matthewk wrote:Which game would you say does the better job of translating the guitar parts from what you would expect to play on a real guitar to the game? I know that 5 buttons can't accurately replace six strngs and frets, but in general I felt that the charts in GH3 made sense to what you would expect on a real guitar, other than the limited number of chords.
Unlike the drum experiences, I don't think either game's guitar experience really offers much in the way of verisimilitude. But your question has been hotly debated across internet forums for some time now. I think they are probably about equal. GH has many more mult finger requirements, but RB has your hand moving up and down the neck closer to what the true performace delivers. (Harmonix supposedly tries to capture that.)
I've only ever poked at a real guitar enough to play a handful of chords, though. So I can't really tell you by personal experience. My fingertips are as smooth as a baby's bottom...
JackB1 wrote:
That post was regarding the PS3 version. My question was regarding the 360 version.
Ah, I apologize for not being clear there. I'm playing on the 360, but I can see how you'd assume it was ps3 given the warning of the compatibility issue I mentioned the paragraph before. Sorry!
No problems with rb1 drums on the 360.
JackB1 wrote:
Just to clarify...you are playing the GHWT game (drum parts) using your
RB1 drums? And this is on the 360?
Teal wrote:I have discovered one problem with the drums...
...I have nowhere to store them. Other than that...no problem. I've got them kinda shoved into my entertainment center, but it's not the best fit. The damned main section is bulky!
I like the way the kit (and cymbals) can be lowered. It fits behind my sofa out of sight...
matthewk wrote:Which game would you say does the better job of translating the guitar parts from what you would expect to play on a real guitar to the game? I know that 5 buttons can't accurately replace six strngs and frets, but in general I felt that the charts in GH3 made sense to what you would expect on a real guitar, other than the limited number of chords.
Hey Matt, here is what I was thinking of when I answered you originally. Penny-Arcade linked to this blog post that talked about how Harmonix makes their charts:
I talked with a Harmonix staffer about the process, and I was surprised to learn that the most important factor in the process is musicianship. The people responsible for note tracking, she told me, aim to reproduce the way that the song is played on a real guitar to the greatest extent possible within the confines of the guitar controller's limited repertoire of moves. If, in the real guitar, you would produce a sequence chords by keeping your index finger planted on a higher fret and moving your fingers on the lower frets, the note-trackers will mimic this hand movement on the guitar controller using the fret buttons. The same goes for passages that call for a guitar player to slide his hand up and down the neck of the guitar. She also told me another detail: the various chords on a guitar often have more than one set of fingerings, and a guitar player will usually choose among them based on the chords that surround them in that chord progression. The same line of thinking informs making the tracks in-game when the audio team works up a in-game note chart.
Nozzleman 216 just told me, as we were playing online, that the setup of the GH drums isn't quite conducive to RB2, at least on the highest levels. Guess I can see that, given that the yellow marker is on a raised cymbal, and he said that the yellow is a tom-is that right? Anyway, it's definitely do-able, but the ergonomics are different, so bear that in mind.
I won't get much above medium difficulty anytime soon on drums, so I don't think it'll make much difference to me there.
Jack, I simply LOVE the drums. Spooky, I'm playing on an area rug that tightly woven, and the velcro stuff on the bottom of the pedal absolutely cements my pedal to the floor. I have to practically 'rip' the pedal up when I'm done.
I'm very happy with my purchase. The new guitar neck is longer than the les Paul of GHIII, and it has had an unforseeable effect. I'm actually having to reprogram muscle memory to accomodate the longer neck. The buttons are slightly further down from where they were on the Les Paul, and I'm missing some notes that I wouldn't have before. Just going to have to re-learn, I suppose, but it's worth it-the new guitar is excellent.
webdanzer wrote:Can anyone confirm that GHWT gives you points based on each pad strike for drum fills?! I just read this, but hadn't noticed it myself.
That means higher scores for people who load up all of their fills with speed rolls, I guess.
Thanks Web. Your answers and the link really helped.
Now I have to try and figure out what combination of games & instruments to get. I only have a Wii, but I'd like to get instruments I can use across both game brands. I read that the GHWT drums will work in RB2, but RB2 isn't scheduled to come out until the end of December. I also don't really want to get another guitar when I have th GHIII one.
Maybe I'll exchhange one of my TRU 3 for 2 games for the GHWT game, pick up a USB mic, and then wait for the GH drums to come out by themselves.
So yesterday I did a direct comparison with both GH adn RB using both drum kits.
GH drums work well on RB but do require a slightly different approach becasue of the yellow cymbal. I tried out some Rush somgs on expert to see how I faired. I was able to pass them but it was not as easy as using the RB kit.
Now for the RB kit on GH...Tthey work very well. It's incredible that they charted all of the tracks for this kit. So for the tracks I tired seemed like a fine translation. It's just not quite as fun as pllaying it with the GH kit and the 'cymbals'.
I just can't decide yet which one I am going to stick with. It would be an easy decision if the cymbals and the overall feel of the GH kit (minus the damn foot pedal) was not so outstanding. If the GH felt mediocre than i would stay with the RB drums for sure as they probably translate overall slightly better.
I'll see if I can get the hang of playing RB with the GH drums more and fix the foot pedal from sliding on me.
matthewk wrote:Thanks Web. Your answers and the link really helped.
Now I have to try and figure out what combination of games & instruments to get. I only have a Wii, but I'd like to get instruments I can use across both game brands. I read that the GHWT drums will work in RB2, but RB2 isn't scheduled to come out until the end of December. I also don't really want to get another guitar when I have th GHIII one.
Maybe I'll exchhange one of my TRU 3 for 2 games for the GHWT game, pick up a USB mic, and then wait for the GH drums to come out by themselves.
There seems to be some consensus that if you were going into both games cold but wanted to play them both and get the best compatibility while still having access to the most unique features of both games (all instruments) would be to get the RB2 full kit (or drums&game) and the GHWT guitar package. As Teal said, the GHWT drum set has some issues with RB as far as pad positioning goes, so the RB2 drum kit seems to be the best bet for good, compatible drum play on both platforms (though you may want to get the cymbal add-ons when they are released), while the GHWT guitar works well on both and you can make use of all of the new features like the slide and the touchpad on GHWT.
Since I'm still on the basic RB1 package, I'm a little envious of those just getting into the game who have access to all the new bells and whistles, but I can't justify spending quite a bit of dough when I'm pretty happy with the performance of my current plastic.
Spooky wrote:
I just can't decide yet which one I am going to stick with. It would be an easy decision if the cymbals and the overall feel of the GH kit (minus the damn foot pedal) was not so outstanding. If the GH felt mediocre than i would stay with the RB drums for sure as they probably translate overall slightly better.
When I upgrade, I'm probably going to go for the RB2 kit with the added Cymbal pads.
webdanzer wrote:
Since I'm still on the basic RB1 package, I'm a little envious of those just getting into the game who have access to all the new bells and whistles, but I can't justify spending quite a bit of dough when I'm pretty happy with the performance of my current plastic.
I'm in the same boat. I still have a perfectly working set of RB1 drums and GH3 w/ wireless Les Paul. It's nice to know I can buy RB2 AND GHWT and still be able to use my drums and guitar on either. I think I'm just going to pick up the RB2 game and the GHWT game only. I play RB primarily as solo drum tour, so unless the RB2 or GHWT Drums are THAT much better, I can't justify the additional purchase (even though I would love to! )
JackB1 wrote:
That post was regarding the PS3 version. My question was regarding the 360 version.
Ah, I apologize for not being clear there. I'm playing on the 360, but I can see how you'd assume it was ps3 given the warning of the compatibility issue I mentioned the paragraph before. Sorry!
No problems with rb1 drums on the 360.
JackB1 wrote:
Just to clarify...you are playing the GHWT game (drum parts) using your
RB1 drums? And this is on the 360?
Right!
The funny thing is all the clerks at 2 different Gamestops gave me a different answer. They said "All Guitar Hero stuff works with Rockband, but not the other way around". I know this was true before the new games came out, but I guess they think nothing changed. Thanks for setting the record straight. All this stuff can get a little confusing
matthewk wrote:Which game would you say does the better job of translating the guitar parts from what you would expect to play on a real guitar to the game? I know that 5 buttons can't accurately replace six strngs and frets, but in general I felt that the charts in GH3 made sense to what you would expect on a real guitar, other than the limited number of chords.
Hey Matt, here is what I was thinking of when I answered you originally. Penny-Arcade linked to this blog post that talked about how Harmonix makes their charts:
I talked with a Harmonix staffer about the process, and I was surprised to learn that the most important factor in the process is musicianship. The people responsible for note tracking, she told me, aim to reproduce the way that the song is played on a real guitar to the greatest extent possible within the confines of the guitar controller's limited repertoire of moves. If, in the real guitar, you would produce a sequence chords by keeping your index finger planted on a higher fret and moving your fingers on the lower frets, the note-trackers will mimic this hand movement on the guitar controller using the fret buttons. The same goes for passages that call for a guitar player to slide his hand up and down the neck of the guitar. She also told me another detail: the various chords on a guitar often have more than one set of fingerings, and a guitar player will usually choose among them based on the chords that surround them in that chord progression. The same line of thinking informs making the tracks in-game when the audio team works up a in-game note chart.
I thought that was pretty cool.
Nice link, Web, I thought that was a really interesting blog post. The writer was completely right about "Cherub Rock" in GH III -- when you get those chords right, it really feels like you're a virtua-Billy Corgan (especially if you have the sound just right). "Foreplay/Long Time" is another one that has a terrific note set that I never get tired of playing.
The thing pulling me towards the GH drum set is that appears they use one of the cymbals as a high hat, at least from looking at the set they seem to have it set up that way.
I haven't sat down at a real drum set in years, and back when I did I was just toying with our drummers set, not my own. But I am familiar with how real drums should be played, and the GH set just looks closer to what a real set would be like.
Maybe with the cymbals the RB set would better emulate a real set, but you still only have 5 colors, correct? So a cymbal hit could also be a pad hit?
matthewk wrote:The thing pulling me towards the GH drum set is that appears they use one of the cymbals as a high hat, at least from looking at the set they seem to have it set up that way.
I haven't sat down at a real drum set in years, and back when I did I was just toying with our drummers set, not my own. But I am familiar with how real drums should be played, and the GH set just looks closer to what a real set would be like.
Maybe with the cymbals the RB set would better emulate a real set, but you still only have 5 colors, correct? So a cymbal hit could also be a pad hit?
That is correct, Matt. The yellow cymbal is a high hat. For an open high hat, you simply hit it harder. Even for a non drummer like me, it's pretty darned intuitive.
I bought just the guitar and game and really like the new guitar, the neck fits together much tighter than the one from GH3, no super glue needed. Love the song selection so far with the classic rock bands such as the Eagles, Wings, Steely Dan, Steve Miller Band and CCR, stuff I grew up listening to.
vader29 wrote:I bought just the guitar and game and really like the new guitar, the neck fits together much tighter than the one from GH3, no super glue needed. Love the song selection so far with the classic rock bands such as the Eagles, Wings, Steely Dan, Steve Miller Band and CCR, stuff I grew up listening to.
Classic rock alright. Geez, very tempted to get the game.
vader29 wrote:I bought just the guitar and game and really like the new guitar, the neck fits together much tighter than the one from GH3, no super glue needed. Love the song selection so far with the classic rock bands such as the Eagles, Wings, Steely Dan, Steve Miller Band and CCR, stuff I grew up listening to.
Classic rock alright. Geez, very tempted to get the game.
Oh, there's a ton of good stuff like that in the game. There are alot of great songs in RB, but there's a ton of crap, too. I've not done any real crap yet in GH, although I'm sure it's there.
That being said, I'm at this point NOT going to buy GH:WT. I absolutely HATED GH3 and GH:A for the extra notes (aka "overcharting") and the ramped up difficulty killed me. I was acing Expert on GH1 and GH2 (made by Harmonix) and I've yet to beat GH3 on Expert (heck, can't even get to the final tier).
The fact that 20 or so songs on GH:WT are on RB and RB2 already, that others are coming as DLC (Blink-182's "Dammit" this week, for example) makes my choice comforting. Sure I'd love to play Tool, or Beat It, and a few others...but at this point, with over 100 downloaded songs, the easier Career interface, better store (individual tracks FTW), and the more inclusive feel (easier to pick up and play with noobs, friends, and family) make RB2 a no brainer.
Good to hear that the conversion to the RB instruments isn't that bad, however. At least if I cave and buy the disc only I won't feel gipped.
Just saw the funniest damn thing-I was playing a drum career, and the encore was 'Beat It'. So I'm playing along when the lead singer catches my eye, and I lost it. Here's this white rocker guy with long blonde hair and spikey leather clothing...doing the Michael Jackson dance from the video. And doing it very well! I eventually got my rhythm back, but that was hilarious...
Just an update to anyone that cares or may value my opinion. I am going to be selling my GHWT drums. They are just not for me. They don't work correctly in RB and I find them difficult to play. I can play some (not all) songs on hard in both games and find it easier to play with the RB drums. I will be finding a new way to dampen the sound. Either by buying the new drums or buying the GoodWood's mod for them.
The GHWT drums just don't feel right in RB and I can't play them worth a s*** in Guitar Hero. I am sure their is a learning curve there, but why learn it when it will only apply to one game.
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