First off, is there any noticable differences between NCAA on the 360 vs the PS3? I've read that the game runs at 60fps on the 360...does this hold true on the PS3? Is the game smoother on the 360?
Also, does EA render games in 1080p on the 360/PS3? My good friend (and very knowledgeable) wco81 explained that they do not, but the NCAA box indicates 720p/1080i/1080p. I assume the info on the box means the game will scale to display in 1080p but not actually render in 1080p. Is this accurate?
Today I spent about 4 hours in stores looking at HD TV's and the 360/PS3. Much to my dismay, I came away empty handed. Before I went shopping, I didnt plan on buying a TV but was fairly certain I would end up w/360 from Toys R Us - they were running a $50 instant gift card with the purchase of a 360 console.
Forgive my ignorance, but I somehow missed the fact that the 360 does not ship with an HD DVD drive. I don't know how I missed this... I guess I'm not as active in the gaming industry as I used to be. Anyway, I also missed the fact that other than the elite, the 360 does NOT offer an HDMI output. Now, does this really matter if the games I play (EA sports titles) are not rendered in 1080p? I understand that I'd need/use HDMI only if the content I'm viewing is rendered in 1080p.
On the surface the 360 seemed like a much better value, but since the price drop and my research today I'm stuggling to decide...
The 360 Core system seems like a waste of time (given the lack of a HardDrive and wireless controller) and the step up doesnt offer HDMI or HD DVD. I'm also concerned about the reliability of the 360. A sales associate I spoke to today said he has had 3 units die on him.
I primarily play sports titles and an occasional racer/shooter. Any suggestions?
Need a recommendation on a new console...
Moderators: Bill_Abner, ScoopBrady
Re: Need a recommendation on a new console...
The framerate isn't that much of an issue, but there are significant graphical differences between the two versions that favor the X360. The game is absolutely smoother on the 360, but if you only played the PS3 version you probably wouldn't notice especially if you had been playing EA football on next gen systems the past couple editions. It's only after playing the 360 version that you realize how good 60 fps can be. The PS3 version is fine to play, but it's certainly by far the last game I'd choose to show off the system.eman wrote:First off, is there any noticable differences between NCAA on the 360 vs the PS3? I've read that the game runs at 60fps on the 360...does this hold true on the PS3? Is the game smoother on the 360?
I can easily recommend a portable system to people (just talked my sister into a DS over the PSP), but recommending a home console is so tough. If you are an online gamer then I have to say go with X360. If you are patient and realize that this console is something you will be playing for the next 5 years and can wait a year or two for games, then I'd probably recommend the PS3. If you are a baseball nut then I would recommend the PS3 as you will have two choices over the remaining life of the exlusive deal. The only thing IMO that makes me discuss the X360 at all, since I'm on my 3rd, is the new warranty. I wouldn't touch one without it and was seriously considering dumping my 360 after my XBL ran out in December.
I would not gauge the capabilities of a system on an EA Sports game.
Not only are EA Sports games multiplatform, they're not known for pushing technology or art direction.
It would be like trying to determine if Ferrari or Lambourghini is faster by driving them in stop and go traffic over pothole-ridden streets.
There will be exclusive games on both systems which better demonstrate the capabilities of each system, including some PS3 games which are advertised to render in 1080p60.
The X360 is optimized more for 720p games because of the size of the embedded DRAM in the GPU. If I'm not mistaken, most of them will render at 720p (or less as in the case of PGR3) and then the internal scaler will output at up to 1080p.
That's not to say games rendered in 1080p60 will look better. Both systems are working with limited RAM and bandwidth. So a lot of developers have said they'd prefer the discretion to render at a lower resolution but with way more shading effects, better lighting than higher resolution but fewer effects.
The high-profile games which will be 1080p include Lair and GT5 Prologue (which will be a download I believe starting in October). Current 1080p games on the PS3 include Ridge Racer (doesn't look so great despite the higher resolution), Tekken 5 Dark Resolution (a downloadable game of the arcade which Namco re-wrote real quick in 1080p using presumably lower-polygon models than the upcoming Tekken 6) and GT HD (also a free download).
Even if a game is rendered in 1080p, there's no guarantee that even if you have a 1080p display, it will have exact 1:1 pixel translation, meaning the game is output directly to display without the scaler in the console or the one in the TV actually processing the signal.
But if sports games are your main focus, especially EA Sports games, the safe way to go in 2007 is the X360. Maybe next year, the PS3 versions will be 60 fps, maybe they won't.
I think X360 is stronger in shooters too, as a lot of shooters made for the PC are ported (and MS has made tools for porting between PC and X360 easier). You got huge shooter games like Halo and now Gears of War, in addition to upcoming ones like Bioshock (PC and X360 only) and COD4 (for all 3 systems).
I'm not a fan of shooters but the only notable shooters for the PS3 will be Unreal Tournament this fall (one particular reason appears to be that Sony will let user mods be traded freely, whereas Microsoft doesn't make it as easy). Supposedly, the PC and PS3 versions will be able to use mods created for either. Also, there is a chance the PS3 version will support mouse and keyboard, as the PS2 version of Unreal supposedly did.
Then of course, there is the infamous Killzone 2 as well.
But again, I think X360 is likely to get more PC shooters ported over, including those not so necessarily big name titles.
Not only are EA Sports games multiplatform, they're not known for pushing technology or art direction.
It would be like trying to determine if Ferrari or Lambourghini is faster by driving them in stop and go traffic over pothole-ridden streets.
There will be exclusive games on both systems which better demonstrate the capabilities of each system, including some PS3 games which are advertised to render in 1080p60.
The X360 is optimized more for 720p games because of the size of the embedded DRAM in the GPU. If I'm not mistaken, most of them will render at 720p (or less as in the case of PGR3) and then the internal scaler will output at up to 1080p.
That's not to say games rendered in 1080p60 will look better. Both systems are working with limited RAM and bandwidth. So a lot of developers have said they'd prefer the discretion to render at a lower resolution but with way more shading effects, better lighting than higher resolution but fewer effects.
The high-profile games which will be 1080p include Lair and GT5 Prologue (which will be a download I believe starting in October). Current 1080p games on the PS3 include Ridge Racer (doesn't look so great despite the higher resolution), Tekken 5 Dark Resolution (a downloadable game of the arcade which Namco re-wrote real quick in 1080p using presumably lower-polygon models than the upcoming Tekken 6) and GT HD (also a free download).
Even if a game is rendered in 1080p, there's no guarantee that even if you have a 1080p display, it will have exact 1:1 pixel translation, meaning the game is output directly to display without the scaler in the console or the one in the TV actually processing the signal.
But if sports games are your main focus, especially EA Sports games, the safe way to go in 2007 is the X360. Maybe next year, the PS3 versions will be 60 fps, maybe they won't.
I think X360 is stronger in shooters too, as a lot of shooters made for the PC are ported (and MS has made tools for porting between PC and X360 easier). You got huge shooter games like Halo and now Gears of War, in addition to upcoming ones like Bioshock (PC and X360 only) and COD4 (for all 3 systems).
I'm not a fan of shooters but the only notable shooters for the PS3 will be Unreal Tournament this fall (one particular reason appears to be that Sony will let user mods be traded freely, whereas Microsoft doesn't make it as easy). Supposedly, the PC and PS3 versions will be able to use mods created for either. Also, there is a chance the PS3 version will support mouse and keyboard, as the PS2 version of Unreal supposedly did.
Then of course, there is the infamous Killzone 2 as well.
But again, I think X360 is likely to get more PC shooters ported over, including those not so necessarily big name titles.
Guys, I can't thank you enough for the information. You've given me some things to consider...
I'm not as worried about each console's graphical upside as much as I am with the way each console handles the games I most enjoy playing...i.e. NCAA, Madden, APF etc. I brought up NCAA because that's a game I'll buy and play every year. Same goes for Madden... I don't want to purchase a PS3 if EA will struggle to make Madden/NCAA/NHL look/play as well as they do on the 360. But like Leebo said, since I havent played a next gen system/360 I probably wouldnt know any better. That said, I would know better!
Today I planned on getting the 360 until I learned about the lack of HDMI output (unless I selected an elite) and the lack of HD DVD playbachk. The HD DVD playback is important to my wife. Adding the $200's for the HD DVD playback capability really threw me... especially after learning the PS3 offers this std. I then looked closer at the PS3 and learned I can dual boot and put Linux on it, it has built-in wireless, a larger HD, HDMI onboard etc... I started to lean the other direction.
The fact that NCAA looks/plays smoother on the 360 is huge though... if I can find a stand alone HD DVD player for a reasonable cost I may stick with the 360.
Btw- is having an HDMI output really that important?
I'm coming from an Xbox and to be honest, I haven't bought many games other than NCAA, and the 2k series college BB game the last few years. I perferred Madden on the PC and I get my BB fix on the PC with HH 2004 + user mods. Most of my racing happens on my PC and I've always perferred Tiger on the PC.
I do know this... now that the consoles are offering HD resolutions I may start to move away from the PC as a gaming platform. In the past, I always preferred Madden @1600x1200 on my bright/clear computer monitor. Now those days are over...
I'm not as worried about each console's graphical upside as much as I am with the way each console handles the games I most enjoy playing...i.e. NCAA, Madden, APF etc. I brought up NCAA because that's a game I'll buy and play every year. Same goes for Madden... I don't want to purchase a PS3 if EA will struggle to make Madden/NCAA/NHL look/play as well as they do on the 360. But like Leebo said, since I havent played a next gen system/360 I probably wouldnt know any better. That said, I would know better!
Today I planned on getting the 360 until I learned about the lack of HDMI output (unless I selected an elite) and the lack of HD DVD playbachk. The HD DVD playback is important to my wife. Adding the $200's for the HD DVD playback capability really threw me... especially after learning the PS3 offers this std. I then looked closer at the PS3 and learned I can dual boot and put Linux on it, it has built-in wireless, a larger HD, HDMI onboard etc... I started to lean the other direction.
The fact that NCAA looks/plays smoother on the 360 is huge though... if I can find a stand alone HD DVD player for a reasonable cost I may stick with the 360.
Btw- is having an HDMI output really that important?
I'm coming from an Xbox and to be honest, I haven't bought many games other than NCAA, and the 2k series college BB game the last few years. I perferred Madden on the PC and I get my BB fix on the PC with HH 2004 + user mods. Most of my racing happens on my PC and I've always perferred Tiger on the PC.
I do know this... now that the consoles are offering HD resolutions I may start to move away from the PC as a gaming platform. In the past, I always preferred Madden @1600x1200 on my bright/clear computer monitor. Now those days are over...
You can probably find a Toshiba HD-DVD player for around $200 these days, with maybe 5 free movies.
This Christmas may be make or break for HD-DVD.
Toshiba is selling players for probably below cost so they have to really move a lot of movies this Holiday season if they're ever to get the same kind of studio support as Blu-Ray, which has exclusive support from Disney, Fox and Sony Pictures while only Universal Studios is exclusive on HD-DVD.
Thus far, Blu-Ray movies have outsold HD-DVD movies by a margin of slightly over 2 to 1. But the volumes are really small right now.
HDMI's benefits aren't fully realized yet. But you will either need HDMI or DVI with HDCP at some point if you always want to view Blu-Ray or HD-DVD movies in the high definition. The studios at some point have the option of turning on the Image Constraint Token (ICT). If ICT is turned on, then movies will only display like 540p I believe over component video connections.
The HD-DVD player for the X360 only has component video connections, no HDMI or DVI.
The other thing HDMI will give you is support for new lossless surround sound or uncompressed PCM sound on new 7.1 formats. People compare the difference between lossless/uncompressed versus the current Dolby Digital or DTS as the difference between a CD and an MP3 track.
So HDMI is more of a long-term, future-proofing thing.
As for EA Sports and 2K Games, maybe these games will be just as good on the PS3 or maybe they will never be this generation. There is no technical reason they can't be (or even better if they want to implement things like Havok physics, which the Cell processor is probably better equiped to run).
Whether EA or 2K will put the effort out on the PS3 versions remains to be seen. Like I said, I have lower expectations from sports games than other genres. I still play sports games more than any other genre but I'm also interested in action games too. It's the latter types of games which I expect to be real showcases for techology and art direction, as well as more immersive gameplay.
This Christmas may be make or break for HD-DVD.
Toshiba is selling players for probably below cost so they have to really move a lot of movies this Holiday season if they're ever to get the same kind of studio support as Blu-Ray, which has exclusive support from Disney, Fox and Sony Pictures while only Universal Studios is exclusive on HD-DVD.
Thus far, Blu-Ray movies have outsold HD-DVD movies by a margin of slightly over 2 to 1. But the volumes are really small right now.
HDMI's benefits aren't fully realized yet. But you will either need HDMI or DVI with HDCP at some point if you always want to view Blu-Ray or HD-DVD movies in the high definition. The studios at some point have the option of turning on the Image Constraint Token (ICT). If ICT is turned on, then movies will only display like 540p I believe over component video connections.
The HD-DVD player for the X360 only has component video connections, no HDMI or DVI.
The other thing HDMI will give you is support for new lossless surround sound or uncompressed PCM sound on new 7.1 formats. People compare the difference between lossless/uncompressed versus the current Dolby Digital or DTS as the difference between a CD and an MP3 track.
So HDMI is more of a long-term, future-proofing thing.
As for EA Sports and 2K Games, maybe these games will be just as good on the PS3 or maybe they will never be this generation. There is no technical reason they can't be (or even better if they want to implement things like Havok physics, which the Cell processor is probably better equiped to run).
Whether EA or 2K will put the effort out on the PS3 versions remains to be seen. Like I said, I have lower expectations from sports games than other genres. I still play sports games more than any other genre but I'm also interested in action games too. It's the latter types of games which I expect to be real showcases for techology and art direction, as well as more immersive gameplay.
I've seen side by side comparisons and the difference is there but it's subtle not that big a deal. It's not quite the gap between a standard TV and an HDTV.eman wrote:
Btw- is having an HDMI output really that important?
As far as the stand alone Xbox 360 HD-DVD player i've seen some on ebay with starting bids as low as $38. Here's a link for one with no bids starting at $50.
http://cgi.ebay.com/XBOX-360-HD-DVD-PLA ... dZViewItem
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Airdog
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe this year's Toshiba HD-DVD player that retails for that price does not output in 1080p. From the specs I've read it goes to 720p only.wco81 wrote:You can probably find a Toshiba HD-DVD player for around $200 these days, with maybe 5 free movies.
- Rob
PSN: smearobe
PSN: smearobe
It doesn't sound like you're a devoted gamer, and it also sounds like HD movies and 1080p output is important to you. Taking those factors into account, I would recommend the PS3.
1. More out of the box. The PS3 includes Blu-Ray for HD movies, media slots for instant access to photos etc., HDMI 1080p output, and built-in WiFi. Add HD movies, HDMI 1080p, and WiFi to a 360 and your at $777 (Elite plus WiFi at $99 plus HDDVD at $199).
2. Solid games. The PS3 will have a lineup very similar to the 360. You'll lose Halo, and gain Gran Turismo, Metal Gear etc. EASports and the like will appear on both, but MLB the SHOW will only be on the PS3, and it is absolutely the best baseball game ever made.
3. Reliability. I love a good warranty, but as Tommy Boy would say "why would someone put a pretty Guarantee on the box? because they know they sold you a guaranteed piece of s***!". That's not to say the 360 is a POS, it's a great system, but until 6 months from now when the modified units have fully saturated retail, I would be concerned about how much time,effort and aggravation I'd be putting in a year from now repairing the console.
4. Blu-Ray. Blockbuster's announcement, the endorsement of 4 out of 5 studios, Apple (my favorite company) and other signals seem to suggest that IF (and that's a big IF) there is to be a winner in the HD format wars, BluRay has the edge. I suspect both will eventually lose out to digital downloads, but we'll see.
That's it. I had a 360 and sold it after it died. My PS3 has been great and I have no regrets about my switch.
1. More out of the box. The PS3 includes Blu-Ray for HD movies, media slots for instant access to photos etc., HDMI 1080p output, and built-in WiFi. Add HD movies, HDMI 1080p, and WiFi to a 360 and your at $777 (Elite plus WiFi at $99 plus HDDVD at $199).
2. Solid games. The PS3 will have a lineup very similar to the 360. You'll lose Halo, and gain Gran Turismo, Metal Gear etc. EASports and the like will appear on both, but MLB the SHOW will only be on the PS3, and it is absolutely the best baseball game ever made.
3. Reliability. I love a good warranty, but as Tommy Boy would say "why would someone put a pretty Guarantee on the box? because they know they sold you a guaranteed piece of s***!". That's not to say the 360 is a POS, it's a great system, but until 6 months from now when the modified units have fully saturated retail, I would be concerned about how much time,effort and aggravation I'd be putting in a year from now repairing the console.
4. Blu-Ray. Blockbuster's announcement, the endorsement of 4 out of 5 studios, Apple (my favorite company) and other signals seem to suggest that IF (and that's a big IF) there is to be a winner in the HD format wars, BluRay has the edge. I suspect both will eventually lose out to digital downloads, but we'll see.
That's it. I had a 360 and sold it after it died. My PS3 has been great and I have no regrets about my switch.
Sport73
"Can't we all just get along? I'll turn this car around RIGHT now!"
"Can't we all just get along? I'll turn this car around RIGHT now!"