. There is absolutely no reason they would do a 180 when it comes to their DRM and 24 hour check-in policies if metrics didn't show it was hurting their business monetarily.

Pretty sure they just saw that the PS4 was trouncing them in pre-orders, which was the opposite last gen, and then got scared. It's ALWAYS about money.

[RobVarak]

Regardless of the merits of either system, it's going to be interesting to see if MS can pull of the PR needed for damage control. They've been utterly slaughtered in the post-announcement geekisphere, and that's not going to change without some serious marketing kung-fu.

Well that is some black belt stuff today, for sure.

[XXXIV]

Regardless of the merits of either system, it's going to be interesting to see if MS can pull of the PR needed for damage control. They've been utterly slaughtered in the post-announcement geekisphere, and that's not going to change without some serious marketing kung-fu.

Well that is some black belt stuff today, for sure.

Biggest 180 since New Coke.

[btmmayor]

I think it's a stupid thing to do, to bend to what amounts to irrational emotion-based reactions.

You don't think Microsoft is paying attention to the preorder numbers at GameStop, Amazon, Best Buy, New Egg, etc?

[Danimal]

This feature is now gone from what I understand.

Here is what is gone based on what I can decipher

1. If you buy a physical disc now you can't play it anywhere without the disc.
2. If you buy digitally now you can play it anywhere via the cloud (although I assume this means you need to install it on another system just like Steam)
3. The sharing feature is gone for launch. This implies they will look to bring it back somehow.

So people who want to buy stuff digitally on day one without a disc are only losing the sharing feature. Something I will point out we had no idea how it worked. Because if people think they were going to buy the next Halo and then 9 of their friends could play the same copy they were on crack.

[vader29]

Well at least Francis is happy now.

[Danimal]

It's not all party hats and hand jobs as if that fat f*** ever got a hand job he didn't deliver.

[XXXIV]

Well at least Francis is happy now.

"WE DID IT!" ....but..."Its not all party hats and hand jobs"


Hes happy, Im happy. Now I just pray that GTA doesnt get delayed again.

[Naples39]

I think it's a stupid thing to do, to bend to what amounts to irrational emotion-based reactions.

You don't think Microsoft is paying attention to the preorder numbers at GameStop, Amazon, Best Buy, New Egg, etc?

Couldn't you say that a lot of the preorders are being made irrational emotion-based reactions due to internet hysteria?


I just think it's this simple;

Before we had product A and product B. Product A was the same old same old. Product B was a new model, with pros and cons which aren't entirely clear yet. I personally was going to sit on the sidelines for a while before investing in product B, but I thought it could very well prove to be a superior product.

Now we have product A1 and product A2, both of which will conform to the same old. While some pros of the former product B might survive, many will not.

I much preferred scenario one. We'll never know what product B could've been because the knee-jerk reaction was so deafening that they had to shut it down before it ever started. This is a product/service that no has even used yet, let alone allowed to mature. I think that's sad.

[XXXIV]

I much preferred scenario one. We'll never know what product B could've been because the knee-jerk reaction was so deafening that they had to shut it down before it ever started. This is a product/service that no has even used yet, let alone allowed to mature. I think that's sad.

Agree with this much. I also wanted to see how it all played out.

[WillHunting]

I doubt Microsoft did this to appease consumers. I bet the publishers were not happy dealing with 2 different ways of publishing games, so they would likely go with the (early) winner of PS4, which would leave Xbone in the dust without 3rd party support. That's a more likely scenario.

I might get one down the line when it drops prices a couple of times. I still don't like the Kinect requirement and wary of MS' policies change.

[webdanzer]

Now to me, personally, PS4 is merely the better choice rather than the only choice.

Why is it the better choice? What sets it apart?

Same things I'm sure you've heard elsewhere, but:

->More powerful system, for

->$100 less, with

->More exclusives that I am interested in. (Though not overwhelmingly so on this last point)

Pretty much common sense stuff for one looking for something to play games on.

I also don't like the forced Kinect. Yes, I don't see why I should have to plop a camera and mic in my living room because MS says so, but mainly I just don't like the alternate controls. To me, pressing a button is simply more convenient than waving arms or speaking in most situations. I guess many of you have had better Kinect experiences than I did, but at best, I'd say the first version of it is 'moderately to frequently' responsive. I want more than that for my gaming interface. I also am at the room limit size for most games, and usually operate in a background of lots of noise, or none at all, the latter times also requiring me to stay silent as well.

It's just not for me, environment or playstyle wise.

[Wilk5280]

Naples,
You only have MS to be upset with. The early adopting consumer has been speaking with their wallet and early indications show that people, myself included, don't want what MS was offering. If MS truly believed it was a business model that would succeed they wouldn't do a 180 and look as clueless and foolish as they do right now.

It's almost as if they are saying "just jokes everyone. You didn't think we were serious did you?!?"

I mean think about this. They defended their policies vehemently and now all of a sudden they're going back on it. It's obvious people don't want it. Whatever numbers they're looking at obviously don't favor their model.

[webdanzer]

I know some of you see this as MS cowering to the loud minority, but that certainly can't be the case. There is absolutely no reason they would do a 180 when it comes to their DRM and 24 hour check-in policies if metrics didn't show it was hurting their business monetarily.

Pretty sure they just saw that the PS4 was trouncing them in pre-orders, which was the opposite last gen, and then got scared. It's ALWAYS about money.

Yeah, I think the most conservative reports were the multi-platforms going PS4 by 3-2.

[Zeppo]

So people who want to buy stuff digitally on day one without a disc are only losing the sharing feature.

Not true. The benefit of having all the same features for a physical disc based game as for a downloaded game, such as play anywhere and instant swapping and sharing and who knows what else, would have been combined with the ability to share or trade in such a disc, albeit in a limited manner, but an ability to do so nonetheless.

So I could have bought a disc for a game and still had all the promised features, the same as a downloaded game. And I could have traded in my physical disc to amazon or GameStop etc who would have agreed to work with MS as Kings described, and recouped some trade in value. Or I could have given that game disc to a friend, the only limitation being that it be a friend recognized by MS as a friend, a pretty small hurdle for me to hop over.

Now, these two sets of benefits are completely separated. I now have to choose between having a "play anywhere" and instant swappable game vs having the ability to trade in a game for some money or in my case amazon gift card balance, or to give a game to a friend.

I'm losing on both ends, if only because I have to decide before I buy if I'm going to want to hot-swap the game, going to want to play it at both of my gaming locations without having to worry about forgetting the disc, or on the other hand hedge my bets that I might want to trade the game in early enough to get meaningful value for it, or have the option to give it to a friend when I'm done with it. I'd rather not to have had to make that choice.

[Inuyasha]

Big news. Put xb1 back on the map for me.

Teal will now be able to rebuy rdr2 10 times on xb1 now

[Macca00]

Big news. Put xb1 back on the map for me.

Teal will now be able to rebuy rdr2 10 times on xb1 now

LOL

EDIT: Though....it's my understanding (and what do I know because I think you need to have a PhD in cryptology to figure out what the hell is going on with the XBOX ONE ecosystem before and after today) he still could have done that with the old system, except only from Gamestop and BB and not Ebay or a mom and pop store.

[Inuyasha]

MS should offer a console only package without kinect for $399/$449.

Sell the standard one with kinect for $499 and include all XB360 kinect games free over the cloud. Or at least first party MS kinect games.

[Naples39]

Naples,
You only have MS to be upset with. The early adopting consumer has been speaking with their wallet and early indications show that people, myself included, don't want what MS was offering. If MS truly believed it was a business model that would succeed they wouldn't do a 180 and look as clueless and foolish as they do right now.

It's almost as if they are saying "just jokes everyone. You didn't think we were serious did you?!?"

I mean think about this. They defended their policies vehemently and now all of a sudden they're going back on it. It's obvious people don't want it. Whatever numbers they're looking at obviously don't favor their model.

I'm not upset with anyone, I just think it's a sad state of affairs.

MS is making a prudent business decision. I already said they have no duty to risk huge losses to usher in a new model. But the reason MS is having to abandon this project before it began is because of an avalanche of backlash (likely directly manifesting in the pre-order disparity).

I have no problem with people voting with their wallets--that's how the market works. I just think the current vehement sentiment against DRM is based on paranoia, half-information, and entitlement. Half-information is MS's own fault, but I think it's short-sighted and closed-minded thinking of many in the gaming community to be so resolutely against a product no has even used.

If it turned out to a bad service that offered poor value it deserves to die, but it also deserved to be born first.

[Diablo25]

If it turned out to a bad service that offered poor value it deserves to die, but it also deserved to be born first.

Absolutely agree.

[WillHunting]

If it turned out to a bad service that offered poor value it deserves to die, but it also deserved to be born first.

Absolutely agree.

I agree as well, I would have enjoyed watching XB1 die.

[Danimal]

Same things I'm sure you've heard elsewhere, but:

->More powerful system, for

->$100 less, with

->More exclusives that I am interested in. (Though not overwhelmingly so on this last point)

Well the more powerful system stuff to me is irrelevant. I believe the PS3 was more powerful then the 360 no? How did that work out?

$100 less can't argue with that. The kinnect, which I am in full agreement with you on is the culprit. I don't want it either for all the reasons you mentioned.

Exclusives is where we differ, although doesn't matter because I will own both. I can't even recall a single PS4 exclusive outside of Killzone from E3 where MS had several that were more appealing to me.

Plus MS still has a better online system in Live then anything Sony has done thus far. I'd like to see what they offer for PS4, will they have party chat? What are they going to do from an online perspective. If you're going to charge people to play games online now you need to offer similar features.

[Teal]

So MS should treat the Kinect like the Sega CD add on, eh?


....aaaaaand how well did THAT work out?

It makes much more sense to create the core unit without add-ons that splinter the market.

Of course, that's unless you're afraid the boogie man is watching you through the camera all the time, and is secretly devising a plot to take over your brain, steal your girlfriend, kill your dog, and send the black helicopters to transport you to the mothership...

[Macca00]

If it turned out to a bad service that offered poor value it deserves to die, but it also deserved to be born first.

You don't believe in Microsoft's right to choose? Wait....what the hell are we talking about here? lol



All stupidity aside, as someone who likes collecting and playing games on old systems (just this weekend I was playing the copy of Tecmo Super Shot Soccer I got off Ebay for the Playstation - a game I've wanted to play for something like a decade) I'm kinda happy that 15 years from now, whenever Microsoft shut down their XBOX ONE servers because they've moved onto the next two iterations of XBOX, I'll still be able to play games I've bought this fall. I know that makes me an edge case and I know eventually everything will move to an online DRM-secured future, but I still like the idea that my money buys me a physical copy of a game rather than a license to play it. Of course, I'm a hypocrite because many (but not all, most people forget this) Steam games are the same with regards to DRM but if a game is available on Steam vs. GoG I always go with the GoG version.